The Original CZ Forum
GENERAL => General Firearms Discussion => Topic started by: joel0019 on March 29, 2017, 06:25:06 PM
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Whats every one take on this Do you carry a expensive hand gun and risk it being confiscated or do you carry not so expensive gun example glock or hk cz or sig you get the idea . Now for me i don't mind carrying a expensive handgun because i believe my life is worth it however just cause you buy a 1000 $ gun doesn't make it any more reliable then the 500 $ gun still is this some sense of security knowing you paid more for a quality gun ?
Here is my carry gun feel free to include yours
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What? Who is going to confiscate my handgun?
HKs and Sigs aren't expensive? What's the criteria for judging something 'expensive'?
250$ to some people is a lot of money, 5000$ to others is chump change.
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I have thought of this & my problem has been old guy decision making. I use to buy cheap chain saws & have to replace them every year and a half until finally I bought a Stihl. That has lasted 10+ years and saved money in the long run...
I now buy handguns with the same thought process. I don't let money be my deciding factor. If I don't have the money, then I will save until I do. If it gets confiscated, then so be it. I will replace it with what I want no matter the cost.
Now here is the tricky part, if I decide that a DW for 1500 is just as good as the Wilson Combat at 3000, then the DW wins...
My CCW is an $800 Browning.
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What? Who is going to confiscate my handgun?
HKs and Sigs aren't expensive? What's the criteria for judging something 'expensive'?
250$ to some people is a lot of money, 5000$ to others is chump change.
Well to some and this includes me anything over a 1000 is expensive for a hand gun especially if you wanna compare to whats available now
As for confiscating I meant in a self defense situation or any situation that reason for police to confiscate a gun
If 5000 for handgun is not expensive for you then which ever number you consider to be expensive for a handgun use that as the example don't make the question harder than it has to be Grendel
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What? Who is going to confiscate my handgun?
HKs and Sigs aren't expensive? What's the criteria for judging something 'expensive'?
250$ to some people is a lot of money, 5000$ to others is chump change.
Well to some and this includes me anything over a 1000 is expensive for a hand gun especially if you wanna compare to whats available now
As for confiscating I meant in a self defense situation or any situation that reason for police to confiscate a gun
If 5000 for handgun is not expensive for you then which ever number you consider to be expensive for a handgun use that as the example don't make the question harder than it has to be Grendel
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I didn't say 5000 wasn't expensive. I was asking you to clarify why you thought HKs, Sigs and the like were not.
If the police are confiscating my gun the price of the gun is the least of my concerns.
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Yeah, better to hold up a liquor store with a saturday night special. Why take an expensive gun for that job?
Seriously though you may be overthinking it. Agee with Grendel, you'd have much bigger problems on your hands. Maybe worry more that you might scratch that expensive looker when you scrape against something doing chores, getting into a car, etc.
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I don't think that is the case in most selection. If so, we would all be carrying high points...which would be ridiculous!. But carrying a $3500 custom 1911 may be somewhat excessive. I changed over from a H&K p2000sk to a Glock 26 partly for this reason. But then...adding sights and an ahency trigger...it's the same in cost. My summer revolver was a LCR...but then I picked up a s&w 340 that was worked over by Carl Sokol...so it isn't cheap either. If you do shoot someone...justified ot not...it is evidence and will be taken by the police. Google the first person to use his steyr in a justified ccw use in Wisconsin. It took him almost a couple of years to get his pistol back.
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To add: when I decide which pistol to carry on a particular day, the possibility of losing it to the police is number 99 on my list of reasons to pick one over another.
I concentrate more on practicality, ease of concealment (depending on the clothing I'm wearing and where I am going), and most importantly, my proficiency with that firearm.
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If you are going to go through all the effort of carrying a gun regularly then you have an obligation to yourself and everyone else on the street to carry the one you shot best with. Period. If that gun happens to be a $1500 sig or some flavor of 1911 then so be it.
