The Original CZ Forum
GENERAL => General Firearms Discussion => Topic started by: CZ Taji on September 05, 2014, 08:59:07 PM
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Hi folks,
well, I'm asking for a shopping list of basics to make my hand gun experience practical & cost effective.
here's what i thought i needed on such a list. please fee free to chime in on what you think should be had after the initial gun purchase.
1. shooting glasses
2. cleaning supplies , what would you folks suggest & why? i will have to clean 2 guns a po7 & a sdp compact
3. ear protection any suggestions
4. ammo is obvious.
a. would love suggestions for both range and self defense work. range stuff just needs to be accurate out to 50 yds.
i know i want to use hollow points for self defense i like hydro shocks. bullet weight range from 124 gr -147 gr. but that's
about all know
b. can someone tell me how you get zero bullets made. I'm not a reloader & don't plan to be anytime soon.
5. i am gonna see if they have a shock watch for shooters still. i know they used to have them
6. snap caps for dry fire practice ; how many should buy
7. holsters ; if there is a dream holster that both will fit then that would be a plus, but don't need to compromise. i haven't gotten a carry permit yet & i also would have to decide if i was gonna carry belt, iswb or outside . btw I'm fat so i'm sure that would play a role in my decision. any fat boys want to chime in on options you use/like ?
8.gun safe ; what are my most practical options that are economical too. frankly i like the hidden furniture gun holder made by a member here at least for one location in the house like the 1st. floor.
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Definite shooting glasses. Find a nice pair with clear lenses, doesn't have to be fancy.
Definite cleaning kit. There's so many cleaners to choose from that none are wrong. Go with what you like.
Definite ear protection. If indoors, go with ear muffs. Outside, ear plugs or muffs. Don't go real expensive but stay away from real cheap.
Ammo is selective. Winchester, Blazer Brass, Blazer, etc will all work fine. Some pistols like certain brands more. I'm thinking these are 9mm pistols with the grains you put down. Hydra Shocks are fine. I use them, Hornady, HST and Gold Dots. All work.
A watch? Up to you.
I don't use snap caps for dry fire. Buy a pack and use them if you want. YMMV
Holsters are personal. You WILL have a holster drawer or box. Best is if you can try them on. If not, buy and try.
Gun safe is a definite. Price depends on how many weapons you have/want. I have a small Stack On safe for my pistols. If you have rifles and pistols, you need to look at something for both. Prices can vary depending on what you want.
Hope this helps and continue to ask questions. Above all, be safe and have fun.
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You covered it all. You do need to secure the firearm, but a "Gun Safe" my be more than you need. They make some reasonably price lockable metal boxes/cabinets that are a fraction of the price of a traditional "Gun Safe" and still meet state and local requirements for keeping kids away from guns.
Here's an example:
http://www.farmandfleet.com/products/619794-stack-on-pistol-ammo-cabinet.html#.VAto7J_D_lY
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thx. joatmon & steerclr,
i appreciate the help a ton.
Yes, the type of gun safes i speak of are the ones like in your link. but i will have to consider more then just guns so i'll try yo come up with the best i can get at the price that is reasonable. i want to lock up my small knife collection that's worth a pretty penny already .
i may end up with a 3rd pistol down the road most likely, but that will be years away. i can easily save for that one without much of a budget crunch. i do plan on getting a shotgun, but frankly since i have 2 pistols i don't really need the scatter gun.
if i still get one it's going to be an auto with an 18'-20 "barrel max. likely to be 20 Ga. IT WILL JUST BE FOR BAD GUYS WHO COME INTO THE HOUSE. caps bandit struck again. O0
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I have 3 pistols right now and they all fit in my small Stack On safe. At one time I had about 9 pistols and they all fit also.
The 2 rifles I own are not in a safe but the bolt action one has the bolt removed and stored in the safe. The AR has a lock through the action. I have 3 kids and they can be nosy.
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For safety equipment, I favor the Howard Leight active hearing protection (http://www.amazon.com/Howard-Leight-R-01526-Electronic-Earmuff/dp/B001T7QJ9O) and I always use foam earplugs as well. (Once your hearing goes it is too late to do something about it!) A good pair or two of wraparound shooting glasses is a must as well.
You can get cleaning supplies fairly easily - I like those without strong smells since I clean indoors most of the time. I typically use Hornady One Shot as a cleaner/protector and then lube with Weaponshield or some of CGW's excellent grease. I also have a can of Gun Scrubber that I use occasionally to blast out the nooks and crannies if a gun is particularly dirty before normal cleaning.
