The Original CZ Forum
CZ PISTOL CLUBS => Compact CZ 75s => Topic started by: Ron IL on January 18, 2023, 11:01:47 AM
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Yesterday I picked up my new P01. When I got home and was cleaning it I found out it was the Omega. It wasn't on the tag that was on the gun. It didn't look like it had been fired. Sold as a used gun. I got it cleaned up and took it to the range and put a little over 100 rounds through it. I used three different loads I made up. It didn't seem to like the 147 grain loads. They shot too high. I had some 135 gr loaded with Unique and 231. It liked the 231 the best which my other 9's like too. It cycled great. It shot the group about 1" to the right at 7 and 25 yards. When I got home and cleaned it up I noticed the rear sight was not centered. So I moved it slightly and will shoot it again today off of a rest. I got a little trigger slap off of it. I noticed the roll pin for the firing pin looked like it has been hammered on and thought maybe someone had been messing with it unless that was the assembly from the factory. After cleaning it up I tested the trigger pull and is 4 lb 5 oz consistent pull and no gritty feeling. Really nice. I use CCI primers and the ones I used are small rifle. The firing pin only left a little indent in the primer but fired every one just fine. I ordered a new extended firing pin and retaining pin and some punches. When that all comes in I will pull the pin and see what is in the gun. When I got the gun the grease in it was thick and sticky like it was pretty old. I had to use a punch to get the lever lock out of it to pull the slide. I cleaned it up and put fresh oil on it. So far I like it a lot. A few years ago I bought a 75B off of a guy at the range. Super trigger but after a mag or two the trigger would not reset. It had had a trigger job. I could clean it and it did the same thing. He bought it back off of me. That was the only CZ I have owned before. On this one the serial number is on the frame, barrel, and slide. It starts with G and on the slide there is a little triangle and 22. I think I saw that was when it was made.
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Went back today and fired 30 rounds. I took my metal rest along and used it. The shots looked to be centered good. Had to use 6 o'clock hold. I was hitting small tree leaves on the 25 yard berm. I will shoot at the paper targets after I get it working good. I had two that didn't fire. No firing pin imprint on primer at all. Ran them through again and fired OK. When my firing pin and punches show up I will pull it to see what size it is. If it is a short one I will swap it out and clean out the firing pin channel. If it is a long one I may have to look into a stouter hammer spring.
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Pull the hammer spring first. That's the most likely change as it affects the trigger pull.
On the P01 with the lanyard loop, it's also the easiest to change. The extension provided by the loop means you can push on any flat surface and extract the spring.... other than removing the grips... no tools needed.
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Sounds like the firing pin retaining pin might be damaged and something is going on in the firing pin channel.
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My 9MM CZs don't like 147's either. None of the ammo I'd loaded for the other pistols (XDM/M&P) with lead, plated, or hollow points (three different powders, too) shoot worth a darn in my CZs.
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I purchased a PO1 Omega a few months back. I’m enjoying shooting and carrying it daily. It will misfire occasionally using small rifle primers but not often enough to be an issue. Maybe one out of every 100+ rounds. I primarily use small rifle primers.
My firing pin return spring is extremely heavy. Much more so than on my 1911s. I’ve thought about ordering a reduced power return spring. I wonder if any issues would develop if I did that. I don’t see any, especially since it has a firing pin block. With a lighter firing pin return spring, I believe it would be 100% reliable.
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Just one or two failures in 150 isn't bad for a range gun to have a super trigger. Then I can practice my double action. My hammer spring is not blue. So maybe a 11.5 # spring. A 4 1/2 lb trigger is super to me. The double action was over the 12 # max on my Lyman checker. A couple times I got 11 1/2 lbs but mostly out of range. A good thing about this gun is that you can fix it. I am going to like it a lot.
