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CZ LONG ARMS => CZ BREN => Topic started by: Psyop96 on January 23, 2022, 06:50:02 PM

Title: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Psyop96 on January 23, 2022, 06:50:02 PM
It’s Christmas in January for the 72nd Mech Bn of the Czech army. They have received their initial stock of these designated marksman rifles. Altogether, the line units will receive 350 units of these plus optics and accessories by the end of the year. These replace the Dragunovs. Photos posted by the Bn.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220123/0534cec05a70d1c0da5733257ecad277.jpg)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220123/743120872f15ffacf007a3901fcada30.jpg)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220123/5d079ceea20f020a5459fd5bfc3aeef2.jpg)


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Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on January 23, 2022, 07:21:05 PM
Holy Cow. Thanks for the pics!!
Hopefully theyll start making their way over here.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: armoredman on January 24, 2022, 02:22:17 AM
That's sweet...now where IS mine... 8) ;D
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: MeatAxe on January 24, 2022, 12:39:37 PM
CZ needs to fix and fully support their x39 Bren 2 before I’d buy another one.
Title: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Psyop96 on January 24, 2022, 01:34:34 PM
That's sweet...now where IS mine... 8) ;D
The way things are developing, it’ll be waiting for you on the new Eastern Front [emoji3]. The Czechs are ready to deliver surplus 152mm shells to the Ukrainian army. Seriously though, that will be something crazy to happen over there.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: j102 on January 24, 2022, 02:47:51 PM
Very nice! Thanks for sharing the pictures.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 24, 2022, 02:49:41 PM
I'm interested in the muzzle device and handguard, as both seem different from the standard Bren 2 BR.

Short video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaDIcGqdqgY
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 24, 2022, 02:53:37 PM
And article (in Czech):

https://www.czdefence.cz/clanek/armada-prebrala-cz-bren-2-pps?utm_source=www.seznam.cz&utm_medium=sekce-z-internetu
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 24, 2022, 10:26:15 PM
Another video (on the Czech Army's Facebook page):

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=352453943388480

Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: armoredman on January 26, 2022, 04:45:37 AM
Nice! Now, we can all hope together that BREN 2 production will begin in the US soon, if the political landscape changes.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on January 26, 2022, 06:38:34 AM
Pretty neat how the BR Stock matches the magwell of the BR rifle.
Just like the Waffle Stock matches Bren .556 pistol and Carbines.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: gasxsnake on January 27, 2022, 10:33:07 AM
I wish it's better than 2MOA...
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 27, 2022, 05:14:23 PM
If we knew how many shots were used to make those groups, we'd get a better picture of true and practical accuracy.  HK give the accuracy of the G28 as sub-1.5 MOA, but that's for a 10+ shot group.  5 shot groups are easily half that for the G28 and the MR308/MR762. 

Point being that the more shots to a group, the more it'll probably open up.  If the Bren 2 PPS did 2 MOA with a 10+ shot group, I'd consider that respectable for a DMR/battle rifle.

Besides, it shoots better than the SVDs it's replacing, which are probably fairly ancient and whose optics aren't as good as what's available for the PPS Bren 2.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on January 28, 2022, 09:57:55 AM
Yup. That's an excellent point on how a group can open up between 5 and 10 shots. 
Quick question, are the CZ Bren 2 Ms barrels Chrome Lined?
And, were the Original 805 Bren S1 & Ps1 Chome Lined as well?
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 28, 2022, 04:15:34 PM
IIRC, all commercial Brens have/had chrome lined barrels (also CHF), and I believe the Bren 2 BR and PPS have CHF/CL barrels.  I believe that other modern self-loading sniper/DMR rifles like the SCAR 20 HPR and the HK G28 have chrome lined barrels that are cold hammer forged.  That seems to be the general industry standard, even for precision self loaders.

Granted, I think that the MR762s here in the US can be had with or without chrome lined barrels.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on January 28, 2022, 09:31:28 PM
Thank you for that info.
Also, how many rounds would you guess the Bren 2 Ms with the 8" barrel would be good for, also the Bren 805 Ps1 with the 11.5" barrel
I'm guessing quite a lot considering they are chrome lined?
I shouldve just asked about barrel longevity for the 8" and 11.5"
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on January 29, 2022, 04:18:40 PM
Not sure what CZ rates their barrels for, but I know that HK and FN rate their 5.56mm barrels for up to 15-20K rounds before they ought to be replaced.  Granted, M4s with button rifled barrels (chrome lined) are normally replaced before 10,000 rounds, and even then they still often produced very respectable groups.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on January 29, 2022, 11:19:52 PM
Not sure what CZ rates their barrels for, but I know that HK and FN rate their 5.56mm barrels for up to 15-20K rounds before they ought to be replaced.  Granted, M4s with button rifled barrels (chrome lined) are normally replaced before 10,000 rounds, and even then they still often produced very respectable groups.
Thank you for that info.
I got to digging around a bit and saw where a fellow on this forum had 19,000 rounds thru his 805 S1 with no malfunctions and no inherent loss of accuracy.
Sounds like CZ barrels which are Cold Hammer Forged and Chrome Lined are like that of FN and HK. Awesome barrels.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Psyop96 on January 30, 2022, 04:28:57 PM
Nightforce ATACR 1-8x24 F1(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220130/af8661422ab11dcc0750b2525d45fc3e.jpg)
 


