Fun with the new Lyman Trigger Pull Gauge.

[Mr HH]

Some readings on the P-09 with the new Lyman gauge. These were on the lower side of average. After 20 tests each, average SA pull was 2lbs 9oz and DA was 7lbs 9oz.
This gun has the CGW Pro Package and internal polishing per Schmeky's tutorials, plus a little more.
I installed the Pro Package at 1000 rounds and it now has 1500 total. I'm using the 11lb hammer spring and the stoutest sear spring from the kit. I have never had a single malfunction with this gun. I just love it.

[Joe L]

That SA pull is too light!!!   


for me...

Joe

[Mr HH]

I would agree with you Joe if I didn't shoot it regularly and shoot it along with my other CZ's. It's strange.. Before I got the gauge I would have bet you ten bucks my CZC Accu Shadow would be in the sub 3lb category and the P-09 would be over 3. Turns out the Shadow is 3lb 4oz and the P-09 is 2lb 9 oz, and they are identical in DA at 7lb 9oz, but.. It doesn't feel that way when I shoot them. The Shadow feels MUCH lighter in DA and SA. It must be the difference in the standard vs the Omega triggers. That's the only way I can describe it. Maybe it's the heavy sear spring in the P-09 that makes it feel heavier than the Shadow. I don't know.. I wonder if the meter reading is slightly skewed by the point where the gauge roller contacts and pulls on the trigger. I'd guess the P-09 trigger allows for a pull point closer to the end of the trigger where the Shadow trigger hooks up closer to center?

[Joe L]

HH--Yep, you have to be consistent with the measurement contact point to the trigger pin distance.  I have a video around here somewhere of that differnce on my 75B frame.   

The difference between the 75 and P-07/09 trigger system feel is in the sear engagement I think.  The 75 is "crisper".  It has a cleaner break than an Omega P-09/07 trigger, which still has some creep in it.  For a centerfire bullseye match gun, I like some creep or "roll".  It allows me to put some pressure on the sear without accidentally discharging the gun.  I have to be much more careful with the 75 trigger, so much so that I had to heavy up the 75/97 triggers so that I could shoot them well after thousands of rounds with the SIG and P series triggers.  That is actually the basis of my comment.  But you are right--a P-09 trigger can feel different than a 75 trigger but measure a smooth lower pull because of the longer travel after the trigger bar contacts the sear.  I think. 

Bullseye match guns have to have a 2 lb minimum rimfire pull, 2.5 lb minimum centerfire weight, and 3.5 lb minimum .45 pull weight.  Mine are roughly 3-8 oz above the minimums for the rimfire and centerfire, not for margin if the guns are checked, but because that is what the triggers need to be for the way I move the trigger.  Truth is, I would be happy with a smooth 4 lb pull in any of them.

The one I had the most trouble with was the grittty P-07 pull out of the box.  The weight didn't bother me.  The uncontrollable sear movement got me.  That is why I changed the hammer right after shooting the gun...once.  It's a feel preference.  Some folks never warm up to the Omega feel.  I like it fine because it is similar to the SIGs I had.  It was the 75 trigger I had to get used to.

I agree with you, that low a pull weight on the 75 would be a problem for me except with the Kadet slide.  That low a pull weight on the P-09 is obviously NOT a problem.  Mine is just slightly higher. 

Joe

[Mr HH]

Ok Joe. Tonight I had the gauge out while working on a different gun and decided to re-measure the P-09. Gun laying on it's side on the table. I aligned the shaft of the trigger gauge to be parallel with the bore of the gun which let me pull straight back on the center to of the trigger. Now getting consistent 2lb 15oz SA pulls. A gain of 6oz from my earlier readings. That's more in line with what it feels like. Thanks for the dialogue on this.

[Joe L]

Yep, on a 1911, you can put the gauge hook anywhere and it won't make much of a difference since there is no pivot.  For anything with a pivot, you have to put it exactly where your finger center of contact is if you want to compare pistol pull weights. 

The difference in feel between the 75 series guns and the P series guns is one item that I used to justify getting a 97 to shoot with the 75B+Kadet in bullseye matches.  It worked, much easier to pick up the 97 and shoot it after the Kadet than it is to pick up the P-09.  Last weekend, I shot the P-07 in the bullseye match and it was definitely different.  On Monday, I shot the 97 again, and, after a few rounds, was back shooting it just like I was two months ago, after shooting the Kadet. 

I love the P-09/P-07 triggers (with a CGW hammer), but I shoot them best when I put the Kadet and 97 aside for a few outings and only shoot the Omega trigger pistols.  I might do that this week, as a matter of fact. 

Joe