The Original CZ Forum

GENERAL => CZ Gunsmithing => Topic started by: Walt-Sherrill on August 04, 2002, 08:29:28 AM

Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 04, 2002, 08:29:28 AM
Well, not really broken, but obviously dinged.

I was shooting it this morning, marveling at how well it shoots, when I had a jam.  Dropped the mag and cleared it, tried to reinsert the mag, and it wouldn't go.  When I pulled it out again, a small piece of machined metal came out with it.  I cleared the gun, and with some trepidation, chambered a round and fired it.  Then fired it with a mag.  It continued to function perfectly, with no change in performance.

When I got home, I started to detail strip it.  Couldn't find anything wrong or missing... until I noticed that the back of the trigger bar (the rightmost section of part 7, above) was missing.  Guess I'll have to order a new one from somewhere.  (I don't relish dealing with EAA.)  I wonder if Brownell's has this part.

Suprisingly,  It continues to work properly.

-----
Interesting aside: I had never really given it much thought or attention, but its interesting to note that this particular gun doesn't have a mag brake (just smooth metal) or any of the parts for retaining the main spring in the grip.  It just drops into the grip, which has a sealed bottom.

This is probably just one of many ways that EAA has cut costs by reducing parts and fitting.  I think I prefer this to the CZ design in these areas.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: iNetJunkie on August 05, 2002, 10:54:56 AM
Heh, talk about combat quality!  One would not normally think of the trigger bar as "optional"! :lol  

I like the no-mag-brake design too, but I wonder if this complicates working on the main spring significantly?  I don't feel comfortable messing with those kinds of internal parts myself, but I'm sure there are several here that have tinkered with main spring spring rates, etc.

I wonder why CZ hasn't simplified some of [their] design where Tanfoglio has?  Are the Tanfoglio design changes patented somehow?

-iNJ
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 05, 2002, 11:11:26 AM
It actually simplifies stuff.  Remove one pin, and the whole trigger assembly pulls out.  Slick.

I'm awaiting return email from Brownells on the trigger bar; they carry them, and I know it'll be faster and cheaper  than dealing with EAA.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Tbaus on August 05, 2002, 09:44:12 PM
My Brownells catalog #54 lists the EAA Witness trigger bar assembly #288-303-105 for 38 Super and .45acp ( large frame models) for $13.54. It further lists part number 288-303-005 for 9mm and .40S&W ( small frame models) for the same price of $13.54.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 06, 2002, 02:26:36 AM
Yup.  That's the part number my catalog shows, too.  (I exchanged emails with the Technical help desk yesterday.)

And since I have a C&R ffl license, I get the dealer discount.  Which makes it $10 plus change.  

I'll be ordering today.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 06, 2002, 12:42:04 PM
Called  Brownell's earlier today about the Trigger Bar.

They no longer stock that part, even though its in their new catalog.  

I had to order it from EAACORP.  (And did so with great trepidation.)

It was a suprisingly brief experience.  A very pleasant lady took my order, took my money, told me the item would be shipped tomorrow, by priority mail.  (With priority mail shipping, it cost me $19, which is a bit more than it would have been from Brownells, but not excessively so.)

I could also have ordered it from Gun Parts Corporation, but you know how that is...

Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Tbaus on August 06, 2002, 07:01:39 PM
Gun Parts Corporation... Is that Numrich?  Are they expensive or otherwise bad to order from?
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 06, 2002, 07:21:10 PM
Same place.

Sometimes, they're the ONLY place you can find parts.   And their prices are generally reasonable.

My last couple of orders have been prompt and complete.

But Gun Parts Corp is notorious for taking your order, and then, a week later, when you get your package, letting you find that a critical part is out of stock, back ordered, or unlikely to be available....

(Just try getting parts for a Luger sometime...)

Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 08, 2002, 04:47:34 PM
I was very pleasantly surprised!

