The Original CZ Forum
CZ PISTOL CLUBS => CZ82 & CZ83 CLUB => Topic started by: Laufer on May 18, 2015, 09:22:35 PM
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Despite only about 150 rds. having gone through my 'new' 82, operation seems perfect-as good as in the EG/Bulg. Makarovs.
With only the single mag which came in the gun, a spare always has a long-term benefit.
The info on this topic about originals over at Gunboards/Czech has confused me. Even the "mfg CZ" markings on many seem to be aftermarket ???, and unreliable for some.
My magazine has no markings except for the tiny x near the floor plate, and this plate is very thin. The fwd. side has a tiny rectangular hole, with three circular holes at the rear. Is mine from the original Czech or Slovak factory? :-\
If not, how do you 'authenticate' the correct type, or identify an aftermarket product which might be reliable enough for "carry" next winter (verified with lots of ammo)? I learned quite a bit about deceptive magazine marketing and markings, after buying a Ruger Mini 14 several years ago.
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If you go to gunbroker and search CZ83 mags you'll find Robertsons Trading Post auctioning 3 new CZ83 mags still in CZ packaging for $99. If you call him he has used CZ83 mags at 3 for $79 and the more you buy the cheaper they get. I think he has a couple of thousand of them and if they have a problem he said he'd replace it.
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I bought a couple of "CZ MFG" mags a while back when OEM mags were really scarce. The workmanship was inferior to OEM mags and they did not work very well. I replaced the magazine springs and followers and now they work OK.
I have a couple used 82 mags and again changed out the spring and followers. I keep spare followers as they can be prone to wear and chipping.
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movingtarget:
I saw nothing from RobertsonsTradingPost- via Gunbroker "Gun Parts", so checking the Robertson** website under magazines, found them.
The floorplate says "mfg CZ", but certain reports claim that, as a brand, these are not the most reliable.
Is there another type which has the fewest complaints, or is the original type very pricey?
Again, my magazine has no inscriptions except for the engraved tiny "x" at the bottom, with short indentations at the bottom, on both sides. Is this the original type/"brand" of magazine for the gun?
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That tiny "X" is actually crossed swords (or cannon barrels, I forget) showing that you have a genuine CZ surplus magazine. That is a good thing.
I bought six "mfg. CZ" magazines from Robertson's Trading Post for $166 delivered back in November, 2013. I thought I had found a 'bargain', but despite their claim that they are "CZ factory" magazines, I do not believe it. Not one of the half-dozen will function through a full loaded mag without some kind of issue, from feeding problems to not locking back the slide when empty.
Spending that much money on a forlorn hope is my own fault - those mags are basically the equivalent of the five "genuine Colt factory" magazines marked "Colt .45" on the base plate that I purchased from Robertson's over three years ago for my 1911.
A search of this forum will yield numerous posts on the topic of the "mfg. CZ" magazines quality. I am loathe to spend more good money after bad to buy new springs and followers to try to get the 'new' mags to work properly. One suggestion was to measure and adjust the opening at the feed lips to bring them into spec. I always meant to give that a try, but never got around to using them again, so I have yet to see if that might help. I spent too much time griping in this post and am out of time for now, but will post the link for the info if no one else does first.
The "mfg. CZ" magazines are better than nothing to avoid constantly reloading one real factory mag when using the pistols to punch holes in paper, but I would not be able to ever count on them for anything important, much less for anything critical like carry use.
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They aren't cheap, but they are authentic and reliable if you buy the CZ-82/CZ-83 magazines directly from CZ-USA.
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Yup -
https://shop.cz-usa.com/ProductDetail/11302_Mag-Cz-83-380-12-Rd (https://shop.cz-usa.com/ProductDetail/11302_Mag-Cz-83-380-12-Rd)
You get what you pay for.
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Thanks very much fellow CZ fans! Ordered the 83 from CZ-USA, which is reported to be the same as the 82 mag.
A different confusion factor is that so many photos fail to portray the crossed swords "x", or the dual indentations at the bottom of the magazines, even on their website. I hope that CZ-USA manufactures true clones of the originals.
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You will be in good shape. The 9x17mm / .380 ACP CZ 83 magazine is the exact same item as the 9x18mm CZ82 magazine
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Found that thread with mag lip opening width info (that was easier to type than it would be to say out loud!)
http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=7603.msg45209#msg45209 (http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=7603.msg45209#msg45209)
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I picked up a used CZ 83 recently, I also ordered a couple of the " CZ Factory" magazines online. These are the ones that sell from $20 to $25.
