Any U.S. service members here bring home a CZ while stationed in Europe?

[OscarUniform37]

Hi everyone,

I’m trying to gather some information about how CZ pistols made their way back to the U.S. with service members stationed in Europe, particularly during the Cold War and the years leading up to the Velvet Revolution.

If you were stationed in West Germany, Italy, Sardinia, or elsewhere in Europe and bought a CZ—whether a CZ 75, Compact, 83, 85, or other model—I’d really appreciate hearing about it.

I’m especially curious about:

• When and where you bought your pistol
• Whether it came from a Rod & Gun Club, Frankonia Jagd, or a local dealer
• What the process was like to bring it back (e.g., USAREUR retention forms, VAT paperwork, ATF Form 6, etc.)
• Whether you still have the pistol or any of the original documents or accessories
• Any differences you noticed between what was sold in Europe vs. what was available stateside at the time

Even if you no longer own the pistol, I’d still love to hear what you remember. I’m trying to better understand how these made their way into U.S. collections before commercial imports really ramped up.

Thanks in advance for any stories or insights you’re willing to share.

—Nate (OscarUniform37)

[Fuzzy Sights]

Purchased a CZ 83 380 ACP from Patch Barracks Rod and Gun Club.  Had to store it with MPs, but could check it out anytime to take it to range.  Great pistol, gave it to my brother.  Think his widow still has it.  Did not notice any differences from what was available on US Market.  When I got ready to PCS the pistol had to be on my orders and the ATF Forms took like 6 months to process.  Essentially I was importing a weapon without a license.  There was an exception made for service members but it was still painful.

It was the first pocket pistol I ever owned that would produce real groups at 25 meters on a ISU standard target. Remember that it grouped slightly left with RWS ammo, which is what I could get at the time. Hope this helps.

JW

[Tanners Owner]

I bought 2 guns at the Hanau Rod and gun, neither a CZ- wasn’t into CZs at the time.  Like Fuzzy Sights, had to fill out ATF forms, have them on my orders to return home.  It was a pain, but doable.

I do regret not getting a CZ in hindsight, but at the time, funds were tight for me & my growing family.  This was in the late 80s- early 90s.

[OscarUniform37]

Thanks for the replies—this is exactly the kind of context I was hoping for.

Fuzzy Sights: I’ve seen a CZ 83 or two mentioned in older posts, but it’s still not something that comes up often as a Rod & Gun Club purchase. The detail about navigating the import process during PCS is especially helpful—really appreciate you sharing that. I’ve been wondering how that part worked.

Tanners Owner: Thanks for adding your perspective. I’m interested in any guns that servicemen bought and imported—not just CZs—so your notes about the ATF process at Hanau definitely help round out the picture. If you don’t mind me asking, what were the guns you brought back?

If either of you happen to recall any other details—dates, dealer names, or how the paperwork was handled—I’d definitely be interested. Every bit helps build a clearer picture of how these pistols made their way back to the States.

[Tanners Owner]

Tanners Owner: Thanks for adding your perspective. I’m interested in any guns that servicemen bought and imported—not just CZs—so your notes about the ATF process at Hanau definitely help round out the picture. If you don’t mind me asking, what were the guns you brought back?

My guns were a Colt 1911 govt model(SS) and a S&W 422.  I no longer have them as I traded my Colt & 422 years ago to someone who wanted them more than I did at the time.

[OscarUniform37]

I really appreciate the replies shared so far--the perspective has been helpful.

Just wanted to share a pair of CZ 75s that helped spark my curiosity about how these pistols maid their way into U.S. collections during the Cold War and shortly after. The one on the right has a 1991 proof mark and was purchased by a USAF Ssgt. at the Hahn Rod & Gun Club. I was fortunate to find it with the original sales invoice, warranty card, test target, USAREUR retention authorization, VAT exemption form, and ATF Form 6. The pistol on the left was made in 1987. It didn't come with import paperwork, but it includes the original box, test target, and warranty card--I'd assume it also came back with a servicemember.



