Longevity of VZ58 manufacturing

[CodeWarrior1241]

Hi all,

I'm a very happy new owner of a CSA-made VZ58 that I have taken to the range for the first time 2 days ago. It performed spectacularly, I definitely see why there's such a strong following. Very impressed that the design is as old as it is, and with all-FAB accessories mounted (Al rail, grip, steel stock) it performed as well as my buddy's Sig556.

I'm wondering where to go from here. If the Czech army switches/is switching to NATO standard, the supply of surplus dries up, and all new production is in the hands of CSA - small company not backed by the state - what are the chances that parts and mags would become hard to come by, and newly manufactured rifles cease to exist.

My context is that I am in a gun unfriendly state, and I want to be legal and compliant. This basically means I buy guns in pairs (although didn't do this with the Vz58), since there's a good chance that the law will change in a year or two and make new purchases still more difficult... This has already happened twice in the past 5 years. Should I commit to this weapon system and caliber? If the Galil ACE comes to the US next year, and I only get new rifles every 5 years or so, should I worry about keeping the Vz alone? Or am I totally overthinking this?

[RSR]

Buy a VZ2008 or three for backup for the same price as you paid for your CSA rifle...  Only difference w/ ergos is CSA has a forward to fire safety.  Mill out the ledge keeping safety from going back and pop in any standard safety to function the same (allegedly this is part of their prevention from easily running in full auto, so might want to get a copy of Czechpoint's ATF receiver letter to confirm not an issue)...

Production won't dry up anytime soon.  CSA will continue making these rifles.  And they're still in military and police service in several countries...

Cheap parts kits have and may continue to become more expensive, but I don't think most folks buying parts kits will actually be building rifles...

[sirosisofliver]

One way to look at it; when 5.45x39 7N6 was banned for import, there was a panic sell off of some AK 74 pattern rifles.  I predict in the future if the Czechs go a different direction, there are enough of the VZ rifles around with panicky owners who will dump their rifles and mags.  I don't see very many VZ owners who shoot enough to wear out a large bulk number of magazines anytime soon.  The VZ can already be bought in a NATO standard package.  I'd worry more about cheap 7.62x39 ammo to keep our rifles well fed...

[RSR]

The reason 5.45x39 rifles were sold off -- and I agree with that action -- is that the appeal of 5.45x39 is the bullet design of the 7n6 ammo itself -- and it cost about as much to shoot before the ban as premium 22lr ammo. 

So once 7n6 was banned, all incoming ammo is essentially a lower velocity version of 5.56 nato ammo, where bullet terminal performance is dependent on velocity rather than bullet design...

5.45x39 has a better case design/shape that helps with feeding/extraction, but that's really its own benefit over 5.56...

[sirosisofliver]

I have an AK 74, and there is a growing list of commercial suppliers of 5.45 that is about the same as 7.62x39 on price, or close enough to be decent.  You forgot less recoil of the 5.45 over the 5.56 as an advantage...  I have enough 7N6, and those that didn't buy a lot of it when it was as cheap as .22LR really lost out.  I use my 74 in 3-Gun with iron sights and RAS, and often notice my rifle doesn't jam like the AR's I compete against.  I will have to do a comparison on penetration with 7N6 and Red Army 68gr...similar BC on each.  LOL...sorry OP, we bird-tracked a bit.  I think there will be more than enough mags and parts with the VZ platform.  I personally bought an extra spring set, and will be buying more mags for it. 

[RSR]

I don't necessarily agree with the recoil...  All AKs recoil more (more felt recoil) than ARs due to the significantly heavier bolt carrier. 
Granted, ARs due have a little more muzzle blast if shorter than 18" barrels w/ most ammo and due to being lighter do tend to have more muzzle rise under rapid fire (depending upon muzzle device), but those are about the only major differences I've experienced there.

Almost all AK74s have as stock an excellent muzzle brake that might be what you're experiencing/describing insofar as recoil... 

Yes, ARs jam more than AKs, but it's not a function of the caliber, rather the weapon system.  There are base level Yugo AKs in 5.56, were Saigas but those are banned, and on the premium end you have Sig 556s and Galils.  Tantos and Bulgarians are sort of in between.

Short stroke, you have VZ58s, MPAR 556s (AR18 equivalents), SCARs, ARXs, Mini14s, or even premium ARs like HK, LWRC, LMT, etc, that are all much more reliable than the ARs in your carbine courses...

There is much more ammo selection for 5.56 as well (especially the premium type bullets 68-77 gr OTMs that are far superior to anything available in 5.45).  And the steel case 5.56 and 5.45 are all about the same price.  Brass case, 5.56 is cheaper, usually, than anything available in 7.62x39 and 5.45x39.  And nearly no 5.56 currently available is corrosive either.

Worth mentioning that most cheap Russian stuff has thicker jackets than US produced 5.56 as well, so likelihood of fragmentation is reduced even further beyond the velocity disparities...

[sirosisofliver]

Mine is a converted Saiga, and I haven't converted the front end yet, so no muzzle brake.  The recoil comparison was with a S&W MP Sport shooting standard 5.56 55gr rds.  Its also a heavier platform than a standard AR, so thats where I account for recoil reduction.   5.45 is cheap enough there isn't a reason to reload for it, and for what I  use it for, its well suited.

[pac_man]

As much as I like the vz58 platform if it was my only rifle, or my primary rifle. I would either change the plan and buy an AK since parts, mags and everything is plentiful or buy a bunch of small parts to have on hand. That's the only way you can guarantee that you an be shooting it for the rest of your life.

[taceto]

As much as I like the vz58 platform if it was my only rifle, or my primary rifle. I would either change the plan and buy an AK since parts, mags and everything is plentiful or buy a bunch of small parts to have on hand. That's the only way you can guarantee that you an be shooting it for the rest of your life.

That's why you have a couple of VZ parts kits squirreled away 

[RSR]

As much as I like the vz58 platform if it was my only rifle, or my primary rifle. I would either change the plan and buy an AK since parts, mags and everything is plentiful or buy a bunch of small parts to have on hand. That's the only way you can guarantee that you an be shooting it for the rest of your life.

Well, there is a fair amount of variation, limits to interchangeability, between various pattern AKs as well.  So that argument doesn't fully hold.

And overall # of parts between the AK and VZ is about the same.  And neither barrel is as easy to swap as on AR pattern rifles...