EAA's part department said, Monday, the part would be shipped tomorrow and I should get it in 2-3 days.  

It came today (Thursday), and the gun is back up and running.

(Although it was a comedy of errors between parts receipt and completed assembly.  You need pilot pins to reassemble some parts that are spring loaded and I didn't have pilot pins, and had to fabricate them.  [Got lots of nails and a Dremel.] And then I have two left hands even though I'm supposed to be right-handed...)

Brownells would've been a few bucks cheaper, but I doubt they would've been faster.

Good job EAA.



Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Tbaus on August 08, 2002, 06:36:20 PM
Walt, I am glad it went well with EAA. Speaking of long-slides, do you know where to get a sight that will fit the long-slide, (Supersight replacement) from a source other than EAA, at a reasonable price? To make it even harder... I like the two dot or white outline rear sight.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on August 08, 2002, 06:50:24 PM
Mine broke and I got an exact replacement from Brownells.  It was not cheap.   (I have a Curio & Relics FFL and that gives me dealer prices from Brownells.  Another benefit of the license.)  If you have a friend with a C&R they can order it for you and save you $23+.  (Note: mine is plain black, but they also have twin dot versions for the same price.)

Be prepared to take some metal off the sides or bottom of the sight.  It is a VERY, VERY tight fit.  I should've taken off more than I  did.  Instead, I got a bigger hammer.  (You'd think I'd learn.)  It works fine.

Here's the part number:

 625-091-300  TRT91BW07 PLAIN BLACK LPA ADJ. REAR  

My cost (before shipping) was $46.13.  (I just checked and their price is $67, retail, $2 more than EAA.)   I love that C&R ffl!

Call them or write them (through the email section of their website).  Tell them what you want; they may have something else that fits.  If you email, you should get a reply within a day or so.  

  www.brownells.com (http://www.brownells.com)
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Bompa on August 08, 2002, 10:09:55 PM
CDNN had some LPA sights packaged under the MecGar brand
name at a very reasonable price..Perhaps they have one for what you want..
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Tbaus on August 09, 2002, 12:46:25 PM
Thanks for the part numbers Walt. Bompa, thanks for the CDNN idea. Unless someone knows more about the CDNN sights, I doubt CDNN will know if one of the sights is equivalent to the SuperSight, which fits in a specially machined "long-slide".  Their sights look good and the price is right, but they all say, "no machining of the slide is required."
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: CZ75ID on September 10, 2002, 06:54:21 PM
Would these CDNN sights fit a standard 10mm Witness?
My gun is nice, but adjustables would be much nicer.

Don't want to wait for MMCs to be put on. I'd be on the
bottom of the CZ work list, as a lot of people are opting
for MMC and PTs i'm told.

Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on September 10, 2002, 07:12:31 PM
The CDNN (Mec-Gar) sights are NOT equivalent to the SuperSights.  (I've got both.)
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Walt-Sherrill on October 01, 2002, 06:02:27 PM
I've been playing with my Witness Long Slide over the past week or two, trying to improve the DA trigger.

It had always been kind of heavy toward the rear of the trigger pull range, "stacking" or so it seemed.

I've been progressively taking more and more metal off the side and rear of the trigger bar.  It became clear, as I examined the gun, that the trigger bar was just too wide and long for the best trigger pull.

I guess the trigger bar was simply pushing against the frame -- and that might have been why it broke in the first place: internal tension causing a fracture.

After many sessions of filing, sanding and polishing, the double-action pull is now approaching the smoothness and lightness of my 85 Combat and Pre-B 75.  (And believe me: there's still PLENTY of metal there...)

I'm amazed.  I did NOT expect this dramatic result when  I started.
Title: Broke my Witness Long Slide
Post by: Fred Flinstone on October 02, 2002, 02:54:04 AM
If not for your intervention, then run of the mill guy would'nt dare using finishing tools to improve the functioning of the pistol. Would you call this a design flaw?