The Original CZ Forum
CZ LONG ARMS => CZ BREN => Topic started by: Type5 on October 29, 2018, 11:52:21 PM
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Last week, to my shock and amazement, I learned that some (300) Bren 2 pistols were imported.
According to one YouTube video these pistols were of the current Bren 2 Military design (except in pistol form). 5.56 and 7.62 x 39: 5.56 came in three lengths - 14, 11 and 8 inch barrels while the 7.62 x 39 came in 14, 11 and 9 inch barrels. Most information I've sourced says future Bren 2 imports will have different receivers for the American market that will allow different lengths of fore ends and accesories. True? I do not have any privileged sources of information - it it only the rummer mill. If anyone has more info, it would be fun hear it.
Anyhow, Coming late to the show, I was able to find a Bren 2 in 5.56 with an 11" barrel. I received it today.
Wow! I took my 805 pistol to compare, I sat with my dealer and did basic field strip on both comparing the pieces and assemblies.
Except for the possibility of some torx screws I don't think there is a single part that is interchangeable.
I am not a journalist, I do not write well. However, I do have a camera. The weather is supposed to be rainy tomorrow and my intention is to do some side by side component pictures to compare the two pistols.
I do not have a scale suitable for component weights. Let me say the Bren 2 is obviously lighter in the hand and more refined than my 805.
Anyhow, I will try to get some pictures up tomorrow - now I am going hunting for pistol brace for it.
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Currently, working to add photos and make notes. I did not have good lighting so I had to brighten most photos with software. My apology. I may try to re-photograph once it get some better light.
Both pistols have 11" barrels...
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00006.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00006.jpg.html)
Above, perspective is misleading, both are within a fraction on an inch of length
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00008.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00008.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00009.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00009.jpg.html)
Above, better perspective of length.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00007.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00007.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 Pistol is set up to take a buffer tube style pistol brace.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00025.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00025.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00008.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00008.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00005.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00005.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00027.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00027.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 is smaller in cross section.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00024.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00024.jpg.html)
Above, Butt Caps - Notice Bren 2 has retention pin and take down button/lever.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00023.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00023.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00022.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00022.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 bolt on right, it is shorter and has a lot less mass.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00021.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00021.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 bolt on right.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00016.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00016.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 bolt ia on top
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00015.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00015.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00013.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00013.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00012.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00012.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 trigger housing has retention pin too.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00010.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00010.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 on top
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00038.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00038.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 controls
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00034.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00034.jpg.html)
Above, Cleaning Kit - I think it is USA supplied.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00035.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00035.jpg.html)
Above, 2 multi tools in include carbon scrapers and 1 sight adjustment tool.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00033.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00033.jpg.html)
Above, open end wrenches work on flats on flash hider and gas block.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00032.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00032.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 has sling swivel on each side of rear of receiver, these are steel and are pressed into place.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00028.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00028.jpg.html)
Above, poor photo. Bren 2 is on right, the take away is it is smaller in cross section than the 805.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/DSC00040_1.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/DSC00040_1.jpg.html)
Above, Bren 2 trigger housing is near - completely different from 805 and better in my opinion. Suffers from too heavy of a trigger spring but they got rid of the flat spring in the 805. the Bren 2 trigger will be much easier to tune...
The manual for that came with the rifle is in many languages, it is dated August, 2017. The test target is dated 20 March, 2018.
I hope you will find these pictures interesting. This is a completely new firearm when compared to the 805. Bren 2 is much lighter, everything is scaled down. Going to be interesting to compare the 7.62 when it comes out.
Also, it will be interesting to see what happens with new Bren 2's if it is true that CZ-USA was not happy with this version.
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There is no such thing as a bad picture of a CZ Bren on this forum ;-)
You have done a fine service to the community. Thanks for sharing and keep em coming!
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By the way, the side by side comparison photos really show how the Bren 2 lost all the weight. If it were only so easy on humans....
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There is no such thing as a bad picture of a CZ Bren on this forum ;-)
You have done a fine service to the community. Thanks for sharing and keep em coming!
Thank you.
