The Original CZ Forum
GENERAL => General Firearms Discussion => Topic started by: JimThornTX on May 16, 2013, 11:31:31 AM
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Yes, I admit it. I turned to the Dark Side and bought a Glock 23 Gen 3 compact 40S&W 13+1. O0
I decided to try out a Glock for several reasons:
1. Availability -- Glocks are easy to find. Parts are easy to find, replacement and custom. Magazines are easy to find.
2. Popularity -- just like the AR15, the Glock pistol is the most popular handgun in America. If ever caught in a SHTF or WORL scenario, spare parts and magazines should be easy to acquire.
3. Ergonomics -- believe it or not the G23 actually feels good in my hand. And my wife especially likes the feel of it in her hand. The full-size Glocks may be "Blocks" but the compact is not. At least not to us. I told her that if she didn't like the recoil of the 40 we could get her a G19. Same exact pistol in 9mm.
4. Price -- $499 and FREE shipping to my FFL from http://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com
So far my only real complaints are that I wish the Glock had the loaded chamber indicator and the "cocked, ready to fire" indicator that my Springfield XD-45 does. These two small additions might help prevent some of the infamous Negligent Discharges that Glocks are known for having.
Don't worry, I'm not about to give up my CZ's. I may like other brands, but CZ will always be my favorite. 8)
Now for some pics:
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u432/JimThornTX/GLOCK/P1010039_zps9316573a.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u432/JimThornTX/GLOCK/P1010040_zps3e7144a9.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u432/JimThornTX/GLOCK/P1010041_zpscb08d629.jpg)
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2. Popularity -- just like the AR15, the Glock pistol is the most popular handgun in America.
Somebody elected the current president.
If ever caught in a SHTF or WORL scenario, spare parts and magazines should be easy to acquire.
I'll wait for the SHTF or WORL scenario to shop for Glocks, tyvm :)
3. Ergonomics -- believe it or not the G23 actually feels good in my hand. And my wife especially likes the feel of it in her hand. The full-size Glocks may be "Blocks" but the compact is not. At least not to us. I told her that if she didn't like the recoil of the 40 we could get her a G19. Same exact pistol in 9mm.
Glad it works for you. Speaking for myself, it just feels "wrong" compared to the 1911/BHP/Cz75/XD (handguns with the "natural" grip angle)
So far my only real complaints are that I wish the Glock had the loaded chamber indicator and the "cocked, ready to fire" indicator that my Springfield XD-45 does. These two small additions might help prevent some of the infamous Negligent Discharges that Glocks are known for having.
What happened to "All guns are loaded until it's definitively proven they're not." ? How about the 4 rules of gun safety?
Do the "loaded chamber" and "cocked, ready to fire" indicators give one license to act unsafely with a firearm?
I'm not much for Glocks (yes, I've owned several in my younger days). It is also my opinion that in buying a Glock, you downgraded from your XD.
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Jim,
I'm curious how the recoil of the Glock 23 compares to your P-06, when you get a chance, could you let us know?
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my friend, who does not own a glock, but defends them consistently.. said he wants to hate my sp-01 but he doesnt. he said the glock 23 he shot had a lot of muzzle flip and is hard to be accurate with compared to his px4
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he said the glock 23 he shot had a lot of muzzle flip and is hard to be accurate with compared to his px4
It's hard to compare a handgun with Browning locking system with a Px4 or Cougar, as they use a rotating barrel system that doesn't produce many of the recoil movements the Browning system does.
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Nice gun Jim. I have a customized G34 range toy and I've been meaning to pick up a G19 one of these days. While I like my G34, the compacts like your G23 definitely are the best size Glocks in my opinion.
As far as the LCI, you just have to really train yourself to always handle the gun properly. People have gotten in trouble breaking these guns down, since you have to pull the trigger as part of the process, but if you're 100% diligent with dropping the mag and then racking the slide to check for a loaded round, you'll never have a problem. Not to mention that you should be doing this for any gun you're about to break down, so it's not like it's specific to just Glocks. :) Also, if you ever decide to change anything on the gun, there's an amazing amount of aftermarket parts for these guns, and you will have no problem finding new sights, trigger modifications, etc. for your Glock.
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If you'll read your owners manual closely you'll find the Glock does have a loaded chamber indicator. The extractor protrudes out visually and by feel. Much less obtrusive and obnoxious than those of other makes.
Glocks are great guns but, like all other makes, not perfect. There's always something that could be better for each individual. Never had a failure with my Glock. But then, I've never had a failure with my S&Ws, my CZ, or my Sig. Some folks seem to have problems with everything.
