Author Topic: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question  (Read 20027 times)

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Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2018, 08:39:08 PM »
Bullets are still right at .356.  So no reforming while loading.

Wobbly... good to know on where leading occurs and why.  Thanks.  As far as making sure I did not have any copper fouling. As far as I know, I did not. I cleaned it before I shot it. However, while shooting, I was also shooting some precision delta jacketed hollow points. Could that have something to do with it? Should you not shoot copper plated/jacketed and coated at the same time?

 Guess I?ll clean the barrel again after tomorrow?s competition. I?ll double check/triple check the cleanliness, then re-try the loads.
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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2018, 08:17:13 AM »
I was also shooting some precision delta jacketed hollow points. Could that have something to do with it? Should you not shoot copper plated/jacketed and coated at the same time?


Can't answer that. I intermix ammo, but my volumes of lead are much lower.

 ;)
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Offline dragon813gt

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Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2018, 02:37:48 PM »
There can be issues switching back and forth between lead and jacketed.  You will hear some guys suggest to shoot a few jacketed rounds after shooting lead to clean it out.  It can and will work.  But it can also ?iron on? any lead deposits left in the barrel.  This makes them virtually impossible to remove.

I don?t mix when shooting.  It?s one or the other.  But 95% if what I shout is lead that I cast myself, even rifles.  Once a barrel is shooting well w/ lead I don?t want to screw it up by switching to jacketed.  I don?t even like switching to a different lube on the bullets.

Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2018, 03:01:58 PM »
Had a 2-gun match yesterday - ran Precision Delta JHP bullets - cleaned barrel REALLY well - very shiny inside the bore.

Loaded about 125 ACME coated 124 RN.  Much larger bell than before, reduces taper crimp so the finish round just barely goes into the case gage (all for testing purposes).  Ran all through the gun - same leading at the muzzle end.  Crap.

Called ACME on Friday - very pleasant and willing to help.  Asked about crimp, belling, copper fouling, etc.  The lady said the best person to talk to had already left and to call back next week - so I'll do that.

Tried to figure out bore diameter - had issues getting the lead weight to go through evenly (this is where the lead ball idea would be great!) It appears I'm at .355 . 

Maybe I should get some bullets at .357 and see what happens....

Oh well.....  That is the latest
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Offline dragon813gt

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Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2018, 08:00:21 PM »
Take an empty 9mm case and place the fishing weight in it.  Then take a butane grill lighter or propane/map torch and heat it until the weight melts.  Let it cool and remove the slug w/ a kinetic puller.  Now you have a tapered slug to check your bore diameter.  If this was mentioned previously I missed it.

I stopped slugging bores but I cast my own.  I try different sizes and see what works best.  .357 for 9mm is what you will find most people sizing to.

Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2018, 07:39:34 AM »
dragon813gt,  Good idea I'll try that.

On another note, I tried these bullets in my Dad's gun and it did the same thing.  GRRr.

So, only option I haven't tried to see if it leads is a different powder.  I'm currently using Bullseye - 3.9grain  1030 FPS.
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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2018, 08:15:25 AM »
I had some leading with these bullets in one of my surplus pre-b's using HP-38. Like you, I adjusted/confirmed my die settings with no improvement. FWIW, I use the same bullets with a lighter load in my Scorpion (thousands of them) and the bore is clean as can be.
 I recently made the switch to Sport Pistol, and intend to move to .357 sized bullets. For curiosity's sake, I loaded up some of the ACME's with Sport Pistol and groups tightened somewhat(75&P10) and no leading. Rounds through each gun we're limited though as I was just testing for group size. I think I put about 40 rounds through each pistol.

Offline redbaron

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2018, 10:22:22 AM »
I've been using Bullseye for a while now with my 9mm, around the same load too. While every gun is different and the powder you're using could have something to do with the leading, I'm inclined to doubt it's your powder and load. As others have suggested, I'd try a bigger diameter bullet first to see if that helps you out. Leading near the muzzle does sound like the coating is failing, as Wobbly suggested. How much coating was scraped off those pulled bullets you have?

If you'd like, I could send you some of my 124gr. bullets sized to .357 and .358 if you want to try a bigger bullet

Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2018, 03:33:43 PM »
Redbaron,  Thanks for the offer.  Before I take you up on it I'll try a different powder to see what happens.

As far as coating removed - extremely little removed.  The width of a small hair the length of the bullet.

I didn't pull any from the latest batch where I had a larger bell.  I've got 4 left - if I remember I'll pull them tonight.

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If it goes "boom" or "vroom" I'm intersted.

Offline Dan_69GTX

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2018, 11:35:35 AM »
Latest update.

Tried the same load in another 9mm - this time a Walther PPQ M2 - 5".  Did the same thing.

Got a hold of someone at ACME who does a lot of reloading.  Summary of that conversation - He had the SAME THING happen to him.  However, it was NOT lead - his was carbon.  He thought it was lead due to the same color, but capturing several bullets in gel, the bullet was perfect.  He is pretty sure what I'm seeing is carbon, not lead, since carbon has the same basic color as lead.  He feels if I back off the load this will go away.  He also recommends a cleaner burning powder.  Asked what he recommended I try - Vit N320 (which of course I don't have).   So, I'll be trying some other powders and see what happens. 

Due to cars breaking and rain/sleet/snow in the forecast I doubt it will be before next week.
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Offline painter

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2018, 03:19:33 PM »
N 320 is worth a try.
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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #26 on: November 13, 2018, 04:15:08 PM »
Thats some interesting feedback from Acme. That may  explain my issues as well. Sport Pistol has been remarkably clean for me and a lot cheaper than N320.

Offline tdogg

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #27 on: November 13, 2018, 04:25:03 PM »
I have hard stubborn carbon in the lands of my TSO in 40.  I am running plated bullets though so I thought it was some weird pitting at first.  My bullets are also slightly undersized at .400 as opposed to .401.  My next batch of bullets is a FMJ and my hope is that it will obdurate to the bore and prevent this build up/blow by.  I have good accuracy but just want the bore to clean easier.

I may go to an oversize 0.402 coated lead bullet next (depending on the black friday sales).

I'm running Sport Pistol and have maybe gone through about 2lbs with this issue.

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Offline ThompsonCustom

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #28 on: November 13, 2018, 04:58:53 PM »
well assuming your getting leading and not carbon build up, your lube or in this case coating is failing because the leading is only towards the muzzle end of the barrel.

Of the last 5 cz barrels I've slugged every one of them came up with a bore of .3555 so I have stopped slugging them at this point. I like to run lead bullets .001 over so atleast .3565.

if your bullets are not undersized or scraped then all I came think of that would be left is powder/velocity and the coating itself not being thick enough or adhered right.

I could never get bulleye and Hi tek to run in my cz 75b so I just gave the bulleye away.

good luck with getting your leading issues figured out keep us updated.
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Offline lewmed

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Re: Coated bullets and lead residue in the barrel question
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2018, 05:42:43 PM »
   Try smashing one of your coated bullets in a vise or with a hammer if the coating is bad it will flake off. Before I started buying my coated bullets I coated and baked my own at home and that's how I tested them.  I've also recovered fired coated bullets from milk jugs filled with water and found the coating intact except for the rifling marks.