I had the gun out this morning for the first time. First time around all 3 magazines worked fine. After that the two new "Factory" mags really didn't function well at all. Lots of failure to feeds, and one stopped holding open after the last round.
I believe dlk is on the right track, the springs are very week compared to the magazine that came with the gun. You really do get what you pay for. I may try to find some springs, or most likely just pay the money for the real thing.
The one on the right in the picture came with the gun. Notice the one on the left lacks the depression at the base.
(http://i1208.photobucket.com/albums/cc362/oreocat11/DSCN0774_zpsnvzae4hg.jpg)
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I can't speak for the "surplus" or earlier production magazines but the mags I have seen shipped with late production CZ 83s and at the CZUB store in Prague bear no markings of any kind on the exterior. The closest thing to a marking are two rough circles in the upper lip of the base plate. Sounds like it's best to pay the price for the ones from CZ-USA to ensure receiving a working product.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05/20/5b6f65e0ff95f74c93cd781c383c1d45.jpg)
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Next week when home again will try out the new mag., which was ordered last night.
Will report the function here (or on new topic) after using 100 rds.
Also ordered some 9x18 snap caps for the CZ and both Makarovs.
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Here is the gunbroker listing you couldn't find. It's been active for 50 days.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475707746 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475707746)
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Has anyone tried these from keeepshooting.com?
http://www.keepshooting.com/cz-82-magazine.html
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Yes, I have 2 of them. Installed springs and followers from CZ USA and they still jam on the 9th or 10th round.
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Thanks movingtarget. My new 10-rd. mag from CZ-USA (Kansas City) arrived while I was gone.
"Ceska Zbrojovka", Uhersky Brod", Czech Republic.
??? Baffled. When trying to lock this brand-new mag into place, do people often need to slam it a tiny bit with a fist to fully seat the mag.?
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Yes, I have 2 of them. Installed springs and followers from CZ USA and they still jam on the 9th or 10th round.
Thanks! Glad I checked before I bought them.
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Well I had the CZ 83 out this morning. I had five mags total with me. The original and two new ones from CZ-USA. Then I had the two $20 so called "factory" mags. I had regaped the feed lips and changed the springs to some from CZ-USA.
The Mags from CZ-USA were perfect. The two $20 mags still are junk, a couple of failure to feeds each time used from both. I noticed the front seam is splitting open on one of them. I'll salvage the new springs and figure the rest is a lesson learned.
My advise is just get the ones from CZ-USA, It will save you money in the long run, and they work.
OH, and I love the 83.
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oreocat - may I ask how much the CZ-USA magazines cost?
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Not Cheap, $43 each plus $6.56 shipping. But considering they work and the others don't, for me they are the only option.
https://shop.cz-usa.com/ProductDetail/11302_Mag-Cz-83-380-12-Rd
Midway also has them for $48.49.
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Here is an example of the old saying: "You get what you pay for". Two of the 'real deal' CZ-USA magazines are in my near future.
Thanks for the info!
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Interesting. The $20 mags from J&G Sales that were causing FTF in my CZ-82 are fine in my CZ-83. Not a single hiccup.
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Sorry for any confusion. They are working in my CZ82, running the Makarov ammo.
Interesting. The $20 mags from J&G Sales that were causing FTF in my CZ-82 are fine in my CZ-83. Not a single hiccup.
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I was stung with unreliable new manufacture CZ 82/83 magazines - the ones marked "mfg CZ" on the bottom. Failure To Feed (FTF) are frequent and VERY frequent for the last round in the magazine. Most places selling new CZ 82/83 magazines are selling the same magazines. They are said to be made in "a" factory in Czechoslovakia, hence the "CZ" marking but NOT necessarily by the ?esk? zbrojovka pistol factory. Since ?esk? zbrojovka is actually a consortium it is possible that the mags are made at a sister factory but wherever they are made they are not fully compatible.
I purchased two of these magazines (I think from J&G but my receipt is discarded) and frequent Failures to Feed made me think that my CZ-83 pistol or ammo was bad. However, I discovered that it was the new magazines and that the magazine that came with the CZ-83 worked perfectly.
