The Original CZ Forum

CZ PISTOL CLUBS => CLUB CZ97 => Topic started by: rbernie on December 28, 2003, 10:18:41 PM

Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: rbernie on December 28, 2003, 10:18:41 PM
Hope everyone had a good holiday - I sure did.

Having a long weekend to play with, I went ahead and Dremel'ed the feed ramp on my 97B in an effort to increase the likelihood that it'd feed hollowpoints reliably. (I chose to muck with the feed ramp simply because it was easier than trying to address the magazine seating height side of the equation....)

I removed the droop at the end (straightening the ramp at the expense of making it a wee bit steeper), increased the ramp's flare at the bottom (which would look to be a big deal in getting hollowpoints to slide upward smoothly), and polished it all up after I got the shape that I wanted.

Before this, I could not get the pistol to feed any kind of hollowpoints - regardless of brand or weight (OAL length), they'd nosedive under the feedramp without fail. Since this surgery, my 97B has digested four boxes of UMC 230gr hardball, two boxes of 185gr Silvertips, and two boxes of Taurus 185gr all-copper HPs with nary a nosedive or hiccup of any sort. Not a huge sampling, but IMO it's a pretty good start.

WooHoo - my favorite pistol just got better. :D
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: skucera on December 29, 2003, 12:12:49 AM
I was pondering doing this myself, but was waiting for someone else to try it first to see what their results would be.  Thanks for doing it and posting the preliminary results.

Now, since I have the week off, maybe I'll get out my dremel and do a little recountouring....

Scott
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: Jeff Bergquist on December 29, 2003, 08:12:53 AM
Skucera, others including me have recontoured the feed ramp as well with good results. I also changed out my mag springs for +10% Wolff springs and haven't had a bobble since with any ammo. I'm still going to modify the mag catch eventually to hold the mags a mm. or so higher, but ain't in any hurry now.

Jeff
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: rbernie on December 29, 2003, 10:08:26 AM
I should add that I decided to try this modification based  upon the prior postings of folks like CZ75BSA, who'd already tried this approach.  Sorry for not making that attribution more clear in my initial post.



Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: skucera on December 29, 2003, 10:51:27 AM
I guess this is another example of my porous memory.  I read this digest every day, and have since before I actually bought my CZ 97 a year ago, but I just didn't remember Jeff's post, or CZ75BSA's.  

There's no harm in not stating where you got the idea to recontour the feed ramp.  It's a subject that has bounced around this forum for months.

Thanks for the info about the stronger Wolff magazine spring.  I'll try that too, since those springs are so inexpensive.

Scott
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: CZ75BSA on December 29, 2003, 11:46:17 AM
It is good to get as much feedback as possible that these mods either work consistently or don't.
 
In this case it seems to work.  :rollin  

Like i said before, it is so simple and obvioius that it is hard to understand why CZ didn't do it that way to begin with.  I was really afraid that I was going to discover some unforeseen negative, but that hasn't happened yet.

I still don't have the improved mag springs.  Looks like i will have to experiment with those also. I try to only change one thing at a time, so i can backtrack if things start to go wrong.
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: bullsi1911 on December 29, 2003, 12:20:26 PM
I have a theory about why the CZ-97B was not set up for HP rounds.  Does the Czech Republic allow the use of HP ammo?  It may have just never crossed the designer's mind that we in the US use HP ammo....
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: Jeff Bergquist on December 29, 2003, 02:26:46 PM
Possibly Bullsi, but I still can't figure out the purpose of that curve in the feedramp for hollowpoints or roundnose.

CZ75BSA, the way I see it, recontouring the feedramp helps in case the round feeds low e.g. nosedives, while stronger mag springs help to prevent nosedives in the first place. Either way my gun has fed 100's of rounds of mixed ammo since then with perfect reliability, so I'm a happy camper.

