New Shadow 1 & 2 Reach Reduction Kits

[MoRivera]

I'm also going to try a T1 Disco in my Shadow 2, as over the last few days I've been able to do some comparisons and the T1's lug is farther up than the new Shadow 2's RRK Disco, and I don't particularly like how way far back the trigger breaks with the new Shadow 2 RRK disco.

I actually put the original Shadow 2 disco in a SP01/Shadow 1 hybrid that I have, and it's not bad.  Don't mind the takeup that much, but I'm good with where the trigger breaks in SA, as it's not completely back against the 'rear wall'.

[George16]

I?m going to the range again tomorrow and do some more testing with my modified trigger. I removed the RRK disco and installed the T1 disco for Dry Fire practice earlier today and I like it better compared to the RRK disco. I really like this setup. I ordered the RRK disco thinking I could gain more reach reduction compared to what I already had but I didn?t. Oh well.

From my observation and testing, the RRK kit is just a trigger with a pretravel screw to push back the trigger?s static location towards the rear paired with a disco with a longer hook. I think the longer hook allows the trigger?s location to be push back to the rear while still allowing it to reset. I compared the RRK disco to the T1 disco and the RRK hook is longer by about 1-2 mm.

By the way, the recurve trigger has a thicker surface area where I drilled and tapped the pretravel screw compared to the old style 85C trigger. Now I know why the pretravel screw never moved on my modified trigger compared to the old style 85C.

I might be selling the RRK disco after tomorrow.

[MoRivera]

The location of the 'lug' that the DA pull engages is also a little farther back on the RRK disco than the T1, which I assume also contributes to the DA pull engaging a bit farther back.  But what this also seems to do is bring the DA 'letoff' as well as the SA break farther back.  As I mentioned before, the over travel screw with the RRK disco is virtually useless as any bit of it out keeps the trigger from breaking.  This was definitely too far back for my comfort.

With a T1 disco, hopefully it will give me back that more 'forward' break point, but then I'll see how much of the takeup on the DA I can reduce with the pre travel screw.  As I noted in another thread, I tried filing a little bevel on a T1 disco since it wasn't fully releasing the hammer in my 'Shadow-ized' SP01 in SA, but then I went too far and it won't engage fully in DA now, so I'm getting a few new ones and taking things a lot slower.  In the meantime, I actually like the Shadow 2's original disco in my SP-01.  Once I try out the T1 in the Shadow 2, I'll see which one I'll use for Production in USPSA.

[WxGuy]

George, Mo,

Interesting you guys are messing around with the T1 disco.  I've been thinking about the T1 for my Shadow 2.  I have 2 T1s here and will install in the gun and see how it feels.  I made a complete hammer group so I could keep the stock hammer, disco, and strut intact.  The SS shiny hammer from CGW looks real cool on the S2.  Also have the adjustable sear in both the shadows.  Might try the S2 disco in the 75 shadow.

[Mercs]

George, Mo,

Interesting you guys are messing around with the T1 disco.  I've been thinking about the T1 for my Shadow 2.  I have 2 T1s here and will install in the gun and see how it feels.  I made a complete hammer group so I could keep the stock hammer, disco, and strut intact.  The SS shiny hammer from CGW looks real cool on the S2.  Also have the adjustable sear in both the shadows.  Might try the S2 disco in the 75 shadow.

I just fitted a T3 to my SP01 Shadow and I think it?s the best thing since sliced bread. Why doesn?t that work in the shadow 2? I never looked at the shadow 2 internals


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[George16]

George, Mo,

Interesting you guys are messing around with the T1 disco.  I've been thinking about the T1 for my Shadow 2.  I have 2 T1s here and will install in the gun and see how it feels.  I made a complete hammer group so I could keep the stock hammer, disco, and strut intact.  The SS shiny hammer from CGW looks real cool on the S2.  Also have the adjustable sear in both the shadows.  Might try the S2 disco in the 75 shadow.

I just fitted a T3 to my SP01 Shadow and I think it?s the best thing since sliced bread. Why doesn?t that work in the shadow 2? I never looked at the shadow 2 internals


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I think you?re right. Since I already messed around with the T1 and RRK disco, I found the RRK disco didnt give me more reduction from what I already attained by using a modified trigger with the T1.

Guys, I made the T1 work in reducing the DA reach by modifying a recurve trigger. Like I said in my previous post, what it is is just a trigger with a oretravel screw to move back the trigger?s static location. Somebody need to produce a trigger with way less curve and more material where the pretravel screw hole is located. I know the recurve trigger I straightened out is thicker in that area. What also compounded and limited us with the choice of triggers is the fact that CZ decided to make the shdow2 trigger guard flatter compared to the rounder profile of the Sp01 or TSO for that matter.

Mo, that?s the same thing I noticed on the trigger. The lug is farther back. From an engineering standpoint, I think it was moved back to allow for altering the static location of the trigger along with the longer hook for the SA. The break has moved back towards the rear by about 2-3mm. That?s the main reason I removed the overtravel screw because like you said, it?s useless and it is.

Wxguy,
Go slow when fitting your T1 disco. I used a dermal with diamond bit then 400, 1000 and then polished it with Mother?s mag polish. To let it drop in DA without altering the timing, take off a little bit from the nose, for SA a little bit on the hook.

[M4rc310]

a) there is basically no need for an over travel adjustment screw, as any bit of it doesn't allow the hammer to fall at the end of the DA pull.

