CZs, Recoil Springs, and Muzzle Flip.

[Mifune326]

Some believe that putting a lighter recoil spring in a pistol makes the pistol shoot "flatter" while some believe that a heavier recoil spring makes the pistol shoot "flatter."  And I know that too heavy will make the front of the pistol dip when the slide returns all the way forward.  If I understand muzzle flip correctly, it occurs when the slide, in its rearward travel, smacks the pistol frame.  I've considered going lighter on my P-09.  Anybody already experiment with this or otherwise have any opinions on this topic?   Thanks!

[George16]

The power factor (bullet weight and velocity) and powder charge  will determine what springs are needed for optimum operation of your gun.

A heavier recoil spring is needed for high power factor rounds to prevent the slide from slamming the frame While lighter spring is needed for low power factor rounds. If the spring doesn?t match the ammo?s power factor, either the slide will be slamming the frame or the slide is too slow to return to battery producing ftf?s and stove pipes.

The recoil spring controls the amount of muzzle flip based on the ammo you?re using.

[1SOW]

"Some" tune "their" grip,  ammo and the muzzle rise with very fast shooting using the recoil spring.
Shoot say 5 RDS as fast as you can pull the irigger at a small paper target.  Repeat.

If your shots tend to string up, a heavier recoil spring will bring them down
If they tend to string Down,  then a lighter recoil spring will tend to increase muzzle rise and tighten the string length.

YMMV,  but as long as the pistol functions properly with the changed springs the above is true.

[movingslow]

I went lighter on my p09.    This wont help at all, but I honestly just found all the threads of people saying what is worth doing and what not and trusted (no one has ever regretted trusting the internet right?!  ).    I put about 700 rds through it before changing anything.   Mostly what I use is 115 grain.  I put the 18lb in from CGW and a ton of other stuff and its running better for me, but I did a bunch all at once.   I am also just getting better at shooting this thing.   

It wouldn't cost much to just try it out and if you don't like it just keep it as a spare.   (I ordered the 15# first and realized it was too light, again trusting the internet did not even shoot it. Now have that and the stock one as back ups)

In my head this all reads well, but also we have been drinking all day at work...

[fflmike]

The correct spring should eject the brass 6 to 8 feet from the gun for normal shooting.

[Vinny]

I went lighter on my p09.    This wont help at all, but I honestly just found all the threads of people saying what is worth doing and what not and trusted (no one has ever regretted trusting the internet right?!  ).    I put about 700 rds through it before changing anything.   Mostly what I use is 115 grain.  I put the 18lb in from CGW and a ton of other stuff and its running better for me, but I did a bunch all at once.   I am also just getting better at shooting this thing.   

It wouldn't cost much to just try it out and if you don't like it just keep it as a spare.   (I ordered the 15# first and realized it was too light, again trusting the internet did not even shoot it. Now have that and the stock one as back ups)

Many guys subscribe to the brass throwing distance for tuning recoil springs. Doesn't seem a very exact science to me.

I like 1SOW's strait-forward approach to tuning.

But, IMHO there is nothing wrong with putting 1000 rounds or so down the pipe before tinkering with anything.

In my experience with quite a few CZ's; they tend to smooth out after 1000+ rounds. Then, address issues as needed. I'm of the "If it ain't broke don't fix it" school.

Of course, some folks just don't want to go thru the break-in process; and I suppose there's also nothing wrong with just sending it off to CGW or CZ Custom for a professional tuning or DIY with the CGW parts.

 

[1SOW]

Mifune,  have you seen the slow motion pics of a Semi-Auto pistol cycling?
When did the slide move back compressing the spring (recoil),  before or after the bullet left the bbl ?  The "bulk" of the  gasses come next,  sort of like a rocket thrust.    Bullet's long gone.  Due to the leverage point being below the bbl,  the muzzle now rises.  A stronger recoil spring absorbs.stores some/more  of the recoil force..

Maybe I'm overlooking something .

[Mifune326]

Mifune,  have you seen the slow motion pics of a Semi-Auto pistol cycling?
When did the slide move back compressing the spring (recoil),  before or after the bullet left the bbl ?  The "bulk" of the  gasses come next,  sort of like a rocket thrust.    Bullet's long gone.  Due to the leverage point being below the bbl,  the muzzle now rises.  A stronger recoil spring absorbs.stores some/more  of the recoil force..

Maybe I'm overlooking something .

First of all, thank you everyone for your responses!  Very interesting discussion.

Hi ISOW.  Yes, I've seen those videos.   The slide begins to cycle after the bullet has left and it seems to me that the muzzle begins to rise when the slide first hits the frame.

[rhart]

"The slide begins to cycle after the bullet has left and it seems to me that the muzzle begins to rise when the slide first hits the frame."

This why some use shock buffers?