I am deciding on a pistol brace, I am anxious to shoot it. As far as I can tell, it will have to be shot as a pistol, no way to SBR it yet.
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By the way, the side by side comparison photos really show how the Bren 2 lost all the weight. If it were only so easy on humans....
Yes, I wish I was smaller in cross section too...
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Thanks for sharing and taking all those pics!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Very nice work, thank you! Much appreciated, indeed. I would love to find a BREN 2 to play with, but no time/money right now.
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Thanks for the side by side pictures. Really helps to see the comparison.
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Good evening. Here are some more photos of the Bren 2, 556, 11" Barrel. These pictures are a little better and they are of the pistol without the 805. Not sure of the size, I will have to post and see if they are too big and adjust and repost as needed.
These will be largely without comments. If you have questions, please post them and I will respond for a number of days after that...Thank you...
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5263.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5263.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5264.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5264.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5265.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5265.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5266.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5266.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5267.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5267.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5268.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5268.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5269.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5269.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5270.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5270.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5271.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5271.jpg.html)
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(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5277.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5277.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5278.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5278.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5279.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5279.jpg.html)
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(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5285.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5285.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5287.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5287.jpg.html)
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(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5289.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5289.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5290.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5290.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5291.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5291.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5294.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5294.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5295.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5295.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5296.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5296.jpg.html)
Above: notice the 3 gas regulator settings.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5297.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5297.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5299.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5299.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5301.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5301.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5302.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5302.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5303.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5303.jpg.html)
Above: Notice the m-locks and each torx looks like it has blue washer or something under it - it is too uniform for me to think that that each has a perfect dab of Locktite.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5304.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5304.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5306.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5306.jpg.html)
Above: I do not know what these markings mean
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5307.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5307.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5308.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5308.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5309.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5309.jpg.html)
Above: I have not seen any pictures of receivers with the swivels. I talked to CZ-USA today about getting a spare rear buffer tube adapter. He told me they have no spare parts (what about MIL/LE ?). He said The 300 units that were imported were from a Foreign Contract. He gave no more details but maybe that is why these receivers have the swivels and nothing else I've seen does.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5312.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5312.jpg.html)
Above, Rear swivel from the inside.
I hope I can shoot this someday....
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Hear are some more photos. I investigated and tried to change a pretty heavy first stage trigger pull. Ultimately I was not successful but I know what to do - I just need some parts. Someone will probably make trigger springs for this, like the Scorpion, to reduce pull - it is pretty heavy.
The other thing that could use some after market help is the bolt hold open button in the trigger guard. It is not very handy, at least for me. I have to release my grip and push it all the way up to where it is flush, I mean really flush. using the tip of my index finger. If the control began by extending a litter further down, it would be so much better.
Parts are not available yet, according to CZ-USA and so I do not want to mess with much until I can unscrew something I screw up...just my thoughts.
About the first stage of the trigger: the trigger spring is similar to and AR spring in design - by the photos they are not close to the same in dimension.
I have a friend who is a FFL-SOT, I am going to have him look at it and see if he knows of anything that may substitute. Once against the sear the trigger seems to break very cleanly. I don't have a Scorpion yet - I may go yo the HBI Industry web sight and see if the trigger spring they offer looks like it could work.
Anyhow, here are some more pictures, note on a few of them:
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5328.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5328.jpg.html)
Above: AR spring is in fore ground, Bren 2 spring is a beast!
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5326.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5326.jpg.html)
Above: Notice Safety Levers
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5324.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5324.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5330.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5330.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5335.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5335.jpg.html)
Abpve, Moved some pins out of the way so the assembled trigger components could be dropped in place.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5333.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5333.jpg.html)
Above: Trigger housing pin has retention spring, it can be reversed
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5331.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5331.jpg.html)
Above, magazine well sleeve for 5.56 can be removed to accept 7.62 x 39 magazine - I can only assume conversions will follow. CZ-USA web sight says only 5.56 and 7.62 x 39 are planned at this time.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5332.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5332.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5337.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5337.jpg.html)
Above: Forgot to mention the night sights. they do not glow on their own, once they are charged by shining a light on them, they are bright for a while but dwindle to nothing in a while.
