The Original CZ Forum
CZ PISTOL CLUBS => CZ CLONE CLUB => Topic started by: bigwilly on April 14, 2014, 09:21:01 PM
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Will CZ P-01 sights fit the Stingray C? I picked one up at a gun show last weekend and it is shooting high. It is the fixed sight model. Not sure what to do other than buy a taller front sight. Any suggestions?
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I'm not sure what sights will fit your Stingray-C, but I do concur with your observation of the pistol shooting high. My Stingray-C shoots 2" high at 7 yards. Also, terry mc's (another forum member) Stingray-C shoots about as high as mine does at the same range. I wouldn't think Canik would release a pistol that shoots as high as it does. :o
Paul
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Got any plans to correct it? I like the gun, but I'd like it a lot better if it shot where I was aiming.
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What sight hold are you two gentlemen using? Maybe if you used a 6 o'clock hold it would be dead on for you. Just a thought if you can't find any sights that work.
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Got any plans to correct it? I like the gun, but I'd like it a lot better if it shot where I was aiming.
No plans as of right now. One of the reasons I bought the Stingray-C was due to its price. I really don't want to spend another $100+ to correct a problem the pistol shouldn't have had in the first place.
Paul
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A six o'clock hold is relative to the target size and distance. By the way, I did a six o'clock hold while shooting the 1" inch target at 7 yards. Bottom line, the sights are off! The high point of impact is extrapolated by distance. At 25 yards the pistol is shooting about 7"-8" high.
Paul
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Wow! That sucks Paul. Sorry for your situation.
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I am using the 6 o'clock hold also. Could I black out the dots and file down the rear sight to make it short enough to level everything out?
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Filing down the rear sight will not work unless you cut through the white does. I calculated it out (geometry) and if you are able to remove .01" from the rear sight best you can do is lower about a half inch from the impact point at 7 yards.
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Thank you calculating those numbers. I may just try to fit a taller front sight on there. Any idea what height I would need to get?
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Are the fixed sights the same dimensions as the adjustable sights? They look the same from the side as my stingray with adjustable sights. Maybe call Century for a replacement?
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I talked to Cajun Gun Works and I was told that they offered a fiber optic front sight which is the correct height for the canik fixed rear sight. It is item number 050-390 if anyone is interested. It is .216" tall.
I ordered it and hopefully this will fix the issue.
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thank you for sharing bigwilly. Can you please document your installation of your new front sight and post it up here?
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I talked to Cajun Gun Works and I was told that they offered a fiber optic front sight which is the correct height for the canik fixed rear sight. It is item number 050-390 if anyone is interested. It is .216" tall.
I ordered it and hopefully this will fix the issue.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Here are my calculations with the new sight (.216") if used on my pistol.
We all know that raising the front sight will lower the bullet impact, which is what we want. I measured the height of the front sight on my Stingray-C and it measured .116". My pistol shoots 7"-8" high at 25 yards.
The new sight calculations:
New sight height is .216 - .116 (my sight height) = .100" difference.
Stingray-C sight radius: 5.700" (dot to dot)
Convert 25 yards to feet and then into inches = 900"
900"/5.7" = 157.89
157.89 x .10" (sight difference) = 15.79"
There will/should be a lower bullet impact of 15.79". Meaning, if my pistol shoots 7-8" high at 25 yards then the new front sight should have me shooting 7"-8" low at 25 yards. In my opinion, the sight would be too tall. However, proof is in the pudding. The pistol will need to be fired with the new sight installed.
PLEASE LET US KNOW YOUR RESULTS ONCE YOU HAVE INSTALLED THE NEW SIGHT AND FIRED THE PISTOL.
Thanks, Paul
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Genin, I'll do my best. It should be here early next week.
DexterGSP, you're significantly better at math than me. Those numbers make sense. The guy at CGW assured me that they'd tested this sight with the factory rear and said that it works. But I guess there's only one way to find out for sure. I will let you guys know how it turns out.
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It's too bad that Cajun only makes the sight as a fiber optic. If it were plain black then one could file the tall sight down if needed. With the fiber optic front sight you are kind of stuck with its height.
Paul
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The guy at CGW assured me that they'd tested this sight with the factory rear and said that it works. But I guess there's only one way to find out for sure. I will let you guys know how it turns out.
No sir, we did not say that. We indicated our sight set for fixed sight Caniks works as it should. We suggested the 050-390 to bring the POA/POI up as a possible improvement for this particular situation, but never indicated this was a perfect fix.
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Let me jump into your discussion on sights this morning for Caniks . First let start by saying please don't be offended by what I am going to say. I have probably changed more sights on Caniks and now Sar products than any one on this forum or anyone in the US. I started customizing these pistols well over two years ago when they first hit the US markets so I have quite a bit of trigger time on these pistols. I have also owned or currently own one of every Sar and Canik that has been available for sale.