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I noticed last night dry firing it that it seemed easier. This morning I put my tester on it and about 15 pulls the average is 4 lb 1 oz. A lot of 3 lb 14 oz. Maybe settling in or getting that old sticky lube out of it. My only complaint on it is the slide is so small it is hard to grip it to pull it back. I just lock the hammer back and it is a lot easier. Just not much grip area. It might become a problem when I get old. It is a lot easier if I use the method I saw once where you hold the slide steady and move the frame. It is a decocker which I like. In the box is an extra set of ambi levers in a little plastic bag that is a lot slimmer. I don't know what came in the gun new. Maybe the slimmer ones were in it new and they changed it out to the slightly wider ones to make it easier to operate. I haven't seen another one in a store to look at.
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The Omega pistols I've bought came out of the box with the decocker levers installed and the safeties in the little bag.
Not hard to change out. Instructions are in the owner's manual. Harder to go back to decockers if you put the safeties in the frame (they tell me, I've only done it once to test something.)
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Just got my new extended firing pin and got it put in.
Old pin is: 2.442
New pin is: 2.474
with a difference of .032
Maybe have a little more dent in my primers and zero fail to fire.
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Yesterday I picked up my new P01. When I got home and was cleaning it I found out it was the Omega. It wasn't on the tag that was on the gun. It didn't look like it had been fired. Sold as a used gun. I got it cleaned up and took it to the range and put a little over 100 rounds through it. I used three different loads I made up. It didn't seem to like the 147 grain loads. They shot too high. I had some 135 gr loaded with Unique and 231. It liked the 231 the best which my other 9's like too. It cycled great. It shot the group about 1" to the right at 7 and 25 yards. When I got home and cleaned it up I noticed the rear sight was not centered. So I moved it slightly and will shoot it again today off of a rest. I got a little trigger slap off of it. I noticed the roll pin for the firing pin looked like it has been hammered on and thought maybe someone had been messing with it unless that was the assembly from the factory. After cleaning it up I tested the trigger pull and is 4 lb 5 oz consistent pull and no gritty feeling. Really nice. I use CCI primers and the ones I used are small rifle. The firing pin only left a little indent in the primer but fired every one just fine. I ordered a new extended firing pin and retaining pin and some punches. When that all comes in I will pull the pin and see what is in the gun. When I got the gun the grease in it was thick and sticky like it was pretty old. I had to use a punch to get the lever lock out of it to pull the slide. I cleaned it up and put fresh oil on it. So far I like it a lot. A few years ago I bought a 75B off of a guy at the range. Super trigger but after a mag or two the trigger would not reset. It had had a trigger job. I could clean it and it did the same thing. He bought it back off of me. That was the only CZ I have owned before. On this one the serial number is on the frame, barrel, and slide. It starts with G and on the slide there is a little triangle and 22. I think I saw that was when it was made.
My P-01 steel frame had the same light fire pin primer strikes and my gunsmith discovered the factory 18 lb main spring had been replaced with a 13lb CGW spring. After replacing the main spring with the correct factory 18 lb spring, I have no issues whatsoever.
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I put in my extended firing pin and tested it this morning. No failure to fire and the firing pin dent was a lot better. I think that will fix it. I have a couple hammer springs ordered and will test them too. Right now with a 4 lb trigger that works good is great. I don't know what spring is in it now. It is not colored differently than a normal spring. It may be possible that it has a 11.5 lb spring in it. I fired 30 this morning for test and the only thing I saw was the primer dent was great and a few looked like it had a very slight drag mark. That may even go away after it is all broken in. I've been testing my loads and have found a good load to the point of sights with Unique and now testing some with 231 to get a good load. These are with 135 gr TEK cast bullets. It didn't like my 147 gr loads I had made for my 1911. And the 1911 likes the 135 gr better too. So I should end up with a good load that both will like.
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My Omega with a 15 LB MS and the CGW FP kit shoots Wolf/Tula fine. For reasons of geometry it seems that the P01 Omega can feel awful heavy in DA.