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Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Aries144 on January 31, 2022, 08:08:14 PM
I'd recommend you focus on group size. When group size becomes unacceptable, that barrel is dead. For me, when groups get beyond 4 MOA or so, that barrel is no longer useful for my purposes.

If a barrel starts out at 3.5 MOA, it won't be good for too many thousands of rounds before it exceeds 4 MOA. If it starts out at 0.5 MOA, it will probably last a long time.

You can probably expect between 10,000 and 30,000 rounds out of a decent 5.56 barrel before rounds start keyholing. Less if you get the barrel hot. Much less if you get the barrel hot shooting steel jacketed ammo.

I've had a cold hammer forged, chrome-lined 5.56 barrel exceed my accuracy requirement of 4 MOA in only 6-7,000 rounds. Somewhere around 6k rounds, it jumped from 2.5 MOA to over 6. I shot 55gr Wolf and Barnaul steel case almost exclusively.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: MeatAxe on January 31, 2022, 10:01:50 PM
I'd recommend you focus on group size. When group size becomes unacceptable, that barrel is dead. For me, when groups get beyond 4 MOA or so, that barrel is no longer useful for my purposes.

If a barrel starts out at 3.5 MOA, it won't be good for too many thousands of rounds before it exceeds 4 MOA. If it starts out at 0.5 MOA, it will probably last a long time.

You can probably expect between 10,000 and 30,000 rounds out of a decent 5.56 barrel before rounds start keyholing. Less if you get the barrel hot. Much less if you get the barrel hot shooting steel jacketed ammo.

I've had a cold hammer forged, chrome-lined 5.56 barrel exceed my accuracy requirement of 4 MOA in only 6-7,000 rounds. Somewhere around 6k rounds, it jumped from 2.5 MOA to over 6. I shot 55gr Wolf and Barnaul steel case almost exclusively.


This is the continuing problem with CZ, though. There are no spare barrels available now, along with the general shortage of critical parts for the Bren 2 platform.

Replacement Barrels of different lengths and different calibers (say 6.5 Grendel, for example) would sure be nice, but so far, CZ has not obliged. Hopefully, some enterprising soul in the aftermarket will fill the void.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on February 01, 2022, 08:59:28 AM
Has the top brass at CZ said anything about the overall lack of support? Have they even acknowledged it?
If so, Have they said anything about when they will address it?
I'm really curious about this.
Thanks.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on February 07, 2022, 02:03:15 PM
Even better videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHonIMzM3Vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yttm7WIZTd4
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: the gman on February 17, 2022, 08:52:16 AM
I like the Bren but is it wrong to wish some of the surplus Draganov's could come over here?  O0
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Barn Owl Lover on February 20, 2022, 06:57:51 PM
New photos, including some of the guts of the PPS:

https://4brn.army.cz/?p=3025
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Psyop96 on February 26, 2022, 08:09:05 AM
I like the Bren but is it wrong to wish some of the surplus Draganov's could come over here?  O0
Not surprisingly, there go the surplus Dragunovs….

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220226/0b7428f24dbdc3196e473d29169fce70.jpg)


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Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: AF FAL on March 18, 2023, 09:18:59 PM
The Chamber is chrome lined, the bore is not.
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: MeatAxe on March 18, 2023, 10:15:55 PM
I like the Bren but is it wrong to wish some of the surplus Draganov's could come over here?  O0
Not surprisingly, there go the surplus Dragunovs….

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220226/0b7428f24dbdc3196e473d29169fce70.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


LOL

I guess the US SVD autists are going to scream bloody murder over that! Don’t fear, B&T has taken over US importation of the Hungarian SVD @ $6,500 a pop! Not bad for a 3 moa commie “sniper” rifle — if you’re selling!!
Title: Re: Bren 2 PPS (7.62x51) delivered to Czech military
Post by: Brenfan on March 20, 2023, 07:49:36 AM
Not surprisingly, there go the surplus Dragunovs….

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220226/0b7428f24dbdc3196e473d29169fce70.jpg)

LOL

I guess the US SVD autists are going to scream bloody murder over that! Don’t fear, B&T has taken over US importation of the Hungarian SVD @ $6,500 a pop! Not bad for a 3 moa commie “sniper” rifle — if you’re selling!!
[/quote]

Lol, wow!! Only $6,500 for a out of date 3 moa rifle!!
Man, that's just ridiculous