Second this experimentation on there pistols led me to a good working relationship with Dave at CGW, he would never steer you in the wrong direction ,but you must listen and pay attention to what he is telling you, don't here what you want to here.
Third in most cases the problem is not the sights it is the stiff triggers. Unload your pistol and post a target on the wall seven yards away. Test your trigger in both double action and single action mode. By testing I mean pull the trigger in single action and watch the front of the pistol when pulling the trigger and see what direction you are moving it in. The slightest amount of movement can translate to a number of inches off the center at seven yards. As you increase your shooting distance out to 25 yards that movement of the muzzle in a particular direction can translate easily into 6 to eight inches off at 25 yards. Repeat the test in double action and you will move the muzzle even further.
To shoot good groups with a Canik or Sar in stock configuration you must master the stiffer triggers. Sight upgrades are only going to do one thing and that is to improve overall sight picture. Now we have put thousands of rounds through 2 Caniks and 2 Sar pistols last year shooting IDPA so we have worn the triggers in nicely ,but they are still stiffer than our custom Caniks which have nice buttery smooth upgraded triggers from Dave at CGW. The custom Caniks shoot wonderful double tap groups easily into the head of and IDPA target and usually the group size is an ich or under for a rapid double tap. Accuracy overall beats our stock Caniks dramatically.
So test your pistol while unloaded and see what direction you are pushing the muzzle when you are pulling the trigger. Now improving sight picture is not a bad thing, the stock sights get the job done ,but there is always room for improvement. As we get older like me 54 the eye's sometimes need some help. In my case I neeed a wider rear sight notch and a green fiber optic front sight so I can easily pick up a fast sight picture for IDPA so improving sights is not a bad thing. Last sometimes we actually find a pistol that does not shoot to point of aim so some tinkering with front and rear sights is required. In most cases that I have encounted it is a trigger issue not a sight issue. Again I do not wish to offend anyone I am just trying to help solve the problem, but it must be diagnosed properly. Brian / EFR
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I'll be following this thread with interest too as I just ordered a Stingray C.
Hopefully, the issue has a good resolution and please keep us informed as to what it is.
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I'll be following this thread with interest too as I just ordered a Stingray C.
Hopefully, the issue has a good resolution and please keep us informed as to what it is.
Where did you order your stingray from?
Posted using my phone.
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I'll be following this thread with interest too as I just ordered a Stingray C.
Hopefully, the issue has a good resolution and please keep us informed as to what it is.
Where did you order your stingray from?
Posted using my phone.
Go get one!!
They've got all four top finishes in cerokote!!
At an awesome price!!
http://www.jgsales.com/handguns-c-16_790.html
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I'll be following this thread with interest too as I just ordered a Stingray C.
Hopefully, the issue has a good resolution and please keep us informed as to what it is.
Where did you order your stingray from?
Posted using my phone.
Go get one!!
They've got all four top finishes in cerokote!!
At an awesome price!!
http://www.jgsales.com/handguns-c-16_790.html
That's where I'm looking at also. What color did you order? I'm planning on getting the titanium one.
Posted using my phone.
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I'll be following this thread with interest too as I just ordered a Stingray C.
Hopefully, the issue has a good resolution and please keep us informed as to what it is.
Where did you order your stingray from?
Posted using my phone.
Go get one!!
They've got all four top finishes in cerokote!!
At an awesome price!!
http://www.jgsales.com/handguns-c-16_790.html
That's where I'm looking at also. What color did you order? I'm planning on getting the titanium one.
Posted using my phone.
That's the one I ordered! Looks sweet! ;D
Here's an example of what their titanium finish looks like!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hTYBCuZwgg
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RogerCZ75Bfan you got the Canik shark compact be advised that you can change the rear sight ,but there are no options currently available for the front. I have a custom Shark compact that I built using Cajun gun works trigger parts and I drilled out the front sight by hand and made it an over sized fiber optic ftont. It is one of my favorite pistols.
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RogerCZ75Bfan you got the Canik shark compact be advised that you can change the rear sight ,but there are no options currently available for the front. I have a custom Shark compact that I built using Cajun gun works trigger parts and I drilled out the front sight by hand and made it an over sized fiber optic ftont. It is one of my favorite pistols.
He is getting the Stingray-C. The video is just for color reference.
Posted using my phone.
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RogerCZ75Bfan you got the Canik shark compact be advised that you can change the rear sight ,but there are no options currently available for the front. I have a custom Shark compact that I built using Cajun gun works trigger parts and I drilled out the front sight by hand and made it an over sized fiber optic ftont. It is one of my favorite pistols.
