The Original CZ Forum
CZ LONG ARMS => CZ Scorpion EVO => Topic started by: mountainrider on December 22, 2017, 04:15:10 PM
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MODS,
I clicked "reply" to the other red dot thread and an auto suggestion was made to start a new thread. Here it is. If you think it belongs in the big thread, please forgive me. I do too and wont mind if you move it.
Im about to gift myself either this spitfire or the 3x version.
I've read a few negative reviews about the electronics failing when mounted on a scorpion. I've also read a review of the prism shifting from recoil. I believe that was on either a Scorpion or mpx.
There are several older posts here that praise the Vortex prisms. People (we) tend to be in love with their new purchases...then the new wears off. Has this happened to any of you guys with lots of trigger time? Still in love?
FYI, I'm using a UTG Reticle Intensified CQB 3.9" Red/Green dot, I robbed off my KSG to move to my M&P 15-22 and now its on the Scorpion. It's okay. It's strong enough to have survived a few thousand rounds of 12 gauge.
I'm having a little trouble zeroing it on the Scorpion. I'm much more accurate with the stock sites.
I have astigmatism and bifocal glasses. I'm not seeing fuzz on the UTG reticle.
I'm aware of the lifetime warranty and excellent customer service. That really matters but, I intend to put this CZ on the HD front line. I dont ever want to furlough it. Duty bound. 24/7/365! Id like a red dot that dependable.
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I've been running a 1x, original version for 18 months on my scorpion. ~ 3000 rnds. No problems and very satisfied. Only issue was I left it on and ran out the battery. Happily though, the etched reticle was still there, just not illuminated. User error for sure.
I too have astigmatism. Plan to get another of these for my MPX off eBay as the newer version sits too high for me.
(Modified to add: One big win for me is that this sight works for me, with or without my corrective lenses on - which is important to me for HD.)
(Modified Again: To apologize for all the " me's " !)
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That's a real bonus I was unaware of; the reticle's focusability sans glasses. I was pretty well sold on the etched thing anyway but that is huge.
The UTG is mounted to the Scorpions rail without a riser and I'm struggling with achieving a co-witness. Too high too.
Thanks for the heads up on the focus thing.
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I've only shot ~200 rounds since I got mine, but I'm loving it so far.
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Keep in mind that the Spitfire 1X and Spitfire AR 1x are two different scopes.
The 1X has the ability to have part of the base section removed, allowing the scope to mount lower, which is what you want if you are running the factory stock. The AR 1x does not have this ability. It is permanently mounted in a higher position.
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Keep in mind that the Spitfire 1X and Spitfire AR 1x are two different scopes.
The 1X has the ability to have part of the base section removed, allowing the scope to mount lower, which is what you want if you are running the factory stock. The AR 1x does not have this ability. It is permanently mounted in a higher position.
Glad I asked before pulling the trigger and thanks for taking the time to inform me. That is valuable information that I missed. You likely saved me from an e-tail error.
My UTG is 3.9"s front to back and its pretty tight on clearance (without a riser) when racking up that first round. The spitfire looks to be even tighter at 4.3". Anyone wishing they could use a riser to save dragging their knuckles?
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Looks like plenty of room. DOCTACDAD ran it both with and without the 10mm riser.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaF99yqq_RQ&t=408s
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Saw that video but missed the riser difference in a non-AR and an AR spitfire. I did not realize the bi-level was an option. Falls under the "good to know" header, for sure!
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I have been using the Vortex Spitfire 1x and with the exception of the multi height mount came loose (should have loc tite the 4 screws), it has been solid. I don't use illumination so can't say anything about battery life but with an etched reticle, you don't need the illumination. Same for BUIS, I didn't even bother with it.
For mounting on Scorpion EVO, you need the lowest possible mount.
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I've had the 3x on my Scorp for 2 years and have been completely satisfied with it. I wear glasses and the adjustable eye piece helps me out quite a lot. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/b1cca471fd7d0a3306f75cdb56b72d25.jpg)
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
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I've had the 3x on my Scorp for 2 years and have been completely satisfied with it. I wear glasses and the adjustable eye piece helps me out quite a lot. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/b1cca471fd7d0a3306f75cdb56b72d25.jpg)
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
How is the 3x in closer work; say 25'ish yds?