After some research on gun forums I discovered, too late, that this is a common problem with these magazines. See the AR15-Forum Link below where some folks suspect them to be Chinese in origin. I don't know their origin - I just know that they are unreliable.
https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=5&f=37&t=145296 (https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=5&f=37&t=145296)
My own research disclosed why they fail - they aren't properly made and the jaws, which restrain the top bullet in the stack, are misaligned. I have attached a marked photo that shows the problem and how to identify the bad/fake magazines. View the photo at this link:
http://i.imgur.com/nOuH3rp.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/nOuH3rp.jpg)
I have ordered a used military CZ-82 magazine which, hopefully will work correctly. Military magazines with have a "crossed sword" arsenal marking.
So, beware of these "new" magazines
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There are a lot of places selling cheap "CZ factory magazines". They are terrible.
CZ-USA sells the real deal. They aren't cheap, but they work reliably (which is the whole point).
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There are a lot of places selling cheap "CZ factory magazines". They are terrible.
CZ-USA sells the real deal. They aren't cheap, but they work reliably (which is the whole point).
+ 1
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There are a lot of places selling cheap "CZ factory magazines". They are terrible.
CZ-USA sells the real deal. They aren't cheap, but they work reliably (which is the whole point).
+ 1
Unfortunately, I am $60 in the hole with these junk fake CZ magazines that perpetuate all of the sellers on the Internet. The sellers claim that they are a CZ factory magazines, however, they're from A factory but they're not from the CZ factory.
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Robertsons trading post I mentioned in my earlier post sold me 3 used mags for $75. Two out of three had problems. They also sell "new" CZ mags at 3 for $99. I called with my complaint and returned the used mags. then I told them I wanted three of the new ones but only if they have the indention on the bottom of the mag. They found three like that in their stock, and I paid the $24 difference. I have 2 CZ83's and have not had one problem with these mags. At $33 each I'm pretty happy.
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So, if the clips have what looks like the "X" but is really the crossed swords along the side near the bottom (but not on the actual "butt" (bottom) of the clip, those are authentic Czech military issue, right? And that's good because ... they go with our military issue guns, right?
Thanks.
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So, if the clips magazines have what looks like the "X" but is really the crossed swords along the side near the bottom ... those are authentic Czech military issue, right? ...
Yup.
Nothing I have found will work as well as genuine CZ magazines, either the surplus with 'crossed swords' or new ones from CZ-USA.
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Thanks!
I didn't know about this when I purchased my extra clip, but I lucked out and it ha the fat X!
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That's too bad about Robertson's CZ-82/83 mags. Apparently the only reliable source is CZ-USA. Can you first ask a seller or different business to tell you the names on the mag's package?
If they can Spell the words "Uhersky Brod" or another authentic Czech name, you should be ok, unless they cheat and read it from the Internet.
As a side note this is Not about any Czech issues.
I drove to Robertson's and bought a second Polish P-83 last July. Superb handguns. They then had seventeen of them and let me try several triggers.
As a reminder, my CZ-82's mag from Uhersky Brod is a 10-rounder, not 12 (it doesn't matter to me). Maybe they must now be CA legal, or such?
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Thanks for this thread! I'm having regular FTF issues with two surplus cross-swords magazines that came with mine from AIM Surplus (put in new CZ-USA springs, will try followers next).
I tried the 8.5mm lip width trick (they were measuring around 9mm) but that just made it worse.
Was curious about the keepshooting mags but looks like they're getting mixed reviews as well.
So I'm going to order an authentic CZ-USA mag and try that. On another thread, someone else listed several links to authentic CZ-USA mag retailers other than CZ-USA directly, so it's possible to save a couple of bucks, depending on their day-to-day pricing:
http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=65365.msg514645#msg514645
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Thanks for this thread! I'm having regular FTF issues with two surplus cross-swords magazines that came with mine from AIM Surplus (put in new CZ-USA springs, will try followers next).
I tried the 8.5mm lip width trick (they were measuring around 9mm) but that just made it worse.
Was curious about the keepshooting mags but looks like they're getting mixed reviews as well.
So I'm going to order an authentic CZ-USA mag and try that. On another thread, someone else listed several links to authentic CZ-USA mag retailers other than CZ-USA directly, so it's possible to save a couple of bucks, depending on their day-to-day pricing:
http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=65365.msg514645#msg514645
Update: I ordered from Rogue Elite. Price with shipping to Texas was $39.99 + $5 shipping. Came in CZ-USA packaging and looks identical to my surplus factory mags EXCEPT no cross swords (maybe not on the new production mags?) and the follower looks less worn and subtly reshaped, hopefully for improved feeding. If this mag works well, I may try its new follower in my older mags to see if that fixes things, and use the lip width as a guide for adjusting the old ones.