Thanks Brian. Sounds like some really nice mods you made to your Shark-C. Appeciate the tips. However, Jose is right, I ordered the Stingray-C in the titanium finish and the video is just for reference to the different finishes.
BTW, are my options for the Stingray-C the same as you mentioned above regarding the Shark-C?
Or are there more sight options available for the Stingray? (presumably there are more of them out there as they more closely represent a very popular CZ model)
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On the stingray you can use many different Cz sights on the Stingray no real issues -only minor fitting required.
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Brian,
Are you (as in your business, Easton Firearms Refinishing) able to fit Meprolight Tritium night sights to a Stingray-C?
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I don't think that would be an issue , we do a lot of sight installs on caniks, and now sars products as well as CZ's.
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Fantastic. PM'd ya.
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Brian,
Are you (as in your business, Easton Firearms Refinishing) able to fit Meprolight Tritium night sights to a Stingray-C?
Did anything ever come of this? I got a set of the CGW sights to put on my (not yet here) P-120, and was thinking about a set for the Stingray as well if I like them, but the rear dovetail is significantly larger on the Stingray than the other Caniks that the CGW sights are designed for.
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Hey p4R4d0x,
Brian told me that he could fit the regular cz mepros to the newer stingray's with the fixed sights but the older adjustable rear sighted models, like mine, have a wider rear notch in which the mepros would not fit. My thoughts are that no fixed sights for the CZs will fit the adjustable rear Canik 55 Stingray-C models.
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Hey p4R4d0x,
Brian told me that he could fit the regular cz mepros to the newer stingray's with the fixed sights but the older adjustable rear sighted models, like mine, have a wider rear notch in which the mepros would not fit. My thoughts are that no fixed sights for the CZs will fit the adjustable rear Canik 55 Stingray-C models.
Thanks for the reply! Unfortunately, the new Stingray-C's without adjustable sights still have a larger dovetail. :-\ I have a fixed-sights Stingray-C and the rear dovetail is significantly larger than CZ's and other fixed-sight Caniks (like my P-120). It appears to have the same dovetail as the adjustable-sight ones, actually. I'm guessing I'm out of luck even with the fixed sight one, then, haha.
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Oh, interesting to know that. Hey maybe Canik will start a tritium option hahaha.
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Can we have Century change out the sights for no charge?
When you go to buy a pistol, there is a reasonable expectation on the part of the paying customer that the gun will shoot point of aim. He should NOT be compelled to go out and buy replacement sights just to make the gun shoot properly.
Do you agree?
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I called Century Arms and spoke to a rep about the POA/POI issue with the Stingray-C. She said that she will contact their tech department to see if they have a shorter rear sight (I bet they don?t). She said worse case scenario would be sending my pistol in and once confirmed it shoots high they would send me a new pistol and test fire the new one to make sure it shoots the same POA/POI. We?ll see what happens. She said she would respond to me via email once she has an answer.
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I called Century Arms and spoke to a rep about the POA/POI issue with the Stingray-C. She said that she will contact their tech department to see if they have a shorter rear sight (I bet they don?t). She said worse case scenario would be sending my pistol in and once confirmed it shoots high they would send me a new pistol and test fire the new one to make sure it shoots the same POA/POI. We?ll see what happens. She said she would respond to me via email once she has an answer.
Thanks for the update. Sounds like excellent customer service if turns out to actually happen that way.
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I just spoke to CIA again today. They said that the dovetails are the same on the rear sight for both the adjustable and fixed sight model (Stingray-C). They don't have any different sizes for the rear fixed sight, but they do have adjustable sights in their inventory. They are shipping me the adjustable sight at no charge and said I would have in about 10-12 days. :D
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Hey that's excellent. I'm glad customer service came through for you. Just to add to how good they are, I actually got a follow up e-mail from them a week ago making sure I was still enjoying my pistol. It was nice of them to follow up like that. Very friendly people.
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Thats great that they are sending out a set of adjustables Paul!
Now you can get that one dialed in as well.
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Hopefully it works out. Now I have to try and get the rear sights off of the Stingray-C. :o
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I got the Stingray-C rear sight off. I unscrewed the two small allen screws and let the rear sight soak in PB Blaster for about 20 minutes. I then put the slide in a wooden padded vice. I used several moderate hits with a nylon punch and a brass hammer and the rear sight came right out. There was no damage to the slide or dovetail either. Now I will wait for the sight to arrive and then install it.
(http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f382/prsalazar/photo5_zps4d74b02b.jpg)
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My new LPA adjustable sight came in from CIA today. It required a little fitting, but looks pretty darn good. I'll shoot the pistol in a few days when I'm in Colorado and will report back. I did measure the height of the rear sight on its lower setting. It measured about .040" to .045" shorter than the original rear fixed sight. According to my calculations, if the new LPA sight is left on the lowest setting it should lower my point of impact by 2" to 2.25" at 7 yards, which I think could be what I need. We'll find out!
