Author Topic: Trying to find a load for .45ACP  (Read 2717 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Pistolet

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« on: October 04, 2018, 08:31:17 PM »
Hello everyone. I am trying to find a recipe for .45ACP. It would be for a 1911 and to make holes in paper. So far I have only reloaded 9mm and I have received some good advice from you all for 9mm in my previous thread.

So I have precision Delta 230gr FMJ and HP38 (I'd like to stick with it). My Lee dies are in the mail. I've also invested in a dry tumbler and have been lubing my cases, and it makes a big difference. I've been reading many threads on the subject but I am still unsure when picking a recipe. I have four different sources  and I find many contradictions.

For example, one's maximum load is an other's minimum (Lee and Lyman), this looks like a potential squib or kaboom. Or is the difference of 0.07 enough to make up for it?

Also Nosler.com states two different  loads for HP38 and Win 231. So does Lyman but for bullet of a different grain than the one that I am interested in right now.

Here is a little table of the data I have compiled so far:

.45 ACP loads               
What would work for Precision Delta 230gr .45 FMJ RN over HP38/Win 231:         
               
Source                    Bullet                         Powder                 COL      Starting    Maximum
Hogdonreloading.com     230gr. HDY FMJ FP         HP38                     1.200       4.2gr        5.3gr
Lee modern reloading     230 gr Jacketed           HP38 & W231         1.200         4.2gr          5.3gr
Lyman 49th                   230 gr TMJ                  W231                     1.275        5.2gr         5.8gr
Nosler.com                     230 gr FMJ & JHP         W231                     1.200       4.8gr        5.8gr
Nosler.com                     230 gr FMJ & JHP         HP38                      1.200        4.5gr         5.5gr
« Last Edit: October 06, 2018, 08:45:01 AM by Wobbly »

Offline m1a_scoutguy

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 503
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2018, 12:34:24 AM »
Looks like some good info. Main thing is don't over think it. Decide what powder & bullet you want and go from there,231 is fine HP38 should be fine but I have never used it,never really used 231 much in the 45ACP although its good for that. I used Titegroup,a lead 230grn round nose loaded @ 4.6ish up to 4.8 with a OAL of 1.230. This load ran perfect in my Colt Combat Elite with 0 signs of anything negative. Make sure you crimp accordingly. ALWAYS check your work start LOW and work up,,NEVER take shortcuts. I'm sure other will be along,but get the stuff ya need and get loading !
  Also BUY one hard cover book for a solid reference, most everything else can be found @ Hodgdon.com. Book is nice if your not near a PC or your phone. All the sources you mentioned are fine although I like the Hornady Book and the Speer Book along with the Sierra, all are fine choices. I like the Hornady and Sierras for the Service Rifle Info if you ever go down that road. Keep us posted.

Offline M1A4ME

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7617
  • I've shot the rest, I now own the best - CZ
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2018, 06:44:07 AM »
My "go to" load for 1911's in .45 acp is a 230 grain LRN bullet (coated or uncoated, my 1911's don't seem to care) sitting on top of 6.0 grains of Unique or 5.0 grains of Bullseye.

Paper punching you say?  No need for jacketed/plated bullets.  Many people have issues with plated bullets (thin plating that isn't bonded to the lead core so well) that they don't have with the coated lead bullets.  And coated lead bullets aren't more expensive than plated bullets or jacketed bullets.
I just keep wasting time and money on other brands trying to find/make one shoot like my P07 and P09.  What is wrong with me?

Offline Pistolet

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2018, 08:57:32 AM »
Looks like some good info. Main thing is don't over think it. Decide what powder & bullet you want and go from there,231 is fine HP38 should be fine but I have never used it,never really used 231 much in the 45ACP although its good for that. 
  Also BUY one hard cover book for a solid reference,
My indecision comes from the wide variations I find with different sources of data and I do have two hard cover books, Lyman and Lee, and Lee's maximum load is almost Lyman's minimum by .1gr

Offline Pistolet

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2018, 09:02:28 AM »
My "go to" load for 1911's in .45 acp is a 230 grain LRN bullet (coated or uncoated, my 1911's don't seem to care) sitting on top of 6.0 grains of Unique or 5.0 grains of Bullseye.

Paper punching you say?  No need for jacketed/plated bullets.  Many people have issues with plated bullets (thin plating that isn't bonded to the lead core so well) that they don't have with the coated lead bullets.  And coated lead bullets aren't more expensive than plated bullets or jacketed bullets.
As a new reloader I thought I should start with jacketed RN. I will try Coated lead eventually, I still have 2000 jacketed to go through first.

Offline Earl Keese

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5200
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2018, 10:23:19 AM »
My 97B with CGW bushing loves coated lead 200gr swc. 25yd groups with those are less than half the size of 230gr jacketed.

Offline Wobbly

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12831
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2018, 10:37:54 AM »
First of all, 45ACP is a low pressure, straight-walled cartridge. That means that your process is going to be a sub-set of you're current process for loading 9mm, because 45ACP is much simpler by comparison.

The traditional target load for 45ACP is 200gr SWC. 200gr because the 1911 was designed to shoot 200gr, and therefore it shoots it best. SWC because that's a bullet specifically designed to punch clean holes in paper for better/easier scoring. Bullet speeds rarely exceed 950fps, meaning leading is a non-issue. So there is no real reason to spend money on plated or jacketed bullets, except for defensive rounds. Of course you can always use up what bullets you have on hand, but eventually you'll most probably want to work back to 200gr for better accuracy and lower cost.