I assume it shows its advantage over the 1x at 100+ yds?
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I have it sighted in @ 50 yds. The 3x at 25 yds doesn't cause me any issues with target acquisition. What helps is the reticle. Placing the circle over the target pretty much ensures a target hit. It works equally well with fast shooting multiple steel targets or slow aimed bullseye shooting. Yes, at 100 yds it does help as you would expect.
I also think the factory steel sights are some of the best I've ever used. The 3x does get removed from time to time just so I can use the steel ones. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171225/c698ae71acbd2899c688bff6ac0f4fe6.jpg)
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A timely thread, my astigmatism makes red dots a poor choice. although I can use one in a pinch, my hits will not be as accurate as they could...that ?dot? looks like a comma to me at best.
I?ve noticed that while the strike fire red dot is on sale constantly, there are never any Spitfire units on sale nor can I seem to find one on the shelf anywhere to actually check it out. Thanks for the feedback folks.
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A timely thread, my astigmatism makes red dots a poor choice. although I can use one in a pinch, my hits will not be as accurate as they could...that ?dot? looks like a comma to me at best.
I?ve noticed that while the strike fire red dot is on sale constantly, there are never any Spitfire units on sale nor can I seem to find one on the shelf anywhere to actually check it out. Thanks for the feedback folks.
I find the Spitfire 1x units almost always on "sale" on eBay. Typical price is $200 to $210 for the best offer with free shipping.
I messed up and got the "AR" version for Christmas (i.e., wrong guidance to the wife), but the little bit extra height does make it easier to use than the iron sites. I was previously considering a reflex sight (Vortex Venom) before, but I found that using my glasses, the dot becomes a "star cluster". Not so good for accuracy. Without my glasses, the dot is fine, but I didn't want to take off my glasses (used mostly for reading - old eyes) when I go shooting.
- DanT Phoenix, AZ
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$269 delivered is the best deal I've found on the 3x. It will be here on or before the 8th.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/112645240159 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/112645240159)
I'm placing my faith in your responses. I've had no touchy feely interaction with the device but I believe all of you.
I look forward to feeling as fondly towards mine as you all seem to.
I'll post up my impressions here after the first range session. Hoping for a warm spell.
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I have it sighted in @ 50 yds. The 3x at 25 yds doesn't cause me any issues with target acquisition. What helps is the reticle. Placing the circle over the target pretty much ensures a target hit. It works equally well with fast shooting multiple steel targets or slow aimed bullseye shooting. Yes, at 100 yds it does help as you would expect.
I also think the factory steel sights are some of the best I've ever used. The 3x does get removed from time to time just so I can use the steel ones.
I agree with you on the stock sights. I am also interested in your 50 yard sighting in process. Did you use a bore sighter as Vortex suggests or just shoot a 5 round group and adjust poi?
Tracking number says mine will be here Tuesday the 2nd. Happy New Year
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I just put a Spitfire 1X on Friday night and took it to the range yesterday. Single digit temps here so went to the indoor range which has a max of 25 yards. Which was fine because I intended on a 25 yard zero.
I removed the 10mm riser to get a better sight picture with my cheek weld. It's not low enough for a co-witness but that is ok since the spitfire has the etched reticle. You aren't worried about dead batteries since the reticle is always visible.
No bore sight so first shot at 7 yards. Low and to the left. A few clicks up and to the right. Out to 15 and a few more clicks. Finally out tho 25. Click click and dead on. Zeroed with 10 shots.
I went ahead and put 200 more thru it at different ranges and speeds on 6 dot targets. This thing is fast to pick up. Then I went ahead and checked zero again. No correction needed.
I bought this with Christmas gift cards so basically free!
Dan(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171231/ec352a170bdd302fd9ff004d8a3be67d.jpg)
Sent from my LG-H932 using Tapatalk
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I?ve been using the Spitfire on my Scorpion for months, and have put about a thousand rounds through it.
I have had no failures. Point of aim has not shifted at all. I haven?t had to adjust anything since day one.
I love mine.
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IIRC, when I first got the carbine and scope I sighted in at 25 yds. The shots were on paper right from the start. So it was just fire a group and adjust poi. Once I quickly got used to how the rifle operated at short ranges I stepped out to 50 and 100 yds setteling on the 50 yd zero. Once again it was group/adjust poi.
