The Original CZ Forum
GENERAL => Ammunition, questions, and handloading techniques => Topic started by: sfrenchy on November 29, 2011, 09:43:45 PM
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Hey Wobbly....Was in Oroville Ca. today by chance and went by the RCBS Main Store......Started talking to a "salesman" there and couldn't leave without buying a couple of their "seconds". Walked out with a Rock Chucker kit and a Media seperator for less than any on-line prices I could find (minus any ship costs). As soon as I get some dies and shell holders. I'll be on my way. I can't say enough about what a great company RCBS is.....Stay tuned..Thanks for all your help...I'll need more
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I was really pleased with their customer service too.
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My first press was RCBS green, and after dealing with RCBS customer service a few times, I think all of my presses will be RCBS green. :) Great outfit.
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I started on a Rock Chucker in the late 70's myself. Those are great machines. With a monthly lube job you'll be giving that thing to your grand-children.
I agree with the thoughts on RCBS CS. My son bought a RCBS kinetic hammer years ago to take a part some old WWII ammo someone gave him. He screwed the cap on too tight and it busted in half. While I was on the phone with RCBS one day I mentioned the busted cap. Thought for sure they'd say, 'Well, you know it's plastic and only $15. We can sell you a new hammer.' But they didn't !! :o They sent a new cap free of charge. I was floored !!
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They've sent me parts for a press that I didn't pay for - it was a gift, and they insisted on replacing some small items, no charge. When I asked the lady at CS why, she said, "It says RCBS on the side." That's when I told her, "Ma'am, my next press will also say RCBS on the side!"
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When I asked the lady at CS why, she said, "It says RCBS on the side."
That settles it. I'm getting my wife a tattoo on her side that says "RCBS".
I'll tell her it stands for "Rub, Cuddle, and a Bunch of other Stuff". :D
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A tattoo that shows brand loyalty? Hows about THIS one? :D
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/Brandloyalty.jpg)
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Is that YOUR arm? Add the 2nd amendment on the other arm and your THERE.....
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A tattoo that shows brand loyalty? Hows about THIS one? :D
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/Brandloyalty.jpg)
(http://kickassfitnessuk.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/gauntlet1.jpg)
The gauntlet has been thrown... ;D
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Wife's calf, actually. ;)
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How's that for brand loyality? 8)
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That is a great Tat...............
I am a big fan of RCBS also. The dies are second to no ones and the Rock Chucker can make bullets for decades. Once you learn what works best for you, you will spend a lot of time infront of that little green machine. The only thing I don't like about the Rock Chucker is the spent primer system, which is just a little inconvienance at times.
I will de pirime and size about 500 and put them on a gallon baggy. Then I change dies and prime and bell that 500 and put them in a small bucket under my bench. then I clean and get another 500 ready to de prime and then I add powder and finish the bullets on as many of the 500 I have ready to go as I have time for that day. I just keep doing that so I always have a bunch of shells in every stage of the process. It works great for me. sometimes the buckets gets up to 1000 in it but I still always keep the front end filled too. When I take them out of the bucket and make bullets I can do about 200 - 300 per hour. Thats a nice pace. The machine is solid. It stays true through a very lot of pulls.
RCG
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I am a big fan of RCBS also. The dies are second to none and the Rock Chucker can make bullets for decades. The only thing I don't like about the Rock Chucker is the spent primer system, which is just a little inconvenience at times.
The handling of spent primers is slightly dated. Newer designs, like the Redding presses, send it all down through the center of the ram where it spills into a tube connected directly to a sealed container. All the smut and grunge, as well as the old primer, are collected in a tidy and hygienic manner. Plus, without all the grunge, the press and work area stays cleaner. That's the only thing I can fault the Rock Chucker on, and that's a personal preference more than anything.
Good find! Congrats. ;)
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Was in Oroville Ca. today by chance and went by the RCBS Main Store......Started talking to a "salesman" there and couldn't leave without buying a couple of their "seconds". Walked out with a Rock Chucker kit for less than any on-line prices I could find.
You know, reselling those yourself could net you some extra spending cash. Just $25 per week ends up being in excess of $1250 per year. Put in perspective, that's ~41,000 free primers. And you'd be helping out some of your buddies here on the Forum.