Your major issue in loading 45ACP is going to be sorting large primer pocket brass from small primer pocket brass. Use of small pistol primers in 45ACP started about 2001, so there's lots of it around. But only a few brands are using small primers exclusively. By concentrating on small primer pocket brass, you could conceivably simplify your personal purchasing decisions by focusing on buying larger quantities of only one size primer. And too, there is the added advantage of not having to convert your reloading press from small to large primer feeds. The testing I've seen concluded there was no difference in powder ignition between the 2 primer sizes.

You might check out the web page http://brassbucket.net/ (run by one of your fellow CZ owners) if you need to buy 45ACP brass. And IF you need to buy brass, then you might want to concentrate on buying small primer brass.

Hope this helps.  ;)
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Offline Wobbly

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12831
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2018, 11:25:46 AM »
I've been reading many threads on the subject but I am still unsure when picking a recipe. I have four different sources and I find many contradictions. For example, one's maximum load is an other's minimum (Lee and Lyman), this looks like a potential squib or kaboom.

? As with all reloading, you want to have ONE primary reloading source. That, IMHO, should be your Lyman manual. If you don't trust the Lyman manual, then throw it in the trash can. If you can trust the Lyman manual, then set all others aside until you have a special bullet or powder not covered by the Lyman. In this respect, nothing is different from your adventures with reloading 9mm.

? As with all loads, beginning at the Starting Load, as given in a trusted manual, and working up with small incremental test loads while shooting at individual targets will tell you what the best load for your gun and your bullet will be. No one can tell you that, you have to do the work.

Due to the much lower chamber pressure in 45ACP, your faster powders are going to perform much better. Especially for target loads. Powders like 231/HP-38, Bullseye, Competition, N310, AA No2, etc are going to be the ones you'll want to test. So there is some overlap with 9mm powders.

? 45ACP is rather ironic in many respects. Because it's a larger physical cartridge, your brain is telling you it's going to be harder and more demanding to reload. While in actuality, the lower chamber pressure means 45ACP is far, far more forgiving than 9mm. Variations in powder and OAL that would/should scare your pants off in 9mm, have almost zero effect in 45ACP. Therefore, the load ranges are much wider, and the danger of "pressure spikes" and "kabooms" are almost non-existent in 45ACP. (A scan of Google images will probably turn up no blown up 1911's.) 45ACP is in short, the cartridge most new reloaders should start with while they perfect their process and work toward loading 9mm, not the other way around.


Hope this helps.  ;)
« Last Edit: October 06, 2018, 08:47:44 AM by Wobbly »
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Offline lewmed

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 656
  • 135th & 240th AHC Vietnam 1967-1968
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2018, 12:03:50 PM »
Out to 25 yards my 97BD, vintage Colt 1911 and Sig 220 all love just about any 200 gr jacketed, plated or lead bullet over a light load of W-231  4.5gr - 5.0gr

Offline 2bfree

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 480
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2018, 02:13:25 PM »
Just my 2 bits, I load a lot of 45 for my 5in 1911 using 5.2 of Hp 38/ Win 231 ( they are the same powder) Using Precision Delta 230gr FMJ , OAL 1.235. It seemed to be the best out of my ladders. Just remember start low and work to find the best load for your gun.

Offline CPTKILLER

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 359
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2018, 05:33:48 PM »
Look at the powder people.

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/pistol

http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/WesternLoadGuide1-2016_Web-1.pdf

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=185&shellid=183&bulletid=429
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=185&shellid=35&bulletid=335
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=185&shellid=35&bulletid=334
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=185&shellid=35&bulletid=59
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=200&shellid=35&bulletid=432
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=200&shellid=35&bulletid=434
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=200&shellid=35&bulletid=62
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=433
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=336
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=337
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=339
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=69
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=63
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=65
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=1&weight=230&shellid=35&bulletid=410

Offline IDescribe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4049
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2018, 09:49:38 PM »
Serious precision bullseye shooters shoot  185gr JHP, 185gr SWC, or 200gr SWC.

You're thinking "But I'm not a precision bullseye shooter?"

Correct, but 185gr and 200gr SWC are also cheap.  For target shooting, when the most accurate are also among your cheapest options, there's no point in considering anything else.

Below is a target loaded with Zero swaged lead 200gr SWC (as good as it gets for bullet precision for .45):



That's under 4 inches at 50 yards.

200gr has an advantage over 185gr at 50 yards when weather is uncooperative.  With good weather or at 25 yards, you won't see a difference.

ACME 175gr, 185gr and 200gr coated SWC are maybe a quarter-inch worse than Zero swaged at 50 yards, maybe less, maybe not at all worse. 

If I were loading for 50 yards bullseye competitions, I'd load Zero Swaged 200gr SWC.  If I were loading for anything else, I'd load ACME coated 185gr or 200gr SWC.  It's an easy easy recommendation.

With HP-38 and either of those bullets, you'll be looking for the most accurate load in the 725-775 feet/sec range. 

Offline Pistolet

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2018, 12:19:52 AM »
Okay then, I will stick with the Lyman Manual. I am aware of the big and small primers, I will probably be reusing both as I have been collecting mixed brass at the range. It's going to take a while to go through 2000 FMJs before I can try SWC.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2018, 08:57:57 AM by Wobbly »

Offline Wobbly

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12831
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: Trying to find a load for .45ACP
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2018, 08:57:15 AM »
Okay then, I will stick with the Lyman Manual.
That's a good bet. Are you aware that Lee buys their load data? They don't develop that data themselves. Lord knows where it comes from or how old it is.


I am aware of the big and small primers, I will probably be reusing both as I have been collecting mixed brass at the range.
You should be collecting all the range brass you can. But you can arrange to swap the large primer stuff 1:1 for small primer brass on http://brassbucket.net/ . Just because you have it, doesn't mean you need to keep it.


It's going to take a while to go through 2000 FMJs before I can try SWC.
Yes it will.
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.