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Looking at the mags without the grooves on the bottom, they remind me of some S&W Model 59 aftermarket mags I had. Factory S&W mags have the grooves at the bottom, the aftermarket do not. Factory worked fine, the ones without the grooves allowed the springs to kink under compression when full, and cause FTFs. The grooves in the bottom of the sides on factory double column magazines (from all manufacturers) are designed to keep the coils stacked one atop the other under compression. No grooves to keep them centered, they squish sidewise and can kink.
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I do rotate frequently with a CZ82 Makarov. I ordered 2 new mags from CZ-USA last month. They do have the indentations in the sides but no crossed swords like my 2 originals. They functioned very well with 100 rounds through each one when I finally hit the range. The overall impression was very favorable after taking them apart for inspection, cleaning and lubing before the first range trip. The followers looked 99% compared to my old '88 originals. They now also wear CZ Custom alum. base pads which add a touch of grip for the bottom finger. I'm good for now with 4 good working mags.
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One of my high caps from "back in the day" when I had my original CZ83 20 years ago, has no crossed swords, but is vitually identical, also. IIRC, it is the mag that came in the weapon new. In retrospect, I assumed it was a commercial one, without the military crossed swords proofs. My others have crossed swords.
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Interesting twist. Since I pick up mu 2015 production CZ83 SKU 03101 (10 shot model for ban states) this next week, I was digging out my pre-2000 high caps, from a box of assorted mags I keep in the safe. All three go back to the 90s.
-One, as I said, has no crossed swords, but the indents on the base. Identical to military crossed swords, and has later model stamped base plate lock. It came with the original CZ83 I had 20 years ago.
-One Has crossed Swords, indents on both sides at the base, and late model stamped base plate.
-One has crossed swords, early style base plate lock with steel rivet, AND NO INDENTS IN THE BASE. Smooth side like the cheapos on the market. It is clearly CZ military, though, as the welds are invisible, and angles crisp like the other two.
I am guessing the third is an early military contract one. As for base plate locks, I really thought the 83 I had back in the day had the rivet, but I could have mixed them up when doing the group mag cleaning/oiling when I put them up.
Anyone else have crossed swords with no indents?
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Back when the CZ 82 was being surplused and imported here, I think it was Makarov.com who had real military surplus mags cheap. I bought 10 for under a hundred dollars and they worked perfectly. I guess timing is everything in this business.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Here is my CZ 82 and it came with 4 mags, to bad only 1 is real deal CZ the other 3 are the mfg CZ knock offs,
3 range trips and im ready to toss them, they FTF 3-4 times on each mag when fully loaded.
(http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag156/dduggan69/12345_zps8mcbnu3n.jpg) (http://s1303.photobucket.com/user/dduggan69/media/12345_zps8mcbnu3n.jpg.html)
here is a closer pic
(http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag156/dduggan69/1_zpsyfovynxx.jpg) (http://s1303.photobucket.com/user/dduggan69/media/1_zpsyfovynxx.jpg.html)
(http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag156/dduggan69/2_zpsmoh1bruj.jpg) (http://s1303.photobucket.com/user/dduggan69/media/2_zpsmoh1bruj.jpg.html)
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I am guessing it is the springs. Since CZ is out of springs again, maybe some Wolff BDA or Beretta Cheetah springs.
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I have the good mag apart to compare the number of spring bends.
The good mag has 14 and is longer, the knock offs have 12 and are shorter.
Stretching the springs a 1/2 " didn't help, Ill start comparing mags parts,
Maybe I can fix them and have (3) range mags.
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I had an issue with a Bersa .380 factory mag. The early 7 shot mags had a really, short, cheesy spring, but the newer mags, designed for their more serious concealed carry line of the same pistol have substantial and longer springs. I replaced the old one with a new spring and follower, and it is 100%, including Buffalo Bore +P flying ashtrays! I grabbed four springs from CZ when they had them in stock (one day!). My oldest CZ82 mag has a degraded spring, and doesn't feed. I am sure it was the spring. In my experience, stretching a spring never works.