If you burned all your options and had to bring it to bear you now have a whole host of problems you have to work through and the very last thing on your mind will be what the gun cost ... except you may wish to sell it to put a tiny down payment on a lawyer.
Adding .. shooting up property or innocents because you carried a convenient or inexpensive gun that you werent proficient with and the world turns sucky fast.
Having said all that .. I dont know that expense dictates your proficiency and expense isnt necessarily a measure of your success with it. I will admit .. I had a Springfield TRP I coudnt miss with. It was amazingly natural for me to hit with it and I carried that large, pricey gun for years. I bowed to convenience for a hot five minutes and bought an LCP. I would have been better off beating someone with it than trying to shoot them because I couldn't hit anything with it. I have had +$1000 sigs I sucked with and one that was a jamomatic.
Since then I have found guns I am very accurate with, that I enjoy carrying and owning and that dont break the bank. My CZ steel compact, My RIA 1911 Commander and my p07 are deadly accurate with no fuss and are all in the $500 range. They are truly for me Point and shoot guns. Hey still pricey to a retired person but not $1400 trp expensive.
So yes .. I would carry an expensive gun without hesitation if it is the one I most naturally shot well with.
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I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
I wouldn't carry my Hammerli or my 627 or my customized 75B. Not because they are too expensive to replace, but because they are too darn heavy.
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When my brother was getting his CCW he asked for my advice for every day carry and I suggested a Charter arms snubbie in 38sp. Let's face it, most all you will ever have to do with it, is carry it. He got it with the aluminum frame and likes his light weight choice.
Keep in mind we have shot all types of hand guns and he owns several, but it fits his bill well for a carry gun. When he carries it, it is in an OWB Bianchi holster under a loose shirt. I would not say it is the cheapest, but reasonable, and if ever used would not be a heart breaker to lose for a while or at all. Also, if it gets beat up from travel and every day use you haven't hurt the value of a high priced gun.
I, being the nice brother I am, treated him to Crimson Trace Laser grips last Christmas and now he has the enhanced capability of the laser, at a cost still less some handguns alone.
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My carry gun is an inexpensive CZ P-07... that I added a Surefire X300 to... and customized with the CGW ProGrade kit... and had the slide milled for an RMR...
All told I have about $1500 in a gun that I shoot well - one I have no qualms about banking my life on should it come to that. It costs what it costs. Peace of mind is worth it.
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I carry my gun because it is reliable. My RAMI is partially Cajunized and the PCR is fully Cajunized. So now they are worth a lot more than $500. To $600. If I should ever have to shoot in self defense, at least I am confident with the gun I am carrying. The money is the least of my worries.
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Cost really isn't really a factor.........usefulness is....I'm not a collector, I shoot what I buy regardless of the cost of the firearm. Guns are "tools" and so get treated as such.....used and cared for so when needed they work as expected, and I practice to use them appropriately and proficiently.
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I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
I wouldn't carry my Hammerli or my 627 or my customized 75B. Not because they are too expensive to replace, but because they are too darn heavy.
I have to agree with your observations. Generally I carry a Ruger LCR in 357 or 327Fed IWB in a SoCoKydex LTx holster. I normally carry a speed strip with complete reload in my left front pocket too. I've carried a Sig P229, and a CZ P01, but both can get too bulky and heavy for all day carry when I'm active. When I'm out in the woods, I carry OWB (open carry) a Ruger Bisley 4 5/8ths Flattop 44 Special or a 3 inch S&W 686+.
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I'm not really sure it is practical to expect someone - other than LEOs - to carry 100% of the time. We all have to go to places (depending on state laws) where guns are prohibited, like the post office, a federal building, mall, public sporting events, casinos, inside a school, bar, etc. For instance, I either don't carry or leave my gun in my car parked off federal property if I need to go to the post office or the Social Security office. Here in OK, if you carry in the mall you just have to leave if asked to - you won't get in trouble unless you refuse to leave when asked, so I carry at the mall. In other states, it may be a felony to carry at the mall.