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If you'll read your owners manual closely you'll find the Glock does have a loaded chamber indicator. The extractor protrudes out visually and by feel. Much less obtrusive and obnoxious than those of other makes.
Glocks are great guns but, like all other makes, not perfect. There's always something that could be better for each individual. Never had a failure with my Glock. But then, I've never had a failure with my S&Ws, my CZ, or my Sig. Some folks seem to have problems with everything.
The only problem I've had in my Glock is with some undercharged Winchester white box ammo, where a round didn't have enough oomph to properly cycle the slide. That said, I find that pretty much all of my guns have run without problems, provided the ammo doesn't create a problem.
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Hey no need for excuses, you got a new gun! Yay! ;D
Glocks are nice utilitarian pieces. My friend LOVES his Glocks and has two G23's in fact. For some the blockiness is a turn off, for him he loves it. I can't get used to how they just sort of sit on top of my hand, however the Gen 4's seem to have corrected that and they do have a much nicer grip.
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he said the glock 23 he shot had a lot of muzzle flip and is hard to be accurate with compared to his px4
It's hard to compare a handgun with Browning locking system with a Px4 or Cougar, as they use a rotating barrel system that doesn't produce many of the recoil movements the Browning system does.
i did compare them. because theyre both semi-auto pistols. just because beretta has more tech in theirs doesnt mean i cant compare them.
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i did compare them. because theyre both semi-auto pistols. just because beretta has more tech in theirs doesnt mean i cant compare them.
You're not getting it.
You're comparing apples to oranges.
Wankel engine to a Chevy small block.
. . . and so on.
The Beretta rotating barrel technology actually dates back to about the same time frame as when John Browning was perfecting his drop-link system (the Steyr models of 1907 & 1912 were the first [and until the Beretta Cougar, the only] pistols that used a rotating barrel).
So, it's not "new technology" in the Beretta - just different.
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Don't forget that they are easy to maintain. I could totally detail strip my Glock to a pile of parts in about 2 minutes. Show me any other gun that you can do that to with only a pin punch and then I might like it as much as I do Glock.
I really miss my G19. Soon as I get working again and funds become available I'm going to join GSSF and order a new G19 for $425 through their certificate deal. As much as I like my CZ82 I really loved my G19 and I miss it a lot. :(
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Jim,
I'm curious how the recoil of the Glock 23 compares to your P-06, when you get a chance, could you let us know?
I'm hoping to try the G23 out this weekend. The P-06 has a pretty sharp recoil, depending on ammo brand. Prvi PPU being the mildest and Speer Lawman being the hottest.
G23 = 21.16 oz empty
P-06 = 29.12 oz (1.82 oz) empty
The Glock is obviously lighter, but they say the plastic frame flexing helps absorb recoil. It will be interesting to see if this is true.
As far as the "cocked" indicator, I am a visual person. I'm used to seeing a hammer on a gun, and knowing right away if the gun is cocked or not. Having the indicator on the XD-45 is a nice feature, IMO. Obviously not absolutely necessary, but still a nice feature.
And, yes, I did forget to mention how easy a Glock is to field strip. Not that a CZ is really that hard to field strip, but it's definitely easier on a Glock.
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Be careful with those Glocks,,,,, I read somewhere that something in the plastic lowers your testosterone to dangerous levels. So much so, that you may take to buying and wearing mall ninja gear!
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NO ! ! !
say it isn't so
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Hiya Jim and thanks for starting the thread, hope ya dont get beat up to bad with the posts. I've seen em, been invited ta try em, but just as in other things I'd thought might be fun, decided against it. Congrats on the purchase, wish I could have the feeling everyday that a new gun purchase brings, glad ta hear they are making user friendly improvements, but will never make it to my gun porn file, fugly they are. Be well.
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By the title, I expected a BHP or Sig or even H&K, BUT NOT A CROCK
Mostly just kidding. ;D I just got a new gun and know that good feeling. Of course, mine is really even enjoyable looking at it!! O0 O0 ;D
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Congrats on the new gun!
I to decided to try a G23 because the 40P was my only 40 caliber and was lonely, I found a good deal, and I always felt left out in the Glock bashing threads. Now I can join in with everyone else and complain about them! Problem is I really never gave it a chance; shot a few hundred rounds, never got use to the trigger and just couldn't get a decent grouping with it. I feel a lot of the short comings I experienced were teething issues that could be overcome with more shooting. Downside is what happens to all the built up experience I have with CZs. I decided I'm a one handgun kinda guy
( sounds boring I know)
So now it sits in the safe but every once in awhile I throw it in the glovebox just to let it get some air and feel some Love.