This is probably the day of the first 25 yd zeroing since it's on a rest and it's a 25 yd range table.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171231/e746ad191a6bf1cae4889c86c1b7aa7c.jpg)
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Once I quickly got used to how the rifle operated at short ranges I stepped out to 50 and 100 yds setteling on the 50 yd zero. Once again it was group/adjust poi.
What about bullet drop @ 100yds; any moa adjustments required?
I have access to a magnetic boresighter. I cannot fathom this concept possibly producing precision results, but the LGS gets $250 for the thing (BTW, this bore sighter is 75$ on ebay) and swears by it. They aren't even going to charge me for performing the service. If it were a cartridge style with center-adjustable laser I'd have more faith. BUT...I'm tempted (for the sake of science) to check it's accuracy after i old school zero the 3x at the range.
The LGS wouldn't budge from 349$ on the 3x. I paid ebay vendor 269$ shipped on Friday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAy4GR_-eG8
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Once I quickly got used to how the rifle operated at short ranges I stepped out to 50 and 100 yds setteling on the 50 yd zero. Once again it was group/adjust poi.
What about bullet drop @ 100yds; any moa adjustments required?
I have access to a magnetic boresighter. I cannot fathom this concept possibly producing precision results, but the LGS gets $250 for the thing (BTW, this bore sighter is 75$ on ebay) and swears by it. They aren't even going to charge me for performing the service. If it were a cartridge style with center-adjustable laser I'd have more faith. BUT...I'm tempted (for the sake of science) to check it's accuracy after i old school zero the 3x at the range.
The LGS wouldn't budge from 349$ on the 3x. I paid ebay vendor 269$ shipped on Friday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAy4GR_-eG8
Reading up on it a 25 yard zero should be on at 100 yards. When it warms up and I get to the outdoor range I'll test it out.
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I'm sure you noted that the 3x reticle is engineered around the 556 round. I would think the 9mm was dropping noticeably more @ 100yds and require more hold over. More for 147 grain than 115 maybe?
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There was a 3 or 4 moa bullet drop @ 100 yards. With the 3x reticle it's easy to just hold over for it. I don't remember where the hold over is...but you can easily figure it out after a few shots. I was using S&B 115gr FMJ.
I'm not sure how the magnetic laser bore sighter would work on the Scorp because of the angled muzzle break.
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Yes, I know it's designed for 556...but this is why I like the reticle so much and the reason I sighted in at 50 (instead of 25). 50 yds and less you just put the poa in the middle of the circle or in the crosshair...and you hit it. I want to say the 100 yd holdover is simply putting the poa in the bottom of the circle where it meets the vertical reticle line...and you hit it.
That example might not be exactly correct but the answer is just as simple as that.
Basically, I'm really happy when I keep all the shots within a 6" x 6" box @ 100 yds.
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The reticle was the swaying factor for me as well. Thanks for your input.
My clubs range is outdoors and the polar express is beating the thermometer into a pulp. Looks like its camped out for the next week.
I have an indoor range nearby. $20 an hour. May have to spring for lane rental
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It's too cold to hit the outdoor range here, too.
You know you are going to want to try the new scope out...
Just found this pic of my first 25 yd zeroing.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171231/80702040a403f25c185a5e143c44c57a.jpg)
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That's a sweet grouping. Frame worthy in fact.
Guess I wont have any equipment excuses for a poor showing.
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FWIW, here's an old at the range thread from when I first got the Scorp. Looks like the pics that were in my last two posts there are now gone. You'll see the 100 and 200 yd potential the 9mm rifle gives you.
http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=82110.msg602888#msg602888 (http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=82110.msg602888#msg602888)
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When I first got my carbine, I added a red laser to it (CMR-201). Works great almost any time except outdoors in daylight. My initial calibration of this laser was aiming the iron sites at an object 25 yards out, and then adjusting the laser to be where the sights were pointing.
When I got my Vortex Spitfire AR-1x for Christmas, I calibrated it with the laser dot. Turn on the laser, point it at something 25 yards out, then adjust the Spitfire AR 1x scope to match the laser dot.
Thus, if you happen to have a laser module, you can get a pretty good initial alignment without firing a single shot. Line the laser up with the sights, then line the AR-1x up with the laser.
- DanT Phoenix, Az