I just went to the HBI Web Site - the Scorpion spring is a no go...
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Thank you for taking the time to post these pictures. They are great and shows a lot of details!
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Great Job!
Only bad part of seeing all of the pictures is it makes it harder to NOT have one.
Enjoy and hit us with a range report!
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I need a Bren 2 in my life.
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I need a Bren 2 in my life.
A friend of mine told me that anything worth owning was worth owning two or more of. He is a millionaire and can afford such things.
I am anxious to see what CZ-USA has planned for the 2019 imports as they did not like the configuration of the 300 imported this year. I?d love to have Bren 2 folding/collapsing stock - Oh God, I feel another purchase coming!
Hope you can get one soon - you will not be disappointed!
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Thanks for the write-up......luv to have but my state will probably have them banned by the time the carbine arrives....really leaning 5.56 but its a wait and see if the import rumors of x39 are indeed true.....regardless me wants
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Many thanks for all the great pictures. Wonderful to read and very helpful in understanding the details of the new model. I particularly like analyzing the new non-reciprocating charging handle, bolt carrier and gas system design.
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very nice...thanks for all the pics and info. is it possible to buy the factory stock for the bren 2 yet and SBR it?
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Many thanks for all the great pictures. Wonderful to read and very helpful in understanding the details of the new model. I particularly like analyzing the new non-reciprocating charging handle, bolt carrier and gas system design.
You are welcome!
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very nice...thanks for all the pics and info. is it possible to buy the factory stock for the bren 2 yet and SBR it?
CZ-USA says they currently have no parts for the Bren 2 - I wonder if they have parts for Mil/LE? Nevertheless, no parts are currently available.
I have some feelers out but nothing yet - as far as factory stocks.
Here are a couple of pictures of my intermediate solution. I just can not do the AR tube deal - just can not...
I ordered a replacement SBT805 brace for my 805.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5437.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5437.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5439.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5439.jpg.html)
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That really begs for a VFG with such a short handguard. Alas, the NFA. Maybe a backwards AFG/AFG2 will work okay...
Someone will likely make an extended option, just like RS Regulate w/ Galils...
805 brace looks low insofar as cheek weld/sight alignment goes. Is that the case?
Otherwise impressed, and thanks for the photos!
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Nice!
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That really begs for a VFG with such a short handguard. Alas, the NFA. Maybe a backwards AFG/AFG2 will work okay...
Someone will likely make an extended option, just like RS Regulate w/ Galils...
805 brace looks low insofar as cheek weld/sight alignment goes. Is that the case?
Otherwise impressed, and thanks for the photos!
I just compared them: when the rails are lined up the Bren 2 brace is about 1/8" higher - they are very close...
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CZ-USA says they currently have no parts for the Bren 2 ....... I just can not do the AR tube deal - just can not...
The Bren 2 stock is cool but the gun itself is marketed globally to accept the homegrown stock as well the AR stock. This is a brilliant marketing angle on this gun as opposed to the 805 which is a bit more limited. I think the AR stock option looks perfectly fine and is more versatile than the CZ stock simply because there are so many AR stock variants and options.
I think the ERGO F7 or an HK 416 stock would be really great.
(http://i.imgur.com/M0IwK3gl.jpg)
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Every one knows the AR is the best rifle ever made and nothing will ever be better - not even worth looking at anything new - ever. This can be read across the Internet. This kind of thought came to prominence during the time of the assault weapon ban when it was difficult to get foreign stuff imported.
I spent 10 years yearning to drink from another cup, knowing there was a lot more to drink than 100% pure AR koolade.
Now I have 8 AR?s, they sit in the safe, must have an inch of dust on them now, will have to dust them later - but waiting for the dust to accumulate to 2? first. For me, and I speak only for myself, AR?s are boring and there is nothing imaginative about them any more.
So when I think about the Bren, am I thinking there are lots of ways to skin a cat - how did this arms maker do it and why did they do it the way they did? What did they change from the 805 and why? I have similar thoughts each time I look at IWI, FN, Beretta and B&T - different minds - fine minds - different solutions.