The most beneficial thing you can do once those basics are covered is budget time and money for dry fire, training and ammo. Once you have some initial training under your belt, dry fire is by far the most beneficial if you are diligent with it. You shouldn't "need" a lot of snap caps - I have 8 or 10 I think and that lets me load up several mags with a couple rounds and practice reloads and failure drills without having to pause every time.
As for ammo... I would say it doesn't matter. As long as you choose good quality defensive ammo (i.e. anything used by law enforcement, not WWB hollowpoints) you are good to go and for practice just use whatever you can find at a good price that works with your guns. If you want to buy in bulk, Freedom Munitions (http://www.freedommunitions.com/9mm-Luger-Ammunition-s/1818.htm) is great to work with. I do try and use the same bullet weight for practice that I carry (147gr) but, honestly, the velocities are usually different enough to where that is not such a big deal as long as you know for sure how the defensive ammo patterns out of your guns. Generally speaking, heavier weight bullets have a higher point of impact than lighter weight bullets.
Holsters are a tough call. Typically what works is so dependent on your physiology that it is hard to recommend anything. I tried every concealment method before sticking with appendix because I had a hard time concealing strong side IWB (and OWB is typically harder to conceal) and I found the draw from behind the hip hard on my shoulders due to having really long arms. That said, choosing a solid belt (Wilderness FF (http://www.thewilderness.com/index.php?p=catalog&parent=142&pg=1) or SOE EDC (http://www.originalsoegear.com/collections/belts)) and a top quality holster (JM Custom Kydex (http://www.jmcustomkydex.com/)) make all the difference. It might be wise, once you have a good belt, to get an inexpensive holster of the type you want to try and just experiment around the house with an unloaded gun - see what works and what doesn't and then you'll know better what you want out of a good holster. I did this and it saved me from having a box of holsters I couldn't use.
Good luck!
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You can save yourself some money & download free targets on the internet. Just google 'Free Targets"
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You can save yourself some money & download free targets on the internet. Just google 'Free Targets"
i saw the free targets, but how do you folks deal with the size of the targets that are printed. they seem awfully small.
8 1/2 by 11 inch pages approx.
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Start at about 7 yds when you start shooting, you'll be surprised what you can hit. Remember focus on the sights and not the target. The sights need to be crystal clear in you field of view. If anything let the target be slightly out of focus, but keep the sights sharp.
ENJOY
(http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/606/cz857yds.th.jpg) (http://img155.imageshack.us/i/cz857yds.jpg/)
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Shoot small, miss small
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Ok, I gotta ask. What the heck is a "shock watch"?
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"Shock resistant" for recoil??
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1. Check out your local military surplus store. My dad, brother, and I all purchased new Revision Sawfly kits (http://www.amazon.com/Revision-Military-Sawfly-Kit/dp/B007HKPAA6) for around $10 a piece.
2. It really boils down to personal choice, clean and lube often and you'll be fine. For me, I recently switched for One-Shot Cleaner and Lube after reading this, http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=546316
3. Anything really. You can get the basic plugs for cheap, go with Ear-Pro's (hope they fit 100%), muffs, or go up to battery powered muffs. They all work, it boils down to convenience. Do you want to remove plugs to hear & have to stick them back in, take off a pair of muffs, or leave them on all the time.
4. Bulk ammo for me.
5. Don't know.
6. Just a couple, they'll last quite a while as long as you don't mind their paint jobs wearing off.
7. Get one that works well with the gun and your sytle of carry. There really isn't a great one brand fits all purposes.
8. I don't have one, so can't really comment on this.
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Ok, I gotta ask. What the heck is a "shock watch"?
I had a hard time finding it online. This came out back in the early to mid 70's. i was still using one back in 77. The racket choices i made weren't optimal for my elbow. The rackets were too stiff & i paid for using them.
iT'S A GADGET that is supposed to dampen shock so your whole arm isn't adversely affected by continuous/ongoing shocks like that encountered in playing tennis or shooting. I used to use one as a tennis player who played daily for seriously long periods of time. I had gotten tennis elbow and i wanted some relief so i tried one. i can honestly say at least the tennis elbow it didn't get worse.
It's mercury inside it. this new version in the link i can't say much about. just found it moments ago. Yet, the original shock watches were advertised for shooting sports, i just didn;t find that out until years later. http://www.amazon.com/Tennex-Elbow-Shock-Watch-Black/dp/B002N1OJSI
Proven to relieve and prevent Tennis Elbow, Golf Elbow and Repetitive Stress Injuries like Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. Why suffer? Experience the power of pain-free play or work!
The Tenex? Elbow Shock Absorber watch is bio-engineered to provide effective relief from shock vibrations. At the heart of each Tenex? Elbow Shock Absorber is a spherical module of high density liquid metal with exceptional shock absorbing power. Clinical testing shows that up to 70% of vibrations produced upon impact are eliminated by wearing Tenex? Elbow Shock Absorber.