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I figure if I don't like it I can sell it for probably about the same price I paid for it. For some crazy reason used Glocks tend to sell for virtually the same price as new. At least that is what I have seen lately. And there doesn't seem to be a shortage of people wanting to buy a Glock.
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Hmmm.............? A 2.5 lb Trigger Connector, you will need. ;)
(http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/yoda.jpg)
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Nothing wrong with a Glock. I love my CZ's, especially my PCR, but I carry a Gen4 19 when off duty. My issue gun is a Glock 35 and I figure if I ever have to use a gun off duty it will be easier to defend in court as the 19 is the same action type/trigger, etc. It will also be easier to replace if taken into evidence.
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Repent and sin no more!
Sancho
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You gonna make it green?:
(http://www.goegunworks.com/mediac/400_0/media/c319ae163838a367ffff86fdffffe415.jpg).
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You gonna make it green?:
I would consider Olive Drab Green like my XD-45. But I think it looks good in all black just the same. Not really planning on putting any money into it. Although I do plan on buying some 15-round mags and grip extensions.
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You gonna make it green?:
(http://www.goegunworks.com/mediac/400_0/media/c319ae163838a367ffff86fdffffe415.jpg).
Oh snap! That is awesome!
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You gonna make it green?:
I would consider Olive Drab Green like my XD-45. But I think it looks good in all black just the same. Not really planning on putting any money into it. Although I do plan on buying some 15-round mags and grip extensions.
You'll have to see how you like the sights. Personally, I'm used to black rear/fiber front sights on my CZ's, and wasn't very fond of the white U rear sight on the glock. There are tons of options out there though, as one might imagine.
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I figure if I don't like it I can sell it for probably about the same price I paid for it. For some crazy reason used Glocks tend to sell for virtually the same price as new. At least that is what I have seen lately. And there doesn't seem to be a shortage of people wanting to buy a Glock.
My thinking also. Have two guys at work waiting for me to sell!
Never thought about going Green, but added some grip tape so I could hang on to it without using the grip of death.
(http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o173/mesabill/2012-07-29_12-56-20_325.jpg) (http://s120.photobucket.com/user/mesabill/media/2012-07-29_12-56-20_325.jpg.html)
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There are some simple ways to be green with a Glock. For example, Hogue grip:
(http://www.zombiegrips.com/media/pages/grips/zombie_handall_glock_19.jpg).
Or, grip tape:
(http://www.tractiongrips.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/NeonGreenG19.jpg).
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You'll have to see how you like the sights. Personally, I'm used to black rear/fiber front sights on my CZ's, and wasn't very fond of the white U rear sight on the glock. There are tons of options out there though, as one might imagine.
Yes, I have been thinking about the Glock's rear sights. My wife and I are both used to three-dot sights. All my CZ's, my Ruger P95, and my Springfield XD-45 all have three-dot sights.
I might have to check into that Zombie green Hogue grip. ;)
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Yes, I admit it. I turned to the Dark Side and bought a Glock 23 Gen 3 compact 40S&W 13+1. O0
CONGRATULATIONS Jim, on the purchase of your Lego Gun!!!
Just kidding. Glocks are undoubtedly good firearms, as are many others. Great to see the guys here are broad-minded enough to acknowledge that.
Here in South Africa, we have a culture of gun pro's who have the "GLOCK-or-nothing" attitude + "you have to carry 9mmP or higher"(anything lower is USELESS) and C1=condition one-and-only and you're better off NOT carrying if not C1.
So, enjoy your "plasticware" Jim. At least you have the option of switching to a "real" gun whenever you feel like putting your "toys" away.
Happy shooting!!!
http://s1276.photobucket.com/albums/y466/msadam/?action=view¤t=utf-8BQnJpY2tHdW5fLV9HbG9ja18xN19Gcm9udC1MZWZ0X09ydGhvLmpwZw_zps1b119023.jpg
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Now you've done it! If you actually shoot the Black Tupperware Pistol you'll develop a chronic condition known as "Glock Knuckle". :'( Hope you're happy now! ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlY_panxS_I
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Guess I better buy me some shooting gloves. 8)
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My, what an ugly baby.
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Jim,
I'm curious how the recoil of the Glock 23 compares to your P-06, when you get a chance, could you let us know?
