The Original CZ Forum
CZ PISTOL CLUBS => CZ82 & CZ83 CLUB => Topic started by: JKale2923 on January 01, 2016, 06:46:00 PM
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I have a CZ-82 and a week or so ago I popped off 2 magazines of Hornady Critical Defense ammo with no issues. I followed up with some ball ammo with no issues either. Then I tried some Hornady Custom and had a couple FTF issues. I figured it was the ammo so I took it home, cleaned it and loaded up 13 rounds of Critical Defense. Today I was out in the wilderness and saw the opportunity to pop off a few rounds. To my surprise, I must have had 5 or 6 FTF issues with the ammo I thought was optimal. All I can think of is the last time I cleaned it, I only used CLP and left it very wet. Is this a problem with CZ-82's? Or....I had just replaced the recoil spring with a 16 pounder. Does it matter which way that slides on? I am thinking maybe I installed it backwards? Today I took it home and cleaned it the old fashioned way with Hoppe's and just wiped everything down with a remoil cleaning patch afterwards plus I reversed how to installed the spring. Any idea what else I could try? I know I used a magazine that previously worked, but ordered new magazines and magazine springs anyway. I would be interested to know if Hornady ammo has caused anyone else issues?
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The mystery to my is how you had a good day with it. Love my CZ-82 but I have yet to find a hollow point that it will feed reliably. It *really* prefers FMJ.
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well I rechecked my magazines and noticed the one that did not fire well today does not have an X stamped on it like the others nor does it pop out and back in quite as easily as the others. I am thinking it is possible somehow I passed over the magazine I used today last week when I had a good day. The only other possible difference is the way I cleaned it. I didn't use an CLP this time and only left a light trace of oil on the rails. I am used to cleaning ARs and used to running them wet. Maybe the CZs like to run dryer?? I will try and get to the range tomorrow and see how it does with other mags and less lube. I was just discouraged today because I thought Hornady Critical Defense was the perfect carry round and like you I love my CZ-82. I was hoping to at least use it as a car gun.
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Well after shooting today I am going to have to start thinking my CZ did not like the heavy CLP cleaning I gave it the other day. Today I took my CZ-82 to the range after a Hoppe's cleaning followed by a light coat of remoil and I loaded another magazine up and popped off 12 shots without an issue. I loaded another mag with Silver Bear ball ammo and that fired 12 times. On my 3rd magazine I had a couple instances where the slide locked open before the magazine was empty, but that was easily cleared by pressing the slide release. I filled a couple more magazines with ball ammo and did have the slide release lock open before the mag was empty a couple of times, but my performance was much better than yesterday, with every other round failing to feed. No more CLP on my CZ.
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I have not tried JHP ammo, but my CZ82/83 pistols have always been lubed with Breakfree CLP and run flawlessly. They run a full box of 50 each time.
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On my 3rd magazine I had a couple instances where the slide locked open before the magazine was empty, but that was easily cleared by pressing the slide release. I filled a couple more magazines with ball ammo and did have the slide release lock open before the mag was empty a couple of times,
Double check the spring tension on the slide lock/release. It could be loose allowing the lock to jump up in recoil. I had to tweak mine, when I got the same symptoms you are talking about.
Also check your grip, you might be engaging it unintentionally.
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On my 3rd magazine I had a couple instances where the slide locked open before the magazine was empty, but that was easily cleared by pressing the slide release. I filled a couple more magazines with ball ammo and did have the slide release lock open before the mag was empty a couple of times,
Double check the spring tension on the slide lock/release. It could be loose allowing the lock to jump up in recoil. I had to tweak mine, when I got the same symptoms you are talking about.
Also check your grip, you might be engaging it unintentionally.
Thanks, how do I even get to the slide lock spring? I have the pistol broken down now with the grips off, I do not see how to get to the slide lock spring. I do not think it I the grips, I tightened them down firmly before I went shooting today. I had read an article where someone thought loose grips were causing the slide to lock. I must say I certainly have learned a lot about my CZ with this issue. Today I cleaned it better than it was probably ever cleaned before. I took out the extractor and firing pin.
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Look for an exploded diagram for the spring. It's like a straight wire with a small hook on the end if I recall. Needs to be straight. Mine was bent just a little such that the catch wasn't held down out of the way securely. There should be tension holding it down.
I meant your thumb could be raising the catch, not the grips.
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Look for an exploded diagram for the spring. It's like a straight wire with a small hook on the end if I recall. Needs to be straight. Mine was bent just a little such that the catch wasn't held down out of the way securely. There should be tension holding it down.
I meant your thumb could be raising the catch, not the grips.
Thanks, I will look.....I had heard my thumb could cause the issue, so I was very careful to hold my right thumb down with my left far away from the slide release. I do not think it was my thumb.
BTW, when I first got my CZ-82 I was advised to swap out the recoil spring so I got the kit from WOLFF and first replaced it with the 14.5 lb, spring. I had a few jams after that so I installed the 16 pounder. I still have an 18 lb. spring. Which spring do you use>
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My opinion regarding swapping springs is this: Do you think that some guy that you've not met in person and who's opinion you have only read on the internet, and about whom you have no clue to his real world experience or other credintials, knows more than the engineers that designed and tested the gun in the first place? As well as that of the military and police who deployed and used the gun for 10+ years?
I'd put the stock spring back in, or if I felt it needed replacing I'd start with one of stock weight.
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My opinion regarding swapping springs is this: Do you think that some guy that you've not met in person and who's opinion you have only read on the internet, and about whom you have no clue to his real world experience or other credintials, knows more than the engineers that designed and tested the gun in the first place? As well as that of the military and police who deployed and used the gun for 10+ years?