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I have a P-01 Omega with the MCARBO Kit installed its a fantastic pistol to shoot. Shooting one inch groups at 25 yards is some great shooting :).
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I've installed 3 M*CARBO trigger spring kits in a 75 B, 97 B, and P-01 Omega. The Omega kit was the easiest to install.
They make a world of difference for not much money.
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I've installed 3 M*CARBO trigger spring kits in a 75 B, 97 B, and P-01 Omega. The Omega kit was the easiest to install.
They make a world of difference for not much money.
Yes I agree totally, worth the $$.
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I got my springs in the mail today and put the 11.5 # one in. Single action a little less than 4#. Double action about 7#. Would not fire one round. Changed out to the 13# spring and would not fire 10 out of the 30 I shot. So I used the double action for second strike and those all fired except 1. I brought it home to break it down and see if there is any powder in it. So I put the original spring back in it and will go with that. At least it fires all the time. It is single action about 4#. Double is more than 12. The Lyman tester maxes out at 12. That 7# double action with the light spring felt pretty good. Over 12 is pretty tough to do.
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I got my springs in the mail today and put the 11.5 # one in. Single action a little less than 4#. Double action about 7#. Would not fire one round. Changed out to the 13# spring and would not fire 10 out of the 30 I shot. So I used the double action for second strike and those all fired except 1.
With what ammo ? All ammo is NOT created equal. There is a HUGE difference between ammo using Federal #100 primers and that which uses CCI or S&B primers. Winchester is somewhere in the middle.
Most of your competition shooters are handloading the much, much softer Federal primers. If you're reading their posts and blindly following them, then you'll be very sadly disappointed. Most factory ammo is using very hard primers.
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I got my springs in the mail today and put the 11.5 # one in. Single action a little less than 4#. Double action about 7#. Would not fire one round. Changed out to the 13# spring and would not fire 10 out of the 30 I shot. So I used the double action for second strike and those all fired except 1. I brought it home to break it down and see if there is any powder in it. So I put the original spring back in it and will go with that. At least it fires all the time. It is single action about 4#. Double is more than 12. The Lyman tester maxes out at 12. That 7# double action with the light spring felt pretty good. Over 12 is pretty tough to do.
I use CGW's 18lb hammer springs and never worry about misfires. Coming from da revolvers a bit heavier da pull doesn't bother me in the least. You must practice. Lightening trigger pulls IS NOT a substitute for trigger time. I love modding my guns and I'm as much a trigger snob as one can be but I spend ALOT of time at the range.
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I am using my reloads with CCI rifle primers. That is the only thing I have been able to buy in the last few months. This is the only gun I have ever had that had trouble with light primer strikes. I don't know for sure what the spring that came in it is but it is the only one that fires 100% with the extended firing pin. It is shorter than the new ones I got from Cajun but heavier wire and stiffer. When I do the pencil test it just jumps about 2 inches, the same as the 11.5 #s spring. The 13# spring makes the pencil fly out of the gun about 12 inches. And it fired about 60% on the first strike. You would have thought it would have done the best. But I will go with the original spring doing 100%. It is still a nice clean 4# trigger. But I liked the 7# double action that the other springs had. I haven't bought a new box of ammo in years. The spring that came with the new extended firing pin seems a little heavier than the original that I took out.
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I am using my reloads with CCI rifle primers.
Well, sir... Small Rifle Primers are harder and thicker than Small Magnum Pistol primers; which are harder and thicker than standard Small Pistol Primers. So there's your answer.
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I bought a new box of Blazer brass ammo and tested it. The primer strike was a lot better and deeper indent. So the rifle primers are harder. I will load up these and maybe someday will get some pistol primers to load for this one and then go to the 13# spring. I can shoot up the hard primers in my 1911 and then the soft ones for the CZ. Then eventually will be able to go all soft primers if they ever become available. I can't believe how nice this thing shoots. I have always compared stuff to the 1911 and nothing ever shot as good to me. I've had Rugers, Berettas, and Sigs. Guys on forums always say if you shoot a 1911 good you will like the CZ75. And I really do like it. I throw a clay pigeon on the 25 yard berm and wipe it out including all of the little pieces. It's a keeper. Now I may have to pick up a full sized 75 all steel to go with this one.
