Author Topic: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday  (Read 2304 times)

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Offline Joe L

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P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« on: October 30, 2018, 06:52:41 AM »
I went to the range on Sunday to shoot my old P-09 bullseye and 200 yard demo gun, plus the house gun, an open sight P-226 with a light.  I had not shot either in a while, so this was just for kicks.  I thought maybe some of you plastic hammer gun folks might enjoy this.

Confirmed one of my old conclusions--that to shoot any particular gun really well, I need to shoot a bunch of rounds through it to re-learn how to move the trigger without moving the gun, and that I need to practice more with open sights on the P-226 since bullseye season is over.  This groups may look pretty good, but I've shot this size rest groups at 50 yards before, not just 25.  The variable being eyesight versus dot placement and some improvement in trigger control with more rounds.  The last standing single hand group was pretty good and the timed fire target standing single hand with the house gun was really good, for me. 

https://youtu.be/TXctuIIsed0

Reminded me that Sugru is a much more comfortable grip material than the JB-Weld I used on the P-09.  I need to fix that. 

Joe
CZ-75B 9mm and Kadet, 97B"E", two P-09's, P-07, P-10C, P-10F, P-10S, MTR

Offline Joe L

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2018, 07:08:27 AM »
Let me add, after just watching my own video, that there is nothing bad about the accuracy of the Sig P-226.  It has open sights and I struggled with the open sights after shooting red dots all year, that's all.  Also, the P-226 shoots the cheap ammo almost as well as the Atlanta Arms ammo and the CZ does not.  I spared you seeing the 8" groups with the P-09 and UMC ammo when I was first warming up to the old trigger.  Switched to the AA and continued refining the trigger pull, and the groups tightened up. 

I built a "good" Sig bullseye gun before I got the P-09 and then sold it to a friend who still uses it as a backup.  Good pistol, but it took a custom barrel and a red dot and some money.  The P-09 just needs a red dot and a CGW hammer.  And some Sugru and JB-Weld. 

Joe
CZ-75B 9mm and Kadet, 97B"E", two P-09's, P-07, P-10C, P-10F, P-10S, MTR

Offline briang2ad

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2018, 07:49:52 AM »
Joe:  Thanks for your videos, work, and commentary - all a great asset to this community of interest.  You DO help make the P series popular and accessible. 

Do you find the P07 with optic more accurate because of the shorter barrel and harmonics?

You do validate the 'need' for CZ UB to consider the P10 contour in the  "next gen" P hammer gun.

Great shooting sir!

Offline Earl Keese

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2018, 07:53:48 AM »
Good shooting Joe. Will you be able to practice through winter or does weather force you to take a break?
Brian- I wish CZ would make the P-07/09 with some palm swell!

Offline briang2ad

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2018, 08:09:34 AM »
Earl:  Roger.  I've always felt it was a bit on the skinny side.  However, as a combat/carry gun, it does make it easy to draw - the skinny grip.  I think they ought to rip off HK and make interchangeable side panels. 

AND, would it NOT be easy to offer thicker triggers one could drop in for guys with gorilla hands like Joe!

Offline Joe L

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2018, 08:45:00 AM »
I can shoot through the winter, it gets cold and some snow/ice, but it is flat, so not too bad.  I love cold weather, with a centerfire gun, less so with the Kadet. 

I put a red dot on my P-07 for a few months and did great with it.  With the shorter distance between the end bore in the slide and the chamber end, the barrel may have to be slightly looser to allow the barrel chamber end to drop the same distance as the longer barrel gun.  CGW would have to confirm that.  Perhaps the lock up isn't quite as tight as a longer barrel P-09, but I didn't try to quantify the small if any differences.  All pistol barrels are too short for harmonics to be much of a concern, I think.  I haven't shot the P-07 out to 200 yards, but I have to 100 yards with good results.  I had high score in (one!!) local bullseye match shooting the P-07, much to the surprise of my fellow custom 1911 buddies. 

So, generally, the shorter the barrel, the looser the fit has to be to the slide at the muzzle end to allow a semi-auto gun to function.  The exit velocity should probably be a slightly lower than a longer barrel gun so the holdover at 100 yards is different by a few inches, I think, so the P-07 should be harder to shoot well at 100 yards, but there isn't much of a degradation, in my opinion.  But I haven't done a lot of testing, just some.  Hard to get fired up to quantify small differences between two excellent firearms.  I did enough testing to be convinced that the differences were small, and stopped testing, took the red dot off, got a holster, and carry the gun with me now. 

Thanks for the kind words.

Joe
CZ-75B 9mm and Kadet, 97B"E", two P-09's, P-07, P-10C, P-10F, P-10S, MTR

Offline briang2ad

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2018, 09:27:02 AM »
Thanks Joe - your comments on the P07 and barrel fit on  a shorter gun are enlightening. 

Offline Joe L

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2018, 10:20:40 AM »
Thanks Joe - your comments on the P07 and barrel fit on  a shorter gun are enlightening.

Enlightening only if I am correct!  David would have to tell us if I am right or not.  Difference between 4-1/2" and 4" barrels may not be enough to require any difference.  The P-09 is the gold standard as far as I am concerned. 

Joe
CZ-75B 9mm and Kadet, 97B"E", two P-09's, P-07, P-10C, P-10F, P-10S, MTR

Offline briang2ad

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2018, 11:24:13 AM »
Quote
The P-09 is the gold standard as far as I am concerned. 

Ever shoot an HK P30L?  SIG X6? 

Offline Joe L

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2018, 09:13:19 PM »
Quote
The P-09 is the gold standard as far as I am concerned. 

Ever shoot an HK P30L?  SIG X6?

I have a Sig X5 but have never shot an HK P30L.  The X5 is a 9mm with the extractor problem that Bruce Gray tried to fix once, unsuccessfully.  Nice gun, but not with the factory extractor. 

Joe
CZ-75B 9mm and Kadet, 97B"E", two P-09's, P-07, P-10C, P-10F, P-10S, MTR

Offline briang2ad

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Re: P-09 at 25 yards on Sunday
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2018, 07:20:12 PM »
Thanks Joe.  You do pretty darn well with that OEM barrel...

 :)