The Original CZ Forum

GENERAL => A Day at the Range! => Topic started by: Joe L on July 16, 2017, 06:12:28 PM

Title: P-10C at the range, good results for this shooter
Post by: Joe L on July 16, 2017, 06:12:28 PM
Decided to go to the range and ONLY shoot the P-10C today, as the trigger is so different from the 75 and 97 that I can't make the transition.  Warm day, but very little wind, which is a good thing when shooting the little gun. 

I still had plenty of distractions, all of them being electronic, battery operated, and demanding even when NOT shooting the pistol. 

This is all at 25 yards, single hand standing, with the P-10C and Atlanta Arms 115 gr JHP match ammo.  Pistol is not modified other than a 4 lb Glock firing pin spring and a lot of Sugru and JB-Weld.  And an adjustable rear sight. (

Gun is excellent.  Shooter needs work. 

Title: Re: P-10C at the range, good results for this shooter
Post by: Joe L on July 16, 2017, 10:07:03 PM
I've looked at some of the other targets and compared the MantisX scores with the target results.  Every time I jerked a shot right or left, the MantisX score was low, indicating a lot of movement just before the gun went off.  What is interesting to me is that scores in the high 80s were good enough to get 10 ring hits.  There weren't any "bad" shots with high MantisX scores but there were some 10 ring hits without mid-90s MantisX scores. 

I'm thinking that single hand shooting has so much more gun movement normally that, even with a perfect trigger pull, the score won't necessarily be a 10 due to slow wobble in single hand at 25 yards.  You can see the gun moving in the video from the shooter position camera.  There is much more movement evident from the side than there is from the rear.  I guess the gun can wobble and still be aimed at about the same point.

However, when I knew I jerked the gun anyway, the shot was wide and the MantisX score was low, as in 50-70. 

So, I think dry fire training using the MantisX will be very helpful to new shooters that have poor trigger control and can use the feedback to refine their trigger pulls.  The device may be more useful to advanced shooters if they are shooting two handed and can hold the gun steadier than a bullseye shooter can.  But, a bullseye shooter who can dry fire enough to learn to score mid-90s every trigger pull on the MantisX can probably eliminate all their flyers.  But a person that can average 95 may not shoot higher bullseye scores than one that averages 90, if the 90 score shooter has a steadier hold. 

Title: Re: P-10C at the range, good results for this shooter
Post by: M1A4ME on July 17, 2017, 06:21:33 AM
I remember thinking similar thoughts yesterday, while dry firing the P01.

I noticed (believed I noticed) that some "shots" that didn't look good from the front sight alignment on the target side still got a high score.  I don't remember if that's when I was firing single handed or not.

I did notice (only fired one 5 shot string) that firing double action got me a mid 90's score on the MantisX even though I know the group would have been much worse than firing single action.

MantisX doesn't know where your sights aligned.  It's just looking for movement just before and right after the hammer falls (or striker releases).

Next time I dry fire with it I'm going to try to remember to cock the pistol very slowly and see if that gets rid of my "added" low scoring rounds that could be occurring while cocking the hammer.  That P01 hammer is hard to get a thumb on.  Wish it had a spur hammer like the Pre CZ 85 or the project Compact.  Makes it so much easier to thumb cock the hammer.

I still think the MantisX will help in a couple ways.  First, help you learn to get a good solid grip that minimizes movement of the pistol right before, during, right after the trigger pull.  Second, help you get finger position on the trigger and trigger pull down to also help minimize pistol movement during those same times.

Sight alignment and front sight on the target will be up to the shooter.

Now a "new" model of MantisX, with a target box, where the MantisX unit on the rail had a laser on it and you sighted on a receptor in the target box would (possibly) help you with sight alignment and front sight on the target.  I wonder what that will cost?