I carry an $850 Sphinx pistol or a $1200 STI most of the time and I don't consider either one 'cheap,' but my life is worth it to me. If I lose one for evidence because I had to use it, they have to give it back in OK unless you're convicted of something.
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For a carry gun, cost should be irrelevant. Dependability is #1. In the event of a self defense incident, you should be lucky to have it confiscated. It means you're alive.
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I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
I wouldn't carry my Hammerli or my 627 or my customized 75B. Not because they are too expensive to replace, but because they are too darn heavy.
Some people don't mind the weight i prefer to carry full size hand guns and I'm sure a lot of other people do to
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My most common carry pistol is a mil-surp vz82 in 9mm Mak.
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I am, I think, the exception to many "rules" of carrying a sidearm. 8) Number one - I am always armed, except at work, and that's because the Dept. "frowns" on firearms inside the wire. ;) If I am off duty, I am armed, period, and don't patronize places that do not allow me to be armed. I also buck the trend towards mouse guns. Right now it's my Cajunized SP-01 Phantom, or my Cajunized P-09. I also insist on carrying two spare mags, opposite side. Balances things out nicely. :) Overdone? Could be, but I'd rather have a whole lot of leftover spare ammo than be found dead with an empty pistol. Dramatic, but many times nowadays it seems the trends are multiple attackers involved in nefarious activities. Having seen the face of Evil, like several here, I know Evil seldom makes an appointment, ( unless it's the IRS, and we still are not allowed to shoot them), so I don't subscribe to that carry Tuesday and Thursday, maybe Monday, but never on Sunday.
My sidearms do cost money, good coin, and it would be very hard for me to pay to replace them plus get the work done on them all over again, but if it works for me that night to help save my life/the lives of others, the investment was perfect. While whichever is languishing in the Evidence Room, I'll carry what I have left, or acquire later, because that one already paid for itself, many times over.
After a shooting I will be far more worried about the cost of the attorneys as there is almost always a court battle, though I do have to throw out a smug, "Arizona no longer allows civil suits for justified acts". Even have that in our state Constitution now. ;)
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I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
When I leave the house I'm armed ALWAYS and it is at least 95% of the time my PCR that is on my hip. Other times it may be the 75B Compact and occasionally you'll find my DW CCO hanging out. You'll only find the little guns on those rare times when atire dictates there's just now way too cinch up the bigger gun.
I consider all my guns expensive,they've all been modded in some way to my personal liking.
Everyone should keep in mind that if you are involved in a shooting your gun is going to be confiscated at least temporarily until the investigation is complete and you are deemed to have been acting in self defense.
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I carry my STI while i wait for for the P 10 to come in , sold my Walther PPS to pay for the p 10 .
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I guess maybe it's a regional thing or maybe, more than likely, a birds of the feather type of thing. I find that most of the people I know that are anywhere serious about carrying EDC carry a larger pistol and more ammo on hand than those that that just claim to carry all the time. The mouse gun people I know carry when it's convenient or their attire is not a hindrance, and it better not be much of a bother in weight or size. I will say there are a few old guys that I know that have been pocket carrying a j-frame for decades every day, everywhere they go and that is what their going to do period.
If you're really serious about carrying it is a lifestyle, as mentioned above, there are places and businesses that you just don't frequent anymore. You buy clothes that work with your preferred style of carry, you don't hang out with people that get up tight about your carrying, seems like you eventually gravitate away from friends that think you're crazy for carrying the amount that you do. I do have friends that carry infrequently or maybe a mouse gun at times but the number is very small compared to the guys that actually carry 17's, 19's, 1911's various full size Sig's etc. and they carry them everyday. I also carry from dressed to undressed, if I'm lounging around in sweats I have a Thunder Wear on, if for some reason I'm not carrying you can bet your life there is at least a pistol within arms reach.