Hmmmmm. ;)
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That's a thought. I agree the spent primer system on my 1981 RCBS RS means about 1 in every 15 hits the floor, stopping everything for a dead primer search. Oh well. Discovered it works better with the priming arm removed, just need to build a chute from thin plastic that will slide in that spot.
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That's a thought. I agree the spent primer system on my 1981 RCBS RS means about 1 in every 15 hits the floor, stopping everything for a dead primer search. Oh well. Discovered it works better with the priming arm removed, just need to build a chute from thin plastic that will slide in that spot.
My RCSupreme has basically the same issue. If I could block the slot in the front for the priming arm it would probably work flawlessly.
Now if I could only train the operator to stop dropping live primers the process would speed up even more. :P
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Thank you RCG. With all of the reloaders here on the forum does calif law( if you live in that state) allow y'all to cast and reload? I mean just because of the powder and bulits you guys use. I have been wondering this for quite sometime. I just never had a opening like this to ask.
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I live in Ca. and I don't think there are any regulations to speak of (yet) concerning reloading....We can't buy a stainless 75B because it's not on the "approved list", but by God we can buy all the powder, primers, etc we want without a wait period or a background check or a DOJ license or an FFL or anything...(: makes a lot of sense doesn't it??? welcome to the coockoos nest that is ca. (I can't even buy your husband's 58, but I can buy enough powder to.....you get the picture....there is no common sense anymore) WOW-how did this simple thread get out of hand (:
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I don't think so. We are still talking about reloading. I had a feeling that I would get the answer that you posted sir. Thank you. Everything seemes so to-faced when it comes to CA laws. I was just wondering if there was a waiting peroid to by a press,powder,brass,lead etc. Come out to Arizona and live where you don't have to play the waiting game.
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Ditto, lots of room for good gun owners. Heck, miles of beach too! Just no bloody water... :P
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OK-Back to reloading-this has been a great thread for information. I am to assume if a bullet will "load" into the brass case without marring the bullet-it is better to go ahead and seat it without belling the case? Also-THANKS Wobbly for the info on overall cartridge length and how to find it properly-that helped alot.
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Another question: If 9mm Luger brass (9X19) can be trimmed down to be used in a 9MM Makarov (9X18)...Why can't they both use the same 355 dia. bullets? Or can they? Thanks
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Another question:What do you think of the RCBS "little dandy" powder measure? Is it accurate enough? Consistant? It seems like it would be the fast way to load powder.
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Thank you RCG. With all of the reloaders here on the forum does calif law( if you live in that state) allow y'all to cast and reload? I mean just because of the powder and bulits you guys use. I have been wondering this for quite sometime. I just never had a opening like this to ask.
No problem.....I really like Tats and I really like well done black ink. The letters are so perfect. I have seen many that try to say something but are illegable. Yours is a very fine job. The logo is simple and great and the choice of font and style is classic. I'd get thet Tat .......but my wife shoots a S&W at the range and carries a Kahr. My sons shoot Rugers. They will someday have some CZ's. So my family shoots together but I am the CZ contingent.
I am in MN and we can still buy components basically at will. Which is good because I will alot! Last year I loaded over 12,000 9mm rounds on my Rock Chucker. This year I will load more as I am shooting more often now. Which requires more practice, which ultimately requires even more rounds. I will get to 15,000 this year. I have 15,000 empty brass right now. It is a lot of work but it is very satisfying.
RCG
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Another question:What do you think of the RCBS "little dandy" powder measure? Is it accurate enough? Consistant? It seems like it would be the fast way to load powder.
I am not sure about the little dandy but the uniflow is amazingly accurate and cosistant. I truly believe if it says RCBS on it, it is a good item. The Uni Flow is 20 bucks more then the little Dandy I am not sure how the Little Dandy works but the Uni Flow is worth every penny it costs. Set it use it and you will find over time it is very consistant. i used to check every 10 or so when I was just starting our. Nervous you know. The gradually every 50 or so. Now I check every 100 when I start a new box and have never in the last 7,000 seen the scale be different.
RCG
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I am to assume if a bullet will "load" into the brass case without marring the bullet-it is better to go ahead and seat it without belling the case? Also-THANKS Wobbly for the info on overall cartridge length and how to find it properly-that helped a lot.