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There seems to be many magazines sold for the CZ 82/83 that state they will work in both pistols. Don't believe it - the 9mm Mak is 9.91 mm diameter at the neck while the .380 is 9.5 mm. Therefore while all CZ 82/83 magazines will fit into both guns they will only operate when the ammo matches the magazine. To verify this go to www.shop-cz.com (not CZ-USA) and you will fined that CZ sells unique magazines for each round in Europe. The 82 PN is 0032-0040-01ND, the .380 is 0342-0041-03ND, and the .32 is 0342-0040-01ND. I have requested feed lip dimensions twice from CZ USA and they have not responded to either request. Reviewing my 6 magazines on hand the ones that work reliably in my 83 measure about 8.8mm at the front feed lip while the ones that work reliably in the 82 measure about 9.5mm. Only three of the six are marked - 2 marked mfg CZ don't work and one with an X or crossed swords works fine. NONE of the magazines I have ever seen are marked as to caliber thus we are faced with eternal confusion! I just ordered a .380, 12 round magazine from CZ-USA identified as item number 11302, it arrived with a CESKAZBROJOVKA A.S. part numer of 0342-0041-03ND MAGAZINE - CZ 83 FOR CAL 9BR/12. If we can get a solid specification of feed lip dementions I think many of the probles could be solved. Bill
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There seems to be many magazines sold for the CZ 82/83 that state they will work in both pistols. Don't believe it - the 9mm Mak is 9.91 mm diameter at the neck while the .380 is 9.5 mm. Therefore while all CZ 82/83 magazines will fit into both guns they will only operate when the ammo matches the magazine. To verify this go to www.shop-cz.com (not CZ-USA) and you will fined that CZ sells unique magazines for each round in Europe. The 82 PN is 0032-0040-01ND, the .380 is 0342-0041-03ND, and the .32 is 0342-0040-01ND. I have requested feed lip dimensions twice from CZ USA and they have not responded to either request. Reviewing my 6 magazines on hand the ones that work reliably in my 83 measure about 8.8mm at the front feed lip while the ones that work reliably in the 82 measure about 9.5mm. Only three of the six are marked - 2 marked mfg CZ don't work and one with an X or crossed swords works fine. NONE of the magazines I have ever seen are marked as to caliber thus we are faced with eternal confusion! I just ordered a .380, 12 round magazine from CZ-USA identified as item number 11302, it arrived with a CESKAZBROJOVKA A.S. part numer of 0342-0041-03ND MAGAZINE - CZ 83 FOR CAL 9BR/12. If we can get a solid specification of feed lip dementions I think many of the probles could be solved. Bill
Well, only one of my mags for my CZ83 are made for it. All my others are surplus CZ82 mags. They work fine in my 83. Your Mileage may vary....
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There seems to be many magazines sold for the CZ 82/83 that state they will work in both pistols. Don't believe it - the 9mm Mak is 9.91 mm diameter at the neck while the .380 is 9.5 mm. Therefore while all CZ 82/83 magazines will fit into both guns they will only operate when the ammo matches the magazine. To verify this go to www.shop-cz.com (not CZ-USA) and you will fined that CZ sells unique magazines for each round in Europe. The 82 PN is 0032-0040-01ND, the .380 is 0342-0041-03ND, and the .32 is 0342-0040-01ND. I have requested feed lip dimensions twice from CZ USA and they have not responded to either request. Reviewing my 6 magazines on hand the ones that work reliably in my 83 measure about 8.8mm at the front feed lip while the ones that work reliably in the 82 measure about 9.5mm. Only three of the six are marked - 2 marked mfg CZ don't work and one with an X or crossed swords works fine. NONE of the magazines I have ever seen are marked as to caliber thus we are faced with eternal confusion! I just ordered a .380, 12 round magazine from CZ-USA identified as item number 11302, it arrived with a CESKAZBROJOVKA A.S. part numer of 0342-0041-03ND MAGAZINE - CZ 83 FOR CAL 9BR/12. If we can get a solid specification of feed lip dementions I think many of the probles could be solved. Bill
Well, only one of my mags for my CZ83 are made for it. All my others are surplus CZ82 mags. They work fine in my 83. Your Mileage may vary....
I bought one of the CZ-USA supplied .380 magazines. It works equally well in the 82 or 83.
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I have several mags I picked up a long time ago, that are not CZ factory mags. They look suspiciously like the "CZ mfg" mags that are for sale now, but have floor plates with no markings and two weld spots identical to current CZ USA mags. I replaced the springs and followers with ones from CZ-USA and the work flawlessly (they had pretty pitiful springs in them, and the followers didn't seem quite right). I alway assumed they were some foreign contract run, or maybe from some now defunct US magazine manufacturer like National or USA Mags.