Finally got a chance to shoot my Glock today, alongside my P-06. Ammo used was Remington UMC. Anybody that says the polymer frame of the Glock absorbs recoil is not telling the truth. I thought my P-06 had sharp recoil. The Glock is twice as bad. I don't like the recoil and neither does my 17 yr old son. Which is a shame because aside from the recoil I like the gun. Maybe I will sell or trade for a 9mm version.
On a side note, I really like my new Springfield XD 45acp. Recoil was surprisingly mild. Definitely less recoil than my Glock 40s&w. And it's a polymer gun as well.
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the recoil of the G23 is stronger than other .40 cal handguns I have shot, but I found it is quite manageable with a little practice. The only thing I really don't like is the finger grooves in the grip. I like the Gen 2s much more than the Gen 3s.
Although, I haven't had a chance to shoot a Gen 4 with the biggest back strap w/ beavertail, which I think would make it much more comfortable, allowing a higher grip without fear of slide bite.
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Finally got a chance to shoot my Glock today, alongside my P-06. Ammo used was Remington UMC. Anybody that says the polymer frame of the Glock absorbs recoil is not telling the truth. I thought my P-06 had sharp recoil. The Glock is twice as bad. I don't like the recoil and neither does my 17 yr old son. Which is a shame because aside from the recoil I like the gun. Maybe I will sell or trade for a 9mm version.
On a side note, I really like my new Springfield XD 45acp. Recoil was surprisingly mild. Definitely less recoil than my Glock 40s&w. And it's a polymer gun as well.
Trade for a Glock 17 or 19, or a Springfield XD/XDM in 9mm, the latter which would be my choice. ;)
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Per Genitron.com, free recoil energies, in ft?lb, for the following .40 S&W pistols are:
- Glock 23 ? 10.1
- CZ 75 P-06 ? 7.4
- CZ 75 P-07 Duty ? 7.8.
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The only thing I really don't like is the finger grooves in the grip.
My wife and I actually like the finger grooves. Only complaints are the recoil and the rear sights. We both like three dot sights.
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Per Genitron.com, free recoil energies, in ft?lb, for the following .40 S&W pistols are:
- Glock 23 ? 10.1
- CZ 75 P-06 ? 7.4
- CZ 75 P-07 Duty ? 7.8.
Yes, definitely a big difference between the P-06 and G23.
On a side note, the Springfield XD40 (same as my XD45 but in 40s&w) is listed as 7.92 ft-lb. A little more than the P-06 but still a lot less than the G23. The XD45 is listed as 8.26 ft-lb.
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So far my only real complaints are that I wish the Glock had the loaded chamber indicator and the "cocked, ready to fire" indicator that my Springfield XD-45 does. These two small additions might help prevent some of the infamous Negligent Discharges that Glocks are known for having.
IMO anyone that feels a need for a loaded chamber indicator or a striker status indicator needs a lesson in gun safety. And as far as a the ND's Glocks are supposedly known for, that falls on the shooter, never the gun. Firearms safety 101 should clear up any issues you have with your Glock
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IMO anyone that feels a need for a loaded chamber indicator or a striker status indicator needs a lesson in gun safety. And as far as a the ND's Glocks are supposedly known for, that falls on the shooter, never the gun. Firearms safety 101 should clear up any issues you have with your Glock.
IMO a newbie that knows absolutely nothing about the OP should think twice about posting condescending remarks. ::)
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Enough of that stuff! ::) Let's keep it civil. >:(
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Glocks are solid firearms, congratulations on the new gun.
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IMO a newbie that knows absolutely nothing about the OP should think twice about posting condescending remarks. ::)
Sorry, I was just stating my opinion on safety features that are unnecessary if the operator follows basic safety rules and disputing your claim Glocks are known for negligent discharge because they lack these features. Congrats on your purchase.
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I was just stating my opinion on safety features that are unnecessary if the operator follows basic safety rules and disputing your claim Glocks are known for negligent discharge because they lack these features.
I hope JT won't mind, as a curious scientist and statistician, if I ask: What do you believe the reason(s) is(are) for Glocks having an elevated negligent discharge rate relative to other handguns?
I shall read your response without comment, as many know my opinion, despite my reluctance to express it.
Thanks.
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I would trade for a 19 or a 26 in a heartbeat. I just cannot seem to like the .40 cal round at all. I either got 9mm or .45 that's it.
If you want a carry gun for your or the wife the 26 is stupid easy to conceal and with the +2 mag extension you can get a full firing grip. I believe the G19 is one of the most versatile handguns out there. Work great for carry or range use.