No, sir. The point is this: you want perfect taper crimping. This is a very fine adjustment usually only made once. But even with that, some people (Accountants, IRS agents, Occupy Wall St types, Correctional Officers :D) are too ham-fisted to get it right. For those few, they can seat with no belling.
Seating with no belling is the best way to find out what the diameter the TC should be. So it's simply good to know about.
;)
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Another question: If 9mm Luger brass (9X19) can be trimmed down to be used in a 9MM Makarov (9X18)...Why can't they both use the same 355 dia. bullets? Or can they?
You, Again ??
Because 9mm Makarov is NOT "9mm" !! :o
It's more like 9.2mm. But don't take my word, look it up in your reloading manual. ;)
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Another question:What do you think of the RCBS "little dandy" powder measure? Is it accurate enough? Consistant? It seems like it would be the fast way to load powder.
The Little Dandy is a fine measure. Before the era of electronic scales that would meter a known powder weight, this was probably one of the best powder measures for world class pistol shooting, like the Olympics.
Unfortunately, I would not recommend the Little Dandy for daily use, and here's why.... The Little Dandy is not infinitely adjustable. For each load, you have to purchase a new "measure rotor". So that means to get your load, you need to go to their powder sheet and hope that your powder is listed. If it says you need the #15 measure rotor, then you must purchase the #14, #15 and #16 at $13 each and hope one of them works. Every time you change your load or powder, you need to buy MORE measure rotors. Pretty soon your $39 powder measure has a collection of measure rotors worth $295 and climbing.
In your 5th year of reloading, when you know you always want to shoot 4.3gr of W231 with such-and-such bullet, then this is a great piece of equipment. When you are starting out and experimenting with loads and powders, this would be about as helpful as nailing one foot to the ceiling.
What you want is a really good, infinitely adjustable powder measure, that is set up for pistols. For single stage reloading, the best I can recommend is the RCBS UniFlow, with "pistol rotor" and a stand. There are several models of the Redding which are good for pistol. Also the Lyman #55 is worth mentioning. Typically you can pick up a good used measure on Ebay for ~$50. I think the older cast iron models are preferable to the modern aluminum versions.
;)
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Me love my Uniflow, no plans on changing. :)
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My Uniflow with the micrometer adjustment option seems pretty accurate.
I've been using Unique and I think the coarse flakes can affect throw to throw very slightly. A 10 throw average is always within .1 grains.
I'm going to get something finer and try it. I'll bet it will be dead on.
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some people (Accountants, IRS agents, Occupy Wall St types, Correctional Officers ) are too ham-fisted to get it right.
Wobbles....egad. THBBPT!
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My Uniflow with the micrometer adjustment option seems pretty accurate.
I've been using Unique and I think the coarse flakes can affect throw to throw very slightly. A 10 throw average is always within .1 grains.
I'm going to get something finer and try it. I'll bet it will be dead on.
The baffle will help, but to get dead-on with loads in the 4-5gr range you may need to decrease the bore diameter. The RCBS UniFlow "pistol" rotor is fine for 45 Colt and 44 Mag reloading, but still too big for Luger, 380 and 25ACP.
;)
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My Uniflow with the micrometer adjustment option seems pretty accurate.
I've been using Unique and I think the coarse flakes can affect throw to throw very slightly. A 10 throw average is always within .1 grains.
I'm going to get something finer and try it. I'll bet it will be dead on.
The baffle will help, but to get dead-on with loads in the 4-5gr range you may need to decrease the bore diameter. The RCBS UniFlow "pistol" rotor is fine for 45 Colt and 44 Mag reloading, but still too big for Luger, 380 and 25ACP.
;)
I believe I have the large drum and large UPM micrometer adjustment.
Since the device changes the way the powder is metered do you think it won't work?
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I believe I have the large drum and large UPM micrometer adjustment.
A small bore always give better accuracy. However, the small bore on the UniFlow is about 7/16 inch. If you are using the rifle rotor (which is about 11/16" bore) then a call to RCBS for the purchase of the pistol rotor is in order.
Since the device changes the way the powder is metered do you think it won't work?
Your statement is unclear as to which "device" you are referring... the rotor or the baffle. But neither device really "changes" anything, other than to help get better resolution in your settings. In other words, it's not a true 'change', it's more of a 'refinement'.
