Questions from a newb and new Witness owner

[NewbJersey]

Hi gang,

I'm new, so all help is appreciated. To get quickly to my questions:

Trying to narrow down the learning of which Witness I just bought, can someone tell me the model and frame? Going by the serial number I believe it's a 1979 gun. (see picture...annnndd the link to post pics as I write this post isn't working...so here's a verbal image...silver stainless steel Witness, not duotone, dark wood walnut grips, full size frame, has compensator on 9mm barrel, DA and SA, safety and slide release in black only on left side..not ambi, flat metal base plate of magazine that has a black follower.) It also says "F.T = made in Italy" above grip on left side of gun. "Witness EAA Hialeah - FLA" also on left side etched. Serial begins with EA.

Is the compensator factory?

Is there a .22 conversion barrel that will fit?

It came with both 9mm and .40 cal barrels...how much is the .40 cal barrel worth? I may sell it and the magazine.

What grips will fit this model? I'd like to put on some thicker grips at some point.

If the double action is found to be a little heavier than I'd prefer, what can be done about that and about what would it cost me?

Thanks sincerely everyone, I'm learning and loving the world of gun fun at the range.

NewbJersy

[jwc007]

Welcome to the Clone Side of Czfirearms.us and Congratulations on your new-to-you Witness! 

Email Tanfoglio directly with the Serial Number and they can tell you exactly when it was made and exported.

As for it being actually Stainless, there were only a very limited number of Stainless Witness Pistols made and imported back in the very early 1990's and your Pistol with the EA serial number prefix is a lot newer than that.  Perhaps your pistol has an aftermarket plating/finish done by it's previous owner.

Would appreciate seeing a pic of it, when possible.

[bang bang]

Welcome,

Is there a .22 conversion barrel that will fit?

you can email EAA, but i would call about this.  They do have people to answer the phone and most of the time, they know their stuff.  afa a 22 conversion, you will need more than the barrel.  you will also need the slide to go with it since it has the FP/Extractor and its setup for the RF.   

afa grips go you can look/search for aftermarket grips or if you have a fav maker, you can have some made to your needs.

[jwc007]

Sorry - missed your questions before

Is the compensator factory?

Yes

Is there a .22 conversion barrel that will fit?

A .22 Conversion kit for the small frame Witness is what you need

It came with both 9mm and .40 cal barrels...how much is the .40 cal barrel worth? I may sell it and the magazine.

The 9mm/.40 kits are hard to come by.  I would keep it with the gun to enhance resale value.  However, about $150 is in the ballpark.

What grips will fit this model? I'd like to put on some thicker grips at some point.

Consider the Hogue Cz75/Tz75/Witness finger groove grip or a Hogue Handall Grip Sleeve, the latter of which will definitely enlarge the grip, but comfortably so.

If the double action is found to be a little heavier than I'd prefer, what can be done about that and about what would it cost me?

You will find the trigger will lighten up with use.  Just shoot it as it is.

[Bret]

It came with both 9mm and .40 cal barrels...how much is the .40 cal barrel worth? I may sell it and the magazine.

The 40S&W cartridge wasn't even around until the early '90's, so it's definitely no older than that.  Assuming that the 40S&W barrel is original to the pistol, definitely don't sell it.  Combo guns are rare and it would be a shame to part it out. 

[NewbJersey]

Hey thanks all, appreciate the help sincerely.

I will call EAA for fuller info as suggested, and I'm glad to hear it's post 1979 if that's true, only because of potential mileage on the gun...not that younger always means less mileage.

NEW QUESTION/SITUATION: Shot it tonight for the first time, and it seems defective...

The safety switch is very loose and smooth to switch on and off with the thumb..so smooth in fact that the recoil of the gun is turning the safety on to an annoying degree every single clip of shooting. At first I thought my thumb was brushing up against it but even when I tucked my thumbs out of the way and shot intentionally badly just to see what the gun does, sure enough it locks up the frame for follow up shots because the safety comes on. ?...sigh

Any input on this issue? I'm ready to return the gun as I'm not liking the idea of sinking more money into the gun when it was promised to be working perfectly.

The .40 cal barrel/slide/etc is black while the rest of the gun is silver, so I doubt it's original...it's not a duotone Witness.

It's also shooting low and left big time at 21 feet? I'm fairly accurate for a new guy, at 21 feet tonight I put ten rounds in a 2" x 1" rectangle on a different 9mm pistol so I'm very confident the Witness is way off..we're talking over a foot? Any thoughts? I'm not pulling the gun in any wonky way when shooting it so I'm not understanding.

Thanks everyone, your help is really appreciated.

NewbJersey

[TenToGo]

If the safety is loose, it's not "working perfectly."

The .40 top may be original, no matter what color the frame is.

The .22 top end is about $250 from EAA. 

Not knowing what you paid for it, I can't tell you if it's worth putting money into.  You can find Match models in the $550 range on Gunbroker.  However, considering that a top end is $250, if you paid less than $500 for it you're ahead simply for the tops, the frame comes free.

In my case, I bought a combo (.45ACP / .22LR) for $550 (new), then bought a 10mm Match for under $500, coming out even for just a Match and the two extra tops, so the extra frame is a bonus.

[NewbJersey]

Thanks for the help.

I'm contacting the buyer tomorrow, as I think I'll be returning the gun or fighting the matter via merchant services since I paid with a credit card. I paid just a wee over five hundred for the whole kit, but a loose safety will only get worse on the higher recoil .40 I imagine....never shot one but I've read they're a little bigger on recoil.