Anyway I'm not to say what you should carry or who you should hang out with, I just think like minds seem to attract like minds in the end. These guys don't want their gun confiscated either but their carry choice is not dictated by the price (well maybe one of them, but he squeaks when he walks) :)
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Another cost doesn't or should not enter into the decision. Might be my $1400 actual customized Kimber or my less than $400 Canik 55. If it wasn't so dang big I'd carry my SP01 Shadow which is what I probably shoot the best since it is what I shoot the most but even a big guy can only handle so much. Anything short of that isn't a problem for all day carry. I also only carry when I am awake.
Probably never carry my 5.56 pistol but that's a whole nuther ball game as they say. Fun gun not carry gun.
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I carry my P07 .40 S&W most days (away from the house).
P07 - $400
RMR - $500
RMR installation costs - can't remember for sure, couple hundred dollars?? Well worth it, whatever it was.
So I've got around $1100 in my carry gun.
Yes, it's worth it. If it helps me survive the encounter and I never get it back I'd be pissed. But I'd be alive so that I could buy another one.
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Reliability wins over any other factor. If the $300 gun is more reliable than the $1000 gun, I'll carry the cheaper one. And vice versa.
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All personal preference and for me, time of year. Most of the time, i carry my P320 carry either appendix of 4 o'clock. When its a little cooler in FL, I can get away with carrying my P226 or Colt 1911 in 9mm. Main thing is i have shot both extensively with SD ammo and know they function with it.
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For a carry gun, cost should be irrelevant. Dependability is #1. In the event of a self defense incident, you should be lucky to have it confiscated. It means you're alive.
+1000. Cost is irrelevant. If you ever need to use a CCW (god forbid) your absolute last concern will be where the pistol ends up.
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If my CCW saves my life and gets confiscated I'll just go buy another that same day to say thanks. Never even thought about the matter to be truthful.
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I've spent way more on ammo than my carry gun costs (Glock 26). I even used it for USPSA as I wanted to be proficient with my carry gun.
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I am, I think, the exception to many "rules" of carrying a sidearm. 8) Number one - I am always armed, except at work, and that's because the Dept. "frowns" on firearms inside the wire. ;) If I am off duty, I am armed, period, and don't patronize places that do not allow me to be armed.
Do they allow you to keep your gun in your car in the parking lot? At one time, Oklahoma did not allow this.
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No, we have a monitored and restricted firearms locker for staff, as all staff are authorized off duty carry per state law. When I arrive/leave work, my Phantom is riding with me. :)
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No, we have a monitored and restricted firearms locker for staff, as all staff are authorized off duty carry per state law. When I arrive/leave work, my Phantom is riding with me. :)
That's even better! Thanks.
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If that pistol happens to be perceived as expensive or affordable isn't a part of my decision process. God forbid I ever find myself in the situation where I have to draw my sidearm. If I have no other option but to draw my firearm, it is my obligation to carry the handgun that enables me to comply with my State conceal carry permit laws, and with which I evidence consistent precision and accuracy taking into account the specific handgun's limitations. If I am forced to discharge a round, then it is in everyone's best interest that I carry the best handgun I can afford to buy that fits the criteria I described.
John Doe is able to achieve concealment, precision, and accuracy utilizing a $250 S&W SD9 VE. I'm not able to achieve the same using that very same SD9 VE. John Doe has the option of using that pistol as his every day carry pistol, I do not. I achieve repeatable, consistent precision and accuracy using a $500 Glock 19 and a $700 CZ 75 PCR. That's what I carry.
If I ever find myself in a situation where I have no other option but to draw my firearm because there is a clear imminent threat to my life, that a bad day. With everything that can go wrong, its best that I take every advantage available and stack the deck in my favor.
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Maybe I look at the question a little different. Its not so much what the guns worth, its whats my life or the lives of my family worth. You can always get another gun.....not so easy to get another life, or family member.
In the event that you have to use deadly force to stop a threat........once the legal proceedings are over, if found not guilty, you will get your piece back anyway. If not.......your not going to need it anyway!!!