I understand the general process for how these guns were brought home--but I'm really interested in the personal side of it. What drew people to CZs at the time? Outside of folks who read Col. Jeff Cooper, what kind of reputation did they have in the clubs or among servicemembers? Were they seen as a bargain? A well-made shooter? Just intriguing because you couldn't find them easily back in the States? Or were they avoided by some folks because of their Eastern Bloc origin?

I'd be really interested to hear what others remember--whether or not you brought one back. What else was popular at the time? And what steered someone toward or away from CZs? What were all of your friends buying?

[Tanners Owner]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I wasn’t into CZs when I was in Germany( late 80s- early 90s).

However, I became interested when one of my Majors sold his 2 CZs.  While I didn’t buy any, it sparked interest.  A few years later I bought one& the rest is history.

What attracted me to CZs, was the ergos, followed by the inherent accuracy.  Initial trigger pulls were not ideal, but I was able to resolve that with some CGW love.  I also prefer DA/SA, so CZs are a good match for me

[Fuzzy Sights]

I was a target shooter and Germany was my first go at European target game.  The most used target pistol in Germany at the time was the CZ 75.  Local gunsmith would rebarrel with a Lothario-Walther barrel and a new bushing and would guarantee a 10 cm group at 25m with any ammo.  The pistols were also converted to Single Action and the trigger still was not a good as my Gold Cup, but it was close.  Did not purchase one in Gemany but did pick one up later and took it with me to Korea.  Wound up selling it to the Yongsan Rod and Gun Club with a Kadet Kit.  At the time I had the only DA/SA 9mm and I would lend it to personnel who were having difficulty in passing the small arms qualification course.  The club wanted to maintain that capability and I could always get another back in the states by that time...and I did.  It seems to replicate in my safe.

Best wishes.  JW

[OscarUniform37]

Thanks again for the replies, guys.

Fuzzy, were you doing all your competitive shooting through the Rod & Gun Club, or did you ever get a chance to shoot off-post with any of the local German civilian clubs?
From what I’ve read, German pistol shooting was—or still is—more focused on Olympic-style disciplines, while American club shooting leaned more toward service pistol or practical formats.
Was there much crossover between the two worlds? Did shooters ever compare notes or end up competing together?

That Lothar Walther rebarrel setup you mentioned sounds like it would’ve been a serious match gun. Was that kind of customization more common among German civilian shooters, or were some of the more serious Rod & Gun Club guys buying those too?

[Fuzzy Sights]

Most of my shooting was done off base.  Joined a local club and shot dueling matches with center fire pistols.  Many of these competitors used Walther and other Olympic style pistols in 32 Wadcutter.  The next largest group used the CZ 75s.  I was using an old Beretta Mod 100 in 32 ACP.  Never won a monthly match but frequently made the top 3. Had the trigger worked on, a custom wood grip and a barrel weight. Still looked terrible, but shot great. They also held rapid fire matches, but that required a rather specialized 22 short pistol.  There was some interest in action shooting starting up in Germany, but not in the Stuttgart area.

Best part was the food and beer after the match.

JW

[OscarUniform37]

This is really fascinating stuff. Were there any other Army shooters in the club you joined? I’m sure the food and beer didn’t hurt, either—that was all the motivation I needed to swing by the Biergarten at my local Hofbräuhaus this afternoon!

Did the Patch Barracks Rod & Gun Club have its own gunsmith, or were they using the same local smiths the German clubs relied on? I’ve only scratched the surface in my own research, but it sounds like Suhl—which was on the East German side—was still a major hub for gunmaking and continued turning out skilled gunsmiths well into the DDR years, especially through firms like Simson (later Ernst Thälmann). From what I’ve read, a few of them ended up in the West during the early Cold War, before the borders really locked down. It’s interesting to think that some of that craftsmanship might’ve made its way across.

Hopefully we have some friends from Germany here on the forum who remember something from that time—I’d really like to hear their perspective on it.

[Fuzzy Sights]

There were several military members of this German Club.  Indeed the food and beer helped greatly. As a matter of fact I held  my last promotion party there as the Officers Club was closed for renovation.  Great memories.

JW