Probably 50% of the variation is simply operating technique. Rather than me guess at your issue, why not tell us your load, the diameter of the rotor piston, and describe your technique.
;)
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I believe I have the large drum and large UPM micrometer adjustment.
A small bore always give better accuracy. However, the small bore on the UniFlow is about 7/16 inch. If you are using the rifle rotor (which is about 11/16" bore) then a call to RCBS for the purchase of the pistol rotor is in order.
Since the device changes the way the powder is metered do you think it won't work?
Your statement is unclear as to which "device" you are referring... the rotor or the baffle. But neither device really "changes" anything, other than to help get better resolution in your settings. In other words, it's not a true 'change', it's more of a 'refinement'.
Probably 50% of the variation is simply operating technique. Rather than me guess at your issue, why not tell us your load, the diameter of the rotor piston, and describe your technique.
;)
I was referring to the micrometer adjustment device.
I haven't decided on a load yet.
Still in the testing stages, but all the charges are in the mid 5's to low 6's with 115 gr and 124 gr Berrys and Unique.
Have you seen the way the UPM works? Who said anything about a baffle? ???
I'll take the Uniflow apart and measure the bore.
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Hmm, been using the large drum for everything for years...just takes a fine hand in adjustment for 38 special and 9mm target loads. :)
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My Uni Flow is consistant and accurate and measures all types of powders very reliably. It measures the small grain type like Bullseye, the flakier type like Tite Group and the small rod type like N320 all consistantly the same charge after charge. I have loaded over 16,000 rounds all 4.5g or less. I check often and have had my loads tested. Never a problem. I guess I must be pretty lucky.
RCG
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I was referring to the micrometer adjustment device.
I haven't decided on a load yet.
Still in the testing stages, but all the charges are in the mid 5's to low 6's with 115 gr and 124 gr Berrys and Unique.
Have you seen the way the UPM works? Who said anything about a baffle? ???
I'll take the Uniflow apart and measure the bore.
(http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/s7_210593_999_01?rgn=0,0,841,129&scl=1.601904761904762&fmt=jpeg&id=0ySXoO8dHJrUSVR3tLUMT1)
Sheesh! I've read so many threads today I'm getting them crossed up. OK, the UPM. IMHO, it really doesn't add much in the way of adjustment refinement, but it does make it VERY easy to return to the same position setting. Far, far better for that than the stock RCBS piston.
5-6gr of Unique is the point where the small pistol piston should start doing you a great job.
PS. You will need a baffle if you don't have one. Click Here (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=uncle%20nicks%20powder%20baffle%20fabrication&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CB4QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.shootersforum.com%2Fattachments%2Fhandloading-equipment%2F10528d1320785845-powder-measures-powder_baffle_instructions_and_templates.pdf&ei=h4TdTvwLzrm2B73y5doF&usg=AFQjCNFcp2R_pnPyeF6MmC1a_SCIsDs_6Q&cad=rja)
;)
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Wobbly correct me if im wrong but the bar type powder measures....dillon and lyman imho seem to be the most consisent....hope I have'nt stirred up a hornets nest
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Correct me if I'm wrong but the bar type powder measures....Dillon and Lyman imho seem to be the most consistent....hope I haven't stirred up a hornets nest
Just my 2 cents, but....
? If the Lyman is more consistent it's because (in effect) the 3 chamber system allows for greater resolution over the piston type measures, like the RCBS, C-H and Redding. That is, you can make it so that you need to move the adjuster 3/8 inch to make a 1/10gr difference. That's why micrometer adjusters are so popular on piston type measures. When 1/10gr adjustment calls for 3/13th of a turn, it's really handy to have some indicator marks to make that possible.
? If the Dillon is more consistent, it's because all human error is removed. The Dillon measure is case activated and auto returning. No hands touch the mechanism, therefore each and every drop is just like the previous 100. It also doesn't hurt that the Dillon measure has an internal baffle.
As proof of this let me point out that the Hornady PM, as used on the Lock-N-Load AP, is a piston type measure, but because it's case activated the drops are highly consistent. You never hear anyone complain about the Hornady measure. IMHO that's because no one uses it in a free-standing manually operated mode, like they do the UniFlow.
So again I say there are accessories that will help the UniFlow, but the 'biggest bang for the buck' is to have owners of manual powder measures hone their own personal operating procedures.
;)