I'd put the stock spring back in, or if I felt it needed replacing I'd start with one of stock weight.
I did have a few jams with the spring that came with the gun so I replaced it with the stock weight, 14.5 lbs. That seemed to be even worse so I went up to 16 lbs. I have read many people use 18 lbs. I am curious why unless everyone assumes bigger is better. You are correct, I would start with whatever is closest to the original designer
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I haven't heard of the springs affecting feeding. A heavier spring trades off less recoil against needing more effort to rack the slide (I run Wolff's heaviest).
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I haven't heard of the springs affecting feeding. A heavier spring trades off less recoil against needing more effort to rack the slide (I run Wolff's heaviest).
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Thanks for the reply Joe. I have more Hornady Critical Defense and some Silver Bear on order. I will try both again and evaluate each magazine closely and which ammo performs the best. I also broke down my gun properly, for the first time, and clean everything out including the firing pin area where the ejector sits. I think I will stick with my 16lb. spring for now. I have noticed a trend in researching the CZ-82s though. It seems common for people to get off 2 or 3 good magazines then start having issues after that. The same thing happened to me. I am ok with that for a self defense gun since I doubt I would need more than 12 or 13 rounds anyway, but makes it frustrating to take a shooting class.
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Three thoughts: 1) I think you have the right idea with Hoppe's and light oil. Both my CZ-82s are much happier dry than wet. 2) Like JoePfeiffer, I have yet to find an HP round that works well with the CZ-82. 3) Stay away from 3rd party magazines...most are junk.
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Three thoughts: 1) I think you have the right idea with Hoppe's and light oil. Both my CZ-82s are much happier dry than wet. 2) Like JoePfeiffer, I have yet to find an HP round that works well with the CZ-82. 3) Stay away from 3rd party magazines...most are junk.
I am finding it is easy to over lube the CZ-82. I actually have had difficulty chambering a round when the feed ramp was soaked with oil. I have been used to cleaning an AR-15 and that firearm likes to run wet, so drips of oil are not a problem. From now on I will just wipe on a thin coat of rem oil on a few key places like the rails and other metal on metal locations and make sure the excess is wiped off.
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I have fired about 1000 rounds through a CZ82 so far. When I first got it, it failed to feed about every third/fourth round. Eventually, I wound up with an education on CZ82 mags. There are many counterfeits out there, that fire the first 2-3 loads just fine, then begin to deteriorate. They average $15-$25 each, and are junk; it is difficult to determine just where they are made, but they are clearly inferior. The ads are misleading; they are sold as, "un-issued", "Czeck", "surplus", etc.
I discovered the $45 mags, at CZ-USA, are far superior to the counterfeits. They are equaled only by true surplus mags, which are distinguishable by an 'X' at the bottom side. Problem is, many of the 'X' mags are worn out; its luck of the draw, when you can find them.
Long story short, I now have three good mags: one surplus, and two CZ-USA, and cannot recall the last malfunction of any kind. I have not noticed any difference, wet with lube, or drier and dirty; I am not meticulous on keeling it clean, either. It eats JHPs all day, and loves Hornady CDs (when I can afford them), but has never liked JHPs.
I too, run an 18# spring, and agree, spring strength, within the available strengths' range, does not affect reliability. Stronger springs are a trade off: more muscle to rack the slide, but results in reduced recoil. If anything, heavier springs are easier on the gun, since the slide does not slam to the rear as hard.
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I have 3 of those "counterfeit" mags you are talking about. I fell for the cheap price, but will not use them for anything accept practicing on the range. I have 3 mags with the X on it. One was giving me jams so I swapped out the spring. My last trip to the range it was ok. My biggest issue now is just loading. Sometimes when I rack put a new magazine in and rack, the HornadI y bullet fails to feed. Even if I lock back the slide, push in a new mag and release the slide it can hang. Maybe it is just the shape of the Hornady Critical Defense bullet. I put in an 18# spring and that may improve things. The last time I locked the slide back and loaded it did feed but I heard it pause for about a tenth of a second as it was feeding. I think the stronger spring may have given it an extra push.
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JKale,
Compare the lips of the feed chute, between the one 'X' mag that jams and the two that don't. If you don't have dial calipers, another way to compare is to run your finger tip back and forth, between the lips. Either way, remove the spring and follower first. Odds are, the defective mag chute will be a little wider, at the forward edge. That allows the round to point upward a little too far, and mis-align with the feed ramp. Use something like needle nose pliers to carefully bend it inward, to match the other two. For final check, compare the round position as it exits the chute. Of course, its safest to use dummy rounds for this.
That is how I salvaged the one surplus mag. They only wear wide, after many thousands of rounds fired. Once adjusted, they are once again good for many more rounds. But the counterfeit mags do the same thing after only a few loads, due to the weak metal that simply bends outward. To compare the difference in metal, use the pliers to bend the lips on one of the counterfeits, then try an 'X' mag. The difference is night and day.
I highly recommend the CZ-USA mags. :)
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The mystery to my is how you had a good day with it. Love my CZ-82 but I have yet to find a hollow point that it will feed reliably. It *really* prefers FMJ.
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Mine loves silver bear HP'S.
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I would stick with factory recoil springs. I have had zero FTF with Hornady Critical Defense or Buffalo Bore 90 grain JHP +Ps. I replaced all of my magazine springs with new factory CZ-USA springs, though. I do have one magazine with crossed swords that always FTF the second to the last round. Even some no-name mags (not the CZ MFG ones that are floating around) that feed perfect, though they have new CZ USA springs in them.