I love the technology and evolution of firearms especially military types. I appreciate that CZ brought Bren 2 to us and I understand why they put the AR type adapter on it. However, it would have been better to do something else besides the AR thing but that was their choice, fine.
My choice was to make mine less AR-ish and wait for Bren 2 stocks and SBR it as compliance parts come to market. Yes, I?d like mine to look as much like the vision CZ had for this pistol/rifle.
Adding AR stuff is not for me but if someone else wants to AR the Bren 2 platform up to bring it closer to ?AR Perfection? then I say God bless them,it is their weapon. But each time I see a non-AR with an AR stock I avert my eyes.
I bought my 4th CZ, I want a Bren 2 stock on it and if some one made a DI kit for a Bren 2 to move closer to ?perfection? Is no soone do that than add an AR brace/stock.
Again, bless those that have a different idea, really, I just want mine as close to how it envisioned by its creators.
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Here are a couple of pictures of my intermediate solution. I just can not do the AR tube deal - just can not...
I ordered a replacement SBT805 brace for my 805.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5437.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5437.jpg.html)
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z303/type5/IMG_5439.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/type5/media/IMG_5439.jpg.html)
Wait, does that mean the 805 adapters and braces fit on the Bren 2? An ACR stock would be amazing on this thing with the Sandline/Mississippi Arms adapter.
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Every one knows the AR is the best rifle ever made and nothing will ever be better - not even worth looking at anything new - ever. This can be read across the Internet. This kind of thought came to prominence during the time of the assault weapon ban when it was difficult to get foreign stuff imported.
I spent 10 years yearning to drink from another cup, knowing there was a lot more to drink than 100% pure AR koolade.
Now I have 8 AR?s, they sit in the safe, must have an inch of dust on them now, will have to dust them later - but waiting for the dust to accumulate to 2? first. For me, and I speak only for myself, AR?s are boring and there is nothing imaginative about them any more.
So when I think about the Bren, am I thinking there are lots of ways to skin a cat - how did this arms maker do it and why did they do it the way they did? What did they change from the 805 and why? I have similar thoughts each time I look at IWI, FN, Beretta and B&T - different minds - fine minds - different solutions.
I love the technology and evolution of firearms especially military types. I appreciate that CZ brought Bren 2 to us and I understand why they put the AR type adapter on it. However, it would have been better to do something else besides the AR thing but that was their choice, fine.
My choice was to make mine less AR-ish and wait for Bren 2 stocks and SBR it as compliance parts come to market. Yes, I?d like mine to look as much like the vision CZ had for this pistol/rifle.
Adding AR stuff is not for me but if someone else wants to AR the Bren 2 platform up to bring it closer to ?AR Perfection? then I say God bless them,it is their weapon. But each time I see a non-AR with an AR stock I avert my eyes.
I bought my 4th CZ, I want a Bren 2 stock on it and if some one made a DI kit for a Bren 2 to move closer to ?perfection? Is no soone do that than add an AR brace/stock.
Again, bless those that have a different idea, really, I just want mine as close to how it envisioned by its creators.
Yep, couldn't agree more. AR stocks on AR's, works for me. But not ever rifle is an AR. Have an ACR stock on my 805 and hope that there will be one available for the Bren 2 at some point.
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Here are a couple of pictures of my intermediate solution. I just can not do the AR tube deal - just can not...
I ordered a replacement SBT805 brace for my 805.
Wait, does that mean the 805 adapters and braces fit on the Bren 2? An ACR stock would be amazing on this thing with the Sandline/Mississippi Arms adapter.
The rear heads are not interchangeable between Bren 2 and 805. You can examine the pictures closely. Milled off the rear of the Bren 2 Rear Head and the front of the Rear Head from the SBT805 brace and joined the 2 flat surfaces. It works well but I will be happy to set it aside for an actual Bren 2 stock and some compliance parts. It is a good intermediate solution.