(http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f382/prsalazar/photo17_zpse3499225.jpg)
(http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f382/prsalazar/photo24_zps728390fb.jpg)
(http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f382/prsalazar/photo35_zpsbd61f75b.jpg)
(http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f382/prsalazar/photo43_zpsf9be6d23.jpg)
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DexterGSP,
Nice! good to see they came through with it.
You guys have fun up there in Colorado, I'll be thinking about you while I sweat it out here in our triple digit temps. Ha, ha.
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I got back from Colorado yesterday. I made the trip with flyingbrass and my son. It was a pretty nice trip. The weather was beautiful, but a little windy. We caught nine trout between us and went shooting twice.
I was able to shoot the Stingray-C on both shooting sessions and fired my reloads as well as UMC ball. With the LPA sight adjusted all the way down (lowest elevation setting) both the reloads and UMC ball shot about .5? to .75? high at 7 yards and 1.5? to 2? high at 50 feet, which is fine I guess for a defensive pistol. I didn't shoot any rounds at 25 yards, but if I did I suspect the point of impact would have been 2.5? to 3? high.
Well, it?s better than it was. The LPA rear sight reduced the point of impact by about 60% to 70% as compared to the original fixed rear sight.
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My Stingray doesn't fire quite as high as your's did (from what I can tell), so the adjustable sites may correct my similar problem. Thanks for all the info guys.
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Hey guys, I just picked up a Stingray c. I haven't had a chance to fire it yet but from reading threads like this and looking at how short the front sight is, I can see why it's shooting high for folks. Now forget about the rear sight.. Is the front sight the same as other cz's? Can I experiment with taller sights in front? 5.5mm, 6.5mm or even 7.5mm? Will they fit?
Sent from my Nexus 7
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Hey guys, I just picked up a Stingray c. I haven't had a chance to fire it yet but from reading threads like this and looking at how short the front sight is, I can see why it's shooting high for folks. Now forget about the rear sight.. Is the front sight the same as other cz's? Can I experiment with taller sights in front? 5.5mm, 6.5mm or even 7.5mm? Will they fit?
Sent from my Nexus 7
If I recall correctly, the standard CZ front sight height is 5.5mm. I measured my front sight on the Stingray-C and it measured 5mm. You could replace the front sight, but it would require dealing with the barrel bushing and also require fitting. I wouldn't screw around with the front sight unless you really have to. The difference of .5mm (about .02") taller front sight would result in about a 1" higher point of impact at 7 yards, 2.4" at 50 yards and 3.5" at 25 yards. Also, a change in the front or rear sight by .01" or .25mm with result in about a .5" raising or lowering of the point of impact at 7 yards, 1.2" at 50 feet, and 1.75" at 25 yards.
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Hey guys, I just picked up a Stingray c. I haven't had a chance to fire it yet but from reading threads like this and looking at how short the front sight is, I can see why it's shooting high for folks. Now forget about the rear sight.. Is the front sight the same as other cz's? Can I experiment with taller sights in front? 5.5mm, 6.5mm or even 7.5mm? Will they fit?
Sent from my Nexus 7
The problem with my Stingray-C's point of impact was not so much the front sight, but rather an overly tall rear sight. I would have to go back and check my numbers, but as I recall the rear sight was too tall by about 2mm (about .08") or so. Terry mc's Stingray-C shot about the same height as mine.
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I purchased a Canik 55 Stingray-C (black) on NYE (2015) with fixed sights and also ran into the same bleep problem. I absolutely love this firearm! Trigger pull and overall "feel" is excellent! BUT.... At about 10 yards, I was about a FOOT off! Insane! I'm no marksman, but I know for a fact that I'm not that bad of a shot!
At first, I went to Amazon and ordered up a set of CZ-75 sights. Thinking that should solve my issue. WRONG! The dovetail for the rear sight is wider than the sights I ordered. Returned those and back to square one.
I read that some of you guys contacted Century Arms and they sent out adjustable rear sights. But everything I read, it was still shooting a bit high (1-2") with it at its furthest down setting. Not good enough for me. I want my firearms to shoot true.
Tonight I stopped at a local gunsmith's shop, explained the issue, and he came up with a pretty good idea. Seeing that the front sight is so bleep low on these, he suggested tig-welding a glob on top of the front sight (approximately double the current height). Then, take it shooting and file down the slag until I get to the correct height. Once that is done, he'd put his finishing touches on it, and problem should be solved. He quoted me $60.00. Perfect! If all goes according to plan, this guy will be 100% satisfied with his Canik woes. Might be a while until all is complete, but I'll be sure to post the end results.