The Elbow Shock Absorber Story: Independent studies conducted in the USA, Canada and France (at the prestigious MIT laboratories in the US), have consistently demonstrated the effectiveness of Tenex? ESA in protection and prevention of tennis and golfers elbow. In fact, any injuries due to sudden or repetitive impact ? from baseball to hammering, pounding or typing on a keyboard ? can b avoided when wearing Tenex? ESA.
How does it work? Upon sudden impact or during repetitive actions, harmful vibrations travel up the arm where they can cause damage. When worn on the wrist, Tenex? ESA absorbs these vibrations before they have a chance to reach the soft tissues of the wrist and elbow. A specially formulated liquid metal, sealed inside Tenex? ESA, produces a counter wave action that effectively neutralizes vibrations whenever your arm receives shock.
Fully Adjustable Straps: The Velcro? straps can be adjusted at both ends. If you still need to shorten it, you may cut off part of the hook ends to further adjust the strap to your wrist size.
Self-gripping Velcro? fastener.
Soft nylon absorbent backing.
Extended wear 20,000 times.
Washable design.
Fully adjustable.
High impact polycarbonate IZOD construction.
Ultra violet resistant.
Ultrasonically welded.
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You'd have to shoot a crap load of ammo to give yourself tennis elbow.
I suppose if you already have it, a forearm strap or elbow brace can't hurt anything.
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You'd have to shoot a crap load of ammo to give yourself tennis elbow.
I suppose if you already have it, a forearm strap or elbow brace can't hurt anything.
that was funny, but The shock watch for shooters isn't aimed at tennis elbow for shooters. I do imagine that the same strain still goes through the arm and ends with the shoulder and surrounding musculature though imho.
I have arthritis and 2 bad shoulders so i seek to do all i can not to make matters worse. my shooting shoulder has a tear in it as viewed by MRI, we haven't delved into the off shoulder yet medically. that is already on the radar though as i have already had fresh x-rays taken of both shoulders. I rather err on the side of caution these days for sure. btw that dude in your avatar was my favorite character on that show.
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Gun is in the house already btw i picked it up yesterday! ;D Only things i have bought so far are as follows.
1. ess shooting glasses the cross bow model 3 lens kit approx. 50$ plus shipping
2. packs of tipton snap caps approx. 13$ free shipping
3. Hopees small gun cleaning kit: walmart approx. 10$ + tax
4. Gun cloth to lay out the gun and tools
5. a pack of patches -3/4 $ walmart
6. a gun cloth to wipe the gun down and lightly lubricate it walmart price ? oops
that's all so far. I'm about to order my CZ hoodie before the big boys make a mad run on that size. 8)
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I think tendonitis is fairly common among competition shooters. Go to a match and look for people wearing arm bands around their forearms... However I don't think it comes from the shooting. I had a mild case a few years ago and I'm pretty certain mine came from nightly dry-fire sessions and all the repetitive motion that comes from reloading 15-20K rnds a year. I may only shoot 200-500 rnds in a week, but I have a fairly regular dry fire regimen where I will do a couple hundred draws, and god knows how many trigger pulls and transitions in a single session. I think that is where my tendonitis came from.
Mine took me about 4-5 months to get over but fortunately it wasn't as bad as some friends of mine had. I did a lot of stretching exercises prior to dry-firing or reloading, ate a ton of jello, wore the arm band for a while, and even had a few sessions of accupunture.
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As far as stuff to get, I suppose it all depends on how much of a gear geek you are. I started out with some basic "stuff" and over the years upgraded when I saw or tried something that I just had to have. I also like having spares (spare ear muffs, back up ear plugs, spare eye wear with different colored lenses for different lighting conditions...). I also started out with a "cleaning kit" but now just have the basic items arranged in various plastic bins from a tackle shop or on a shelf in my toy room. Old tooth brushes come in handy as do q-tips for cleaning. I save old t-shirts and turn them into gun rags.
I do recommend a decent gunsmith screw driver set. Most screws on guns are not cut for your basic screw driver and its easy to booger up the screw heads if you're not using the right bit. You can get a basic set from Brownells or Midway for $20 or go crazy and get one for much higher... Figure out what tools are used commonly with your guns and buy them.
I do have a smaller kit in my range bag for the times you need to take your gun a part or even clean it (once dropped an unloaded gun at a match and it just happened to be in a very dusty -think flour dust- area) and that has some duplicates of what I have at home -just smaller.
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AMMO!
If shooting outdoors, A Ball Cap!
An Uplula magazine loader
A gun bag to carry everything.
Anything else will make itself apparent.