Love the feel of the pistol, and the compensator definitely lowers the felt recoil, but I'm not accepting that two to three times out of ten the slide locks up. Hopefully this will be smooth return and not a problem. The seller strikes me as a very honest guy.

The accuracy issue...is that just the sights needing a tweak? What causes this? All other pistols I've shot (a total of five basically) have been far more accurate than I can be.

NewbJersey

[jwc007]

Before you go hog-wild and trade it off, give us a bit of time to help you.  Haste makes waste.

The safety switch is very loose and smooth to switch on and off with the thumb..so smooth in fact that the recoil of the gun is turning the safety on to an annoying degree every single clip of shooting.

This problem is very easy and relatively inexpensive to fix.  Buy a new Safety from EAA for it and replace it.  Don't know what current prices are for them, but the last time I replaced one with a Ambi-Safety, it was about $50, back in 2001.  Single side Safety's will be less.

For replacement directions Refer to: http://www.savvysurvivor.com/tanfoglio_witness_gunsmithing.htm

[NewbJersey]

I'm not a hog wild guy, but I'm not a techie either, so between parts, shipping, time to learn, time to fix plus it's seriously inaccurate to boot, I'm very much inclined to get rid of it. I just don't have time to tinker or read up and experiment until it's fixed correctly, and paying a gunsmith isn't cheap.

Frustrated, but I appreciate the help.

[NewbJersey]

How would I fix the inaccurate sights assuming I could get the safety issue fixed easily?

I'm open to keeping the gun and love the heft, fit and recoil of it, but unless I can fix both issues it makes no sense to fix one of the issues.

Any input on how to dial in the sights when they're not adjustable? Is the gun doomed to a "shoots low left" future?

How much would someone typically charge for fixing the safety? Any of you ever experience this matter yourselves? Never heard of a gun that can throw the safety on in between shots, but I'm pretty darn new to guns so I can't be too surprised, apparently it happens. heh

Thanks again for all the help, I'm pretty sure this is a Witness Stock I or Witness Stock II? The slide racks like butter and the slide release is very easy to flick down to release the slide back into shooting position. Love that, but I need a fully functioning product of course, so the other issues have to be resolved - if you can help I'd sincerely appreciate it.

Thanks again,

NewbJersey

[jwc007]

You might consider spending more time with the Pistol to get used to it's trigger feel
In my experience, most fixed sighted Pistols will shoot to Point of Aim at 50 feet with a dead on hold.
Change the way you pull the Trigger and experiment with different aiming techniques to find what works for you.

For more "Group Therapy"


As for repairing/replacing the Safety, it takes me all of 5 minutes to replace a Standard Safety.  10 minutes to install an Ambi-Safety, which I upgraded to on my .45 WItness, after I wore out my original Safety, doing many repetitive "Cocked and Locked" drills.  And yes, that worn out Safety would come on with recoil.  What actually wears out, is the Spring in the Spring Detent, which IS NOT repairable except by replacing the Safety.  What your "GunSmith" will charge you will depend upon his labor rates, and what kind of markup he charges on parts.

[NewbJersey]

Thanks for that input, much appreciated....great forum this is!

I'm open to the accuracy issue being my own doing, I'm no hot shot with a handgun, but for the life of me I'd swear the sights didn't flinch on trigger pull...yet EVERY shot is low and left. On another pistol that is modeled after a Glock I was so much more accurate and tighter groups as well that I was just left wondering what's going on.

I'll take her to the range once more this weekend and give another run to adapt to the trigger...on that note....the double action is much harder than I'd like at the tail end of the pull....nothing like a Bersa Thunder that is very smooth according to my level of experiencing guns. I wonder what could be done about the trigger?

In my ideal world, I'd love this Witness to have a crisp and 3lb trigger, maybe 4lb, but not sure what can be done to guns, by who, or costs how much? Most everything else about the Witness I really really love. It points so naturally from the balance and heft of metal. Seems like it'd be a great combat weapon if I'm understanding what a combat weapon would entail.

QUESTION: One thing I cannot find is this model I bought....yet with a muzzle brake?....mine I think has to be the Witness Stock, all silver, shiny on the sides but duller on bottom and top, walnut grips...yet...none of them have the muzzle brake that comes on the race guns...does that mean someone put a 9mm race barrel/slide assembly on a stock frame? Seems like this configuration typically goes for about $800 to $900 new with only one barrel..so I'm still open to keeping it but would like to know exactly what this is. I'll try to call EAA tomorrow...my days are too full to call out on weekdays unfortunately.

Thanks again, all help has been great input and I appreciate the time and effort to help me.

NewbJersey

[jwc007]

You are most Welcome!

One thing I cannot find is this model I bought....yet with a muzzle brake?....mine I think has to be the Witness Stock, all silver, shiny on the sides but duller on bottom and top, walnut grips...yet...none of them have the muzzle brake that comes on the race guns...does that mean someone put a 9mm race barrel/slide assembly on a stock frame? Seems like this configuration typically goes for about $800 to $900 new with only one barrel..so I'm still open to keeping it but would like to know exactly what this is.

It would help matter alot if we could see a pic of it.  You might need to try a different pic/image host.  I use hunt101.com as they are very "Gun Friendly", but there are others, such as photobucket.

[JimThornTX]

I use photobucket. Email me a pic and I will host it for you. jimthorntx at yahoo dot com