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Every one knows the AR is the best rifle ever made and nothing will ever be better - not even worth looking at anything new - ever. This can be read across the Internet. This kind of thought came to prominence during the time of the assault weapon ban when it was difficult to get foreign stuff imported.
I spent 10 years yearning to drink from another cup, knowing there was a lot more to drink than 100% pure AR koolade.
Now I have 8 AR?s, they sit in the safe, must have an inch of dust on them now, will have to dust them later - but waiting for the dust to accumulate to 2? first. For me, and I speak only for myself, AR?s are boring and there is nothing imaginative about them any more.
So when I think about the Bren, am I thinking there are lots of ways to skin a cat - how did this arms maker do it and why did they do it the way they did? What did they change from the 805 and why? I have similar thoughts each time I look at IWI, FN, Beretta and B&T - different minds - fine minds - different solutions.
I love the technology and evolution of firearms especially military types. I appreciate that CZ brought Bren 2 to us and I understand why they put the AR type adapter on it. However, it would have been better to do something else besides the AR thing but that was their choice, fine.
My choice was to make mine less AR-ish and wait for Bren 2 stocks and SBR it as compliance parts come to market. Yes, I?d like mine to look as much like the vision CZ had for this pistol/rifle.
Adding AR stuff is not for me but if someone else wants to AR the Bren 2 platform up to bring it closer to ?AR Perfection? then I say God bless them,it is their weapon. But each time I see a non-AR with an AR stock I avert my eyes.
Count me out of ?everybody? because the AR is not the best ever, etc. (sarcasm I am assuming) They are a good gun but I prefer any AK patterned rifle over an AR any day of the week. So much so I have ARs in 7.62x39, 5.45x39 and 7.62N and why I was so excited about the 806 is x39. I would have loved an 805 in that caliber. So it has nothing to do with AR perfection because there is no such thing. Furthermore the Bren is a piston drive as are AKs and if the AR is so perfect why is there such a huge emphasis on piston drive ARs?
The Bren 1&2, and SAN SIG and the B&T APCs and the Galil ace?s far out class the AR and the Bren design will IMO be the optimal design future wise. It is just more modern and versatile but I can?t put any of those other stocks on a Bren without major mods. The AR modern stock options are many and comfortable as well as it takes 2 seconds to put one on. The modularity of the Bren is what makes it so unique and why it is what it is. Personally, I would like a B&T for my Bren. Just like on my APC and that would fit with your brace mod. I?ll probably get a CZ stock when they become available and use it on that has been SBR?ed.
Be that as it may, I will agree with you that I could never stomach an AR stock on an AK. To me there is just no need but the latest Russian AKs that the military is using have AR type stocks them. So it seems even the Russkies prefer them.
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DDNC, yes there was a bit of sarcasm in that remark! LOL!
I also have an APC223 Pistol with the B&T retractable brace/stock and a tailhook mod 1 and the SB Tactical Brace.
I have not acquired the B&T solid polymer stock yet but it should be able to bolt right into the SB Tactical brace making it a stock on the Bren 2 or 805 - until you mentioned it, I had not thought about going the other way - wondering how it would line up with the ejection port on the CZ?s.
I?m sure someone is going to make parts that allow lots of stock options. Bren 2 is going to do well in the market - it is very exciting!
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The rear heads are not interchangeable between Bren 2 and 805. You can examine the pictures closely. Milled off the rear of the Bren 2 Rear Head and the front of the Rear Head from the SBT805 brace and joined the 2 flat surfaces. It works well but I will be happy to set it aside for an actual Bren 2 stock and some compliance parts. It is a good intermediate solution.
bleep, you got my hopes up. Agreed, hopefully we see the compliance parts so companies can start tooling up proper stock adapters. Also, the Bren 2 BR stocks look great, wouldn't mind having that instead of the ACR too. I've seen some military Bren 2s with that stock, so it should be compatible.
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AR stocks belong on ARs. ARs are great sure but one of their limitations is they have a tube sticking out the back with a big spring in it. Why put a tube stock on a gun that doesn?t need a tube with a big spring in it? That?s why people hated the Sig 556 when it came out.