With that said, I carry what I shoot the most accurately, not what I can afford to lose. If you ever are involved in a situation where you have to use deadly force to protect yourself......(and I hope your never are), probably if you will get your gun back from the evidence locker, is way, way down on my list of things to do, to get back to normal.
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If that pistol happens to be perceived as expensive or affordable isn't a part of my decision process. God forbid I ever find myself in the situation where I have to draw my sidearm. If I have no other option but to draw my firearm, it is my obligation to carry the handgun that enables me to comply with my State conceal carry permit laws, and with which I evidence consistent precision and accuracy taking into account the specific handgun's limitations. If I am forced to discharge a round, then it is in everyone's best interest that I carry the best handgun I can afford to buy that fits the criteria I described.
John Doe is able to achieve concealment, precision, and accuracy utilizing a $250 S&W SD9 VE. I'm not able to achieve the same using that very same SD9 VE. John Doe has the option of using that pistol as his every day carry pistol, I do not. I achieve repeatable, consistent precision and accuracy using a $500 Glock 19 and a $700 CZ 75 PCR. That's what I carry.
If I ever find myself in a situation where I have no other option but to draw my firearm because there is a clear imminent threat to my life, that a bad day. With everything that can go wrong, its best that I take every advantage available and stack the deck in my favor.
This would be my response as well. money is not a consideration in what I carry. If I need my gun, me being the one alive and unhurt is my main concern. I will shoot what I am familiar with and what I shoot consistently where I am aiming.
RCG
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I know more then a few retired LEOs who carry 1911s everyday. I myself would go with a RAMI, I have shot and really like the P238 now only if CZ can do something Rami Like in .380, smaller of course.
I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
I wouldn't carry my Hammerli or my 627 or my customized 75B. Not because they are too expensive to replace, but because they are too darn heavy.
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The decision to conceal carry is a world of compromises. Where you live, what you wear, employment, what you can afford, what gun you are comfortable carrying and are proficient with. I carry what I like, an OTB P01 (I named her Alice) with some minor enhancements. I don't consider her a cheap gun nor expensive. Where she ends up after a self defense encounter is secondary. Sure I would be sad she is gone, she is after all, like family...however I have another that will slide into the vacant High Noon holster. I don't need a Les Baer but I want one. Would I carry it if I had one? Probably not. I'm in love with Alice. Would I rather have a High Point over a rock? Most certainly. The legal aftermath, I believe, should be something that all of us like minded 'birds of a feather' need to consider. That would no doubt be far more expensive than any Wilson Combat or Nighthawk. Nonetheless, whatever the cost in the protection of my loved ones and or myself is worth it. We all made that choice and took that first step when we bought a weapon for self defense regardless of the price tag.
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IMHO... when you make an adult responsible decision to legally carry a weapon for self-defense,
The "very last " criteria on your list for making that purchase should be whether or not it's going to be confiscated .
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I think alot of people who post what they carry don't honestly carry everyday. Most people who legitimately carry concealed tend to have mouse guns like a LCP, or a J frame. Something that is light weight. For all the guys who say they EDC a 1911, I don't see it. Same with any full size Beretta, K frame, or Sig. An honest EDC gun. I'm not talking about carrying for an hour after work when I go to the grocery store; I'm talking about waking up in the morning and putting it in your pocket or on your belt and not taking it off until you take your pants off at the end of the day.
I wouldn't carry my Hammerli or my 627 or my customized 75B. Not because they are too expensive to replace, but because they are too darn heavy.
I don't pamper my guns nor get all hysterical on esthetics (or the lack there-of).
When I have the opportunity to carry all-day, I choose the G26 or the SW J frame 357 if I know I'll be changing clothes or need to go a little less garment-laden or if lots of changing positions come into play (think sitting, standing, car, etc).
If I have more concealing clothes and know I'll be rather on my feet, I like to take the bigger ones (say Shadow SP01) for a walk (to the grocery store and such) ;)
I'd sooner be afraid of 'ruining' a gun from holster wear or sweat or somehow losing it while carrying (or driving, like in an accident) then having it confiscated by a Leo.