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I bought a new box of Blazer brass ammo and tested it. The primer strike was a lot better and deeper indent. So the rifle primers are harder. I will load up these and maybe someday will get some pistol primers....
So you were thinking that primers used in cartridges working in excess of 40 to 65,000psi (rifles) were the same material as those used in handguns working at 20 to 30,000psi ??
While Small Rifle primers are the same physical size dimensions as Small Pistol, and substitutions CAN be made. That doesn't mean they can or should be substituted across the board in every cartridge for every handgun. Especially in those handguns with reduced force hammer springs.
Brother, stop thinking is terms of "fit" and change your view point to that of "chamber pressure" and your shooting will be IMHO a lot more rewarding and safer.
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Watch this video about spp vs srp. super vel small primer video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGVRGsoOr6k
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Watch this video about spp vs srp. super vel small primer video
What video? Do you have a link to something?
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Sorry, I could not find a link to the video. Just do a search for what I posted and you’ll find it. I even copied the web page heading and that didn’t work for me.
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I watched a couple vids and so there are couple youtube posters who claim they had no problems and had no failures. So this proves absolutely nothing as it pertains to your situation. The CZ is more sensitive to changes in spring rate than some guns. One vid I saw had a stock Sig with it's stock spring in place and had no failures. I'm sure if you stay with your stock spring you will have no failures either.
I tried srp years ago when I was still shooting revolvers regularly and found that even with stock springs I could get misfires because they were just too hard. I won't waste my time loading them for pistol use when the possibility of misfire is likely. Talk about a waste of time and components. You have been given good advice here but you may do as you please.
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I knew small rifle are harder but this is the only gun I own that has problems with them. I am very happy with this pistol as is but would have liked the double action to be a bit easier to use. Maybe some day we will see some pistol primers. CCI is the only brand that is on the shelf here. Back when I could buy Winchester that is what I used. I switched to CCI large primers when I was loading 45 acp a few years ago and then went CCI small primers when they didn't have Winchester anymore.. Winchester did not seat as easy as the CCI. As long as this things runs as good as it is I am a happy camper. It is the only pistol I have had that I can shoot as good as my 1911's.
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I have a P-01 Omega with the MCARBO Kit installed its a fantastic pistol to shoot. Shooting one inch groups at 25 yards is some great shooting :).
Wow! that is great! no way near my 25 yrd groupings. I may just have to research this MCARBO kit.
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What did just changing the trigger spring do? My single action trigger out of the box is 4 lb.
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https://cajungunworks.com/product/rptrs-reduced-power-trigger-return-spring/
1/2 lb and likely longer life.
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https://cajungunworks.com/product/rptrs-reduced-power-trigger-return-spring/
1/2 lb and likely longer life.
Eight or ten years ago there was a bit of "talk" here about breaking trigger return springs. The belief was that CZ had sent a lot of pistols out with faulty trigger return springs in them due to a supplier making them wrong or of the wrong materials. The CGW trigger return spring was the recommendation for replacement to improve reliability and getting a slightly reduced trigger pull weight.
I've never had one break (factory) but I replaced my P07 and P09 trigger return and firing pin block springs with CGW reduced weight springs several years ago and haven't had any issue with them either. it's not expensive. I may make you feel better about your pistol. And it's a good opportunity to also replace the firing pin retaining pin and inspect/clean places not usually seen or cleaned on CZ pistols by most owners.
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I JUST broke another at the range, but it was on a C100 and I will chalk it up to the Canik OEM spring and not CZ.
Yes, I think there was a REALLY BAD batch put out in the 2003-2005 time frame. I've had a better experience with the CGW springs, but have broken them also.