Of course I don't own any blocks but if I did it would be the 26/19/34 :)
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2. Popularity -- just like the AR15, the Glock pistol is the most popular handgun in America.
Somebody elected the current president.
If ever caught in a SHTF or WORL scenario, spare parts and magazines should be easy to acquire.
I'll wait for the SHTF or WORL scenario to shop for Glocks, tyvm :)
3. Ergonomics -- believe it or not the G23 actually feels good in my hand. And my wife especially likes the feel of it in her hand. The full-size Glocks may be "Blocks" but the compact is not. At least not to us. I told her that if she didn't like the recoil of the 40 we could get her a G19. Same exact pistol in 9mm.
Glad it works for you. Speaking for myself, it just feels "wrong" compared to the 1911/BHP/Cz75/XD (handguns with the "natural" grip angle)
So far my only real complaints are that I wish the Glock had the loaded chamber indicator and the "cocked, ready to fire" indicator that my Springfield XD-45 does. These two small additions might help prevent some of the infamous Negligent Discharges that Glocks are known for having.
What happened to "All guns are loaded until it's definitively proven they're not." ? How about the 4 rules of gun safety?
Do the "loaded chamber" and "cocked, ready to fire" indicators give one license to act unsafely with a firearm?
I'm not much for Glocks (yes, I've owned several in my younger days). It is also my opinion that in buying a Glock, you downgraded from your XD.
The first one really made me laugh! ;-)
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I hope JT won't mind, as a curious scientist and statistician, if I ask: What do you believe the reason(s) is(are) for Glocks having an elevated negligent discharge rate relative to other handguns?
I am no expert. Especially when it comes to Glocks, being that I have only had this one for less than a month and only shot it one time. But my guess would be the lack of some type of external safety. With a round in the chamber all that it needed is to pull the trigger for the gun to go off. Even though Glocks have a "safety" built into the trigger, it seems to me that it would not be that hard for the trigger to be set off. I have also heard people blaming Serpa holsters. I have no experience with Serpa holsters so I can't comment on that.
I find myself liking the grip safety on my Springfield more and more. You can't pull the trigger without the grip safety engaged, and you can't even rack the slide without the grip safety engaged.
I like the simplicity of the Glock. How easy it is to field strip. It fits my hand and my wife's hand nicely (she loves the finger grooves). We just don't like the recoil. If I were to have another Glock it would be the G19 9mm. I do like the 40S&W round itself. In a heavier gun, like my P-06, recoil is manageable.
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Sold the Glock 23 40S&W today. And for the same amount I paid for it, $500. Used the money to buy my wife a new Springfield XD-9 Sub-Compact 9mm. It will be her CCW. I wish it could have been a RAMI but those are almost impossible to find and cost a lot more than $500 when you do find one.
Here is a pic of the XD-9. It's just like my XD-45 except it's a 3" barrel vs a 4" barrel on the XD-45. Ammo capacity is 13 rounds with the flush-fitting magazine. It also comes with a 16-round extended magazine with grip extension. It's very close in size and shape to the Glock 26 9mm.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u432/JimThornTX/XD-9%20Subcompact/XD9_1_zps6c590bbe.jpg)
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A 9mm makes a lot more sense IMO. Hope you all are happy with the XD :)
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Those are nice guns, my father-in-law has one for his carry. I've shot it, I like the way it handles. The slide seems too tall to me, but I'm used to the short profile of CZ slides now O0
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Sold the Glock 23 40S&W today. And for the same amount I paid for it, $500. Used the money to buy my wife a new Springfield XD-9 Sub-Compact 9mm. It will be her CCW. I wish it could have been a RAMI but those are almost impossible to find and cost a lot more than $500 when you do find one.
Here is a pic of the XD-9. It's just like my XD-45 except it's a 3" barrel vs a 4" barrel on the XD-45. Ammo capacity is 13 rounds with the flush-fitting magazine. It also comes with a 16-round extended magazine with grip extension. It's very close in size and shape to the Glock 26 9mm.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u432/JimThornTX/XD-9%20Subcompact/XD9_1_zps6c590bbe.jpg)
Hey, you bought my carry gun! ;-)
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I hope JT won't mind, as a curious scientist and statistician, if I ask: What do you believe the reason(s) is(are) for Glocks having an elevated negligent discharge rate relative to other handguns?
I shall read your response without comment, as many know my opinion, despite my reluctance to express it.
Thanks.
Really? You must be kidding with this.