NEW Tanfo EAA Polymer Witness P-S observations and a few questions

[OldGringo]

I just got back from the range with my new Tanfoglio EAA Polymer Witness P-S 9mm (saftey no decocker). I bought the gun as a bit of an impulse buy when I saw it for $279 NIB at a local shop.

1) The price was the major draw. I was out the door for under $300. Yes, you only get one mag and if anything goes wrong you've got EAA's legendary customer service to deal with, but for the price I was willing to take that chance. I plan on getting a .22 conversion kit for the pistol. Both the Witness P-S 9mm pistol and the .22 conversion kit are the price of CZ's conversion kits alone, when they're in stock.

2) So, the double-action is essentially a staple gun. This is not important to me as I'm not dropping the hammer or even carrying this in a holster but only shooting it from the bench at my local range. I noticed in diagrams and take-down videos that the mainspring  is very short when compared to the plunger and mainspring of a CZ or exact clone. From the parts diagrams, it appears almost like a SIG P210 (except it's not modular)- which is single-action only.

I'm assuming that compressing this very short mainspring is the reason for the brutal double-action and is inherent in the design. Again no bother to me, although I'd be interested if it has the same double-action for the decocker only models. That could be rough.

3)Single action is quite decent. It felt a bit more than my CZs but had a decent break with no over-travel. Trigger is wide and grooved.

4) Fit and finish were generally quite good with one exception. The sights easy to pick up. The ergonomics are very nice. It has a very heavy recoil spring and there are no serrations except in the rear of the slide so if you're into 'tactical' press checks (not me) good luck.

3) I tested it last night with my CZ factory mags and after-market blue-follower MecGar mags (my favorite) and they all fit and locked the slide back.

4) I took it to the range today and shot about 200 rounds of assorted ammo including brass, aluminum, steel, and hollowpoints. No failures or malfunctions. I only ran the mag that came with the pistol and it had no issues. The pistol shot great and the sights were spot on. Recoil was very light (just a bit more than my SP-01 but seemingly a bit less than my 75BD.)

5) The only issue I've had is after I got home and cleaned and lubed the firearm I noticed that the slide stop seemed to wiggle. For example, if I hold the pin firmly, there is 1/8 inch travel in the lever. Thus the pin is not firmly attached to the lever. While It didn't cause me any problems, I could see how it being loose might lead to failures to lock open on an empty mag or even locking open when the mag is not empty. If it gets any worse, I suppose it might just shear off.

I'd noticed this the night before - the Tanfo slide stop appears as if it is made of two distinct components: the pin and the lever.
I wondered about how this would hold up over time. This might not be an issue - maybe I can put thousands of rounds through it no problem until it has to be replaced as all CZ 75 style slide stops have to be replaced eventually.

After all, I do have two CZ slide stops for the two pistols that I own just for that reason. But it does seem odd after only 200 rounds...

Thus my question to you guys in the forum before I call EAA on Monday:

- For those of you guys who own Tanfos; do the slide stops have a tendency to wiggle like this? Is this normal break-in for this component?

- Does anyone in the forum that owns a Tanfo have a single construction (like CZs) or this dual construction slide stop?

- Has anyone who has purchased a Tanfo slide stop from EAA ($58 shipped - ouch ) noticed if they are single or dual construction?

Final Thoughts: Despite the odd slide-stop, I'm very happy with my purchase (especially for the price). In fact, if not for Tanfo's dual slide stop construction the pistol would have met and exceeded all my expectations.

I've seen these guns for sale for a lot more (over $400). At the higher price points I'd probably just save a little money and get a P-07, a P-09, or something else, but if you can find the Witness P-S for $250-300 they seem like fun range pistol for the money.

[win308]

If you like to tinker, replace your hammer spring with a S&W trigger return spring.  The lighter S&W spring helps the Tanfoglio double action trigger quite a bit.  Russian steel case ammo, with hard primers, will take a double strike with this lighter spring (to get ignition), but American primers light off just fine, as well as most European ammo, with just one hit from the hammer.

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=68220.0

[OldGringo]

Thanks, you get all kinds of fascinating info from this forum. 

I think I'll just keep this as a range gun which I'm only going to use single-action. I don't even have plans to buy a holster for it now (or maybe ever). I'm definitely going to check out those .22  conversion kits though.

Since I'm not going to drop the hammer on a loaded round the double action is somewhat moot for me even if I were to carry, it would be condition one- cocked and locked.

I'm wondering about the variant of this pistol that comes with the decocker. They don't seem to sell nearly as well here in the US but seem to be more common overseas (Italian municipal police for example). If the mainspring is anything close to the P-S model it must be brutal since you can only holster in condition two.