Jeff
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: Radom on December 29, 2003, 09:03:40 PM
I have never had any problems with the CZ 97B feeding hollow points, provided the cartridges were neither too long nor too short.  The only factory load that I recall having feeding problems was the Federal Hydrashok, which will soon be discontinued anyway...
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: DonNikmare on December 29, 2003, 11:52:14 PM
Since I am not confident in my dremel skills, I'm having Mike at CZ-USA do a feed rampjob for $40 along with installing a serrated trigger ($35 +$40 labor).  Finding the 97b at a great price left a little extra funds which I'm spending on it before they get sucked in elsewhere as they most certainly would have.
Will try to figure out the picture posting thing n post a pic of the redone feedramp after I get it back. It's supposed to get to the point of reliably feeding not only hollow points but also wadcutters :D
Nik
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: crt360 on December 30, 2003, 04:31:47 PM
I don't shoot a lot of hollowpoints through mine, but I did once try a box or so of CCI/Speer stuff (not Gold Dot, but really wide-mouth flying ashtray type) just to see if it would work.  The gun was fairly new and I had not done anything to the feed ramp.  I kept expecting a jam, but it fed with no problems.  I have not tried any Hydra-Shocks or other premium priced hp's in the 97B.
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: CZ75BSA on January 15, 2004, 09:18:17 AM
I put another 100 rounds of Remington Hollow Points through my 97B (with modified ramp) yesterday without the slightest hiccup.
In fact, I didn't even think about it the whole time.  
Success !
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: Hermo Gut on January 20, 2004, 11:39:30 PM
Rbernie - I did the same with my CZ97B. After seeing my friend's 9mm. CZ85 which has a straight feed ramp profile I decided to modify mine. To start with , my 97B is flawless with FMJ but had some problems with JHP (especially with Remington Golden Saber). After the modification , I polished the ramp to a mirror like finish.I also installed a 16lbs. wolff recoil spring to replace that under sprung 13lbs. recoil spring & ordered (made to order) a SS recoil spring guide to compliment my new spring.
         From thereon my 97B has been flawless with all kinds of ammo that I put into it.So far it has digested around 2K without a problem.:D
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: BENETONE on January 21, 2004, 04:33:28 AM
I only polished my feed ramp without changing its profile and changed spring for 16lb from .40's 75B. It feeds flat noses, semi-wads, Federal's EFMJs, except holow points, which are prohibited...
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: shermanav on January 26, 2004, 12:30:00 PM
My new CZ97 has had hollowpoints feeding problems out of the box. I polished the ramp, but FTFs were still happening. I noticed that FTFs only occurred after 1-st shot (I had 10 in the clip and 1 in the barrel). Then, I loaded only 10 rounds (9+1). FTFs became seldom. Finally, I loaded only 9 rounds (8+1), and - bingo! I shot over 500 hollowpoints of various manufacturers, and had zero FTFs. In all exercises above I used original Meg-Gar clips.

 I carry mine for self defense. I, basically, traded 2 rounds for 100% reliability.

Anybody has had the same experience?  
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: DonNikmare on January 26, 2004, 11:25:05 PM
Did you recountour the ramp n polish it or just polish it?  Reshaping n then polishing seems to be more helpful than just polishing it since the little curve at the bottom of the feedramp seems to be part of the FTF problem.
I think I sense a new stronger mag spring suggestion coming from someone too.  :)
Nik
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: shermanav on January 27, 2004, 04:28:42 PM
No, I did not reshape the ramp, only polished. I am afraid to get it wrong. Do you know a gunsmith who can get it right it?
Title: Feeding Hollowpoints
Post by: DonNikmare on January 27, 2004, 10:03:40 PM
Mike at cz-usa. I have not had the chance to go n fire hps yet but they seemed to cycle fine manually.  I think stronger recoil spring n FMGR also help push/pull the bullet up the ramp n into the chamber better.
Mike's reshaping of the feedramp is a little off center n to the right.  The right ridge of the feedramp is lower than the left n the groove itself is off to the right of the center a little.  It's so obvious that I'm thinking he must have done it that way on purpose for some reason although I can't figure out what it would be.  I hope to go shooting soon n see how it all works.
Having a local gunsmith do it would be much cheaper as cz-usa take $40 for the job plus you have to pay shipping to send the barrel n for them to send it back.  It makes more sense having Mike do it if you are having several things done at the same time.
Nik