I just installed mine - It did require some minor fitting on the disconnector.  And I noticed the same as described above by MoRivera: I could actually turn the post-travel screw by only a little tiny fraction, any more than that and it will not drop the hammer in DA.   I'm happy with the result though: It did shorten the trigger reach and reset a bit.

[MoRivera]

I have relatively long fingers so a full DA reach isn't as much of an issue for me, although I do like it more from the half-cock position of course.  But the big thing with me is that I don't like a SA trigger that's really far back...I like long triggers on 1911's, the more forward set of aftermarket SAO triggers on my CZ's and the original 'longer' triggers on my Sigs.

George, it sounds like your 'straightening' of the curved trigger moved the pull distance back enough for you in DA, but in SA I think for me it'd be a bit too far back.  That's why I like the thicker 'old style'/original OEM 85C trigger.  I can deal with a long DA pull, and maybe even work at prepping the trigger to the half-cock position.  But with the Shadow 2's RRK disco, I was almost short-stroking both the DA pull and the SA pull...it felt like I had to apply an extra bit at the very end where my trigger finger is all scrunched up, and I can't stand that (like on a Beretta).

So I'm going to try the new trigger in my Shadow 2 with a T1 Disco.  As George mentioned, not much threading for the pre travel screw so I'll have to work on that somehow.  Right now I have a 'Shadow-ized' SP-01 set up well so if I can't get buy Shadow 2 the way I like it in DA/SA, then I'll leave it as a SAO and use the SP01 in Production.

I did, however, try out a CZ Custom 'Accu Shadow 2' at a plate shoot the other night.  Man...that DA/SA trigger is heavenly.  So I'm just contemplating sending mine in to CZ Custom for that same trigger job, but I've already sunk so much money into it!

[George16]

Well, the change is official. After shooting about 300 rounds at the range with my modified trigger and T1 disco, I like this combo better than the RRK. DA and SA breaks earlier like Mo noted and I can confirm that. Due to this, it allowed me to manipulate the trigger faster and it showed in my splits. With the RRK, I get splits of .25-.27 for a 2.45 Bill drill. With the T1 disco and my modified trigger, my splits were .21 - .22 for a 2.15 Bill drill.

Mo, you?ll like the the result of the old style 85C and T1 disco combo. I also tried it with the RRK. With either the straightened or old style 85C trigger and RRK, the location of the trigger when the DA and SA breaks are more towards the rear and I didn?t like the feel of it especially since the overtravel screw is useless. Plus, I just didn?t like the curve of the CZ triggers including the old style 85C. I wish CZ will make a DA with the profile of the trigger of the TSO. I like the curve of  TSO?s trigger but the trigger pin hole location is not designed for DA.

By the way, I also grind down the old style 85C trigger because it was too thick for my feel. It has a ?hump? at the middle so I grind it down flat and thinned it out a bit. I like it flat so my trigger finger is planted squarely on the face of the trigger.

So I?ll be selling the RRK disco that I just bought and installed. I shot probably close to 500 with it.

[MoRivera]

Tried the T1 disco in my Shadow 2 and didn't like it.  The Double Action was still all the way back against the rear wall.  Going to leave the Shadow 2 SAO, and use my milled TS slide in .40 on it for major.  Installed a T1 in my SP01 Shadow and in that too it brought the DA break back farther than before.  SA is nice and makeup nice too, but now I have a little more over travel.  May go back to the Shadow 2 disco in the Shadow 1.  Don't really mind the extra takeup, but probably like the earlier DA break/less over travel more.

[MoRivera]

So.....

I gave it a good try.  Was able to fit the new S2 RRK disco to how I liked it, got the DA pull nice, almost no reset in SA, and got the DA break to drop where I wanted it to.  But the SA is still too far back for me.  It's a nice trigger, and firing dry the reach feels okay even though short.  But as with many things, how something feels dry-firing may be very different live-fire.

With the pistol buried deep in my hand while firing, the trigger reach is just too short, almost past my first knuckle (I have relatively large hands, not meaty but longish fingers).  This is with the original Shadow 2 trigger (which I believe is the CZ 'Shadowline' trigger), the CGW 'Old Style' 85C trigger that came with the RRK kit, and an extra 'Original' 85C trigger which is the thickest of the bunch.  Even the latter was just a bit too short.





I think it has to do with the shape of the backstrap and its angled 'hump', as opposed to the more even arch like on the SP01/Shadow 1 and my Sigs.

So even though I was hoping to get my Shadow 2 back into USPSA Production (which is pretty much what the gun was designed for), I'm keeping it SAO.  I just like the pistol better that way, I shoot it better that way, and I have a milled TS slide in .450 the can work on the S2 frame if I want to go Limited Major.  So again, gave it the ol' college try, but I'm sticking with SAO.




So I'll be shooting my Shadow 1 in Production, which I've been shooting quite well with in IDPA.  That gun is still more stable in DA, and the length of pull in SA is more to my liking.

[timmy75]

hi!
question for MoRivera,
do you know which trigger would be the best if i like DA as far back as possible, and SA as forward as possible?

cz97 aka thick trigger with pre travel and over travel screws? 

[MoRivera]

hi!
question for MoRivera,
do you know which trigger would be the best if i like DA as far back as possible, and SA as forward as possible?

cz97 aka thick trigger with pre travel and over travel screws?

I would probably think the the thick CZ97 trigger or an original 85C trigger with short reset set screws would be the way to go.

[timmy75]

thanks, i'll try with a cz 97 for the beginning because i dont have old 85c avaliable in EU.
cheers