[darink300zx]

Oldgringo, congrats on your purchase. The PS model is a very good little gun and I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun with it.  I have two of them and have never had a problem with them.  My slide stop on them does not wiggle any, but I'm not sure what you mean anyway, do you mean where the two pieces of the stop are connected it wiggles?  I looked at a few of the slide stops in some of my witnesses, both large frame and small frame, and they seem to have the same construction as you describe (if I'm understanding it right).  I would contact EAA, describe the issue, send pictures if that'll help, they may send you another stop without requiring you to send in the gun.

I'd recommend getting the 22 conversion while they are available and cheap.  They seem to get imported in batches.  Sometimes you can find them, other times (more often it seems) they are out of stock everywhere.  Buds has them right now pretty cheap. 

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/711000674/Witness+Small+Frame+.22LR+Conversion+Kit+With+10+Round+Magazine

I have one of the small frame polymer witnesses with a decocker, a FAB 92 is what it's called (at least mine is, I know they have some older model tanfoglios that were steel frame) but I do believe they put a weaker hammer spring in them from the factory because I've had some light primer strikes with it.  You're right too, they don't seem as common and available as the other witnesses, but when I got mine I paid about the same as the PS sells for, 260ish I think is what i paid.  i prefer the traditional manual safety anyway, I just bought the decocker model on a whim really. 

[WiskyT]

All CZ style slide stops need to be replaced eventually?

[win308]

I don't like the newer Tanfoglio triggers.....too much curve for my fat fingers.  The older small frame trigger was perfect!!!

[OldGringo]

All CZ style slide stops need to be replaced eventually?

Yes, friction and wear build up over time where the barrel cams on the pin causing the slide stop to shear off. It is just the nature of the design, (it seems to be most reminiscent of the SIG P-210 from which the CZ 75 was inspired). You can partially mitigate the friction by lubing the slide stop pin and the kidney-shaped barrel cam. The newer polymer pistols (P-07 and P-09) might not suffer as much from this since the barrel pivots on the pin, but the 75s and their direct derivatives and clones do.

Wear and tear is dependent on round count, so if you're not putting thousands of rounds through your 75 than the slide stop should last a long time. Competitive shooters however, tend to go through slide stops frequently (compared to casual shooters) and always have extras for competitions. I'm no competitive shooter, but I've got two extra slide stops for my two 75s. It's a good part to have on hand.

 If you want more info, just use the search function on this forum. There are several threads on CZ 75 slide stops.

[OldGringo]

Oldgringo, congrats on your purchase. The PS model is a very good little gun and I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun with it.  I have two of them and have never had a problem with them.  My slide stop on them does not wiggle any, but I'm not sure what you mean anyway, do you mean where the two pieces of the stop are connected it wiggles?  I looked at a few of the slide stops in some of my witnesses, both large frame and small frame, and they seem to have the same construction as you describe (if I'm understanding it right).  I would contact EAA, describe the issue, send pictures if that'll help, they may send you another stop without requiring you to send in the gun.

I'd recommend getting the 22 conversion while they are available and cheap.  They seem to get imported in batches.  Sometimes you can find them, other times (more often it seems) they are out of stock everywhere.  Buds has them right now pretty cheap.

Yes, it's interesting; when I install the slide stop it seems firm - I'm guessing the force of the pin against the frame is keeping it that way. Only when I remove the pin do I notice the jiggle. Maybe that's not uncommon? I'll give EAA a call during business hours to try and find out.

I have to say that their prices on slide stops seem a little steep ($45 for the slide stop plus flat shipping $10 for a part that fits in an envelope) the irony is that I live in FL (3 hours away) and I also have to pay sales tax.

Yes, I noticed the price at Bud's and am thinking about that place for the .22 conversion kit.

[olfarhors]

Don't have any poly Tanfoglios, actually I am not really fond of poly weapons in any brand.
 Not sure if you are aware or not but  check out Hennings, they are basically the Cajun gun works and CZ- custom of the Tanfoglio world.
they can sale you all sorts of springs and do dads to improve your trigger if you want it as well as many spring companies (wolffe) offer  replacement springs for the Tanfoglios.
 older tans had the full length main springs, I forget when they went to the new shorter spring?
all three of my EAA Witness are very well built weapons with high quality fitting, especially the Elite Match.
anyway enjoy the weapon.

[jwc007]

OldGringo - Congratulations on your new EAA Polymer Witness PS and may it serve you well.   

[bubbas4570]

The slide stop on my B6P is a 2 piece pressed part, as is the FAB92's, and a Witness, and my friend's B6P.....and some are "wiggly" and some aren't.   I can tell which are having the higher round count put through them, as these are the ones that show more wiggle than the less used pistols.

From what I have gleaned from reading here is that this is almost a replacement part at a certain round count, and to pretty much just have a replacement on hand for that purpose. To that end, I am waiting for TRimports to get some slide stops on hand for the B6P,  as that is the worst (and highest round count) in the inventory.