Author Topic: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?  (Read 12207 times)

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Offline newageroman

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2018, 10:23:25 AM »
I use the same lanolin lube. I have sprayed more liberally in the past, and have recently started spraying just one spray over small batch of ~100. I chose the non carbide dies because they were cheaper and available locally.

I did mic the bluebullets the other night and they were all .354. I haven't slugged my cz barrels, but I will do that in preparation for loading these up next week.
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Offline andrew1220

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2018, 10:50:47 AM »
Am I the only one who doesn't lube 9mm brass? It definitely would make sizing easier but I'm too lazy to apply and remove lube.

And yes Blue Bullets changed the coating process so there's no more blue fingers. I never cared as I ALWAYS wear nitrile gloves when reloading regardless of bullet type.

Offline cdhbrad

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2018, 11:01:11 AM »
I don't lube any pistol brass.  Rifle, absolutely, and I make up my own from Alcohol/Lanolin like many others.  I have to tumble my sized rifle brass to remove before loading.  Not going to do that with pistol brass on my Dillon 550.   

Offline andrew1220

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2018, 11:11:21 AM »
I don't lube any pistol brass.  Rifle, absolutely, and I make up my own from Alcohol/Lanolin like many others.  I have to tumble my sized rifle brass to remove before loading.  Not going to do that with pistol brass on my Dillon 550.   
Agreed. I only lube my rifle brass too.

Offline newageroman

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2018, 02:28:25 PM »
When I opened the bag of the newly forumalted blue bullets to mic them, I intentionally tried to rub some off on my fingers. none that I could tell. Then I drove my hand into the bottom of the bag and swooshed it around, came out with a noticeable blue tinge, so I'm sure its minified, but still exists.

My plan is to roll them around in an old T shirt/towel to shake off any initial residue, wear glove when loading and then maybe tumble them after loading.

I looked at possible additional tumbling tubs. I think I'm going to try a 2 gallon round igloo cooler to start. Tough, cheap ~$10, wide screw on top and about the same size as the lyman tub.
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Offline painter

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2018, 03:17:24 PM »
I use the same lanolin lube. I have sprayed more liberally in the past, and have recently started spraying just one spray over small batch of ~100. I chose the non carbide dies because they were cheaper and available locally.

I did mic the bluebullets the other night and they were all .354. I haven't slugged my cz barrels, but I will do that in preparation for loading these up next week.
I'll guarantee all your CZ barrels are larger than .354...a very common number is .3555 when measured with a quality micrometer that measures to 4 places.

.354 is undersized for any 9mm bullet, be it jacketed, plated, or lead.
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Offline andrew1220

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2018, 03:27:07 PM »

My plan is to roll them around in an old T shirt/towel to shake off any initial residue, wear glove when loading and then maybe tumble them after loading.

Seems like a huge waste of time in my opinion. I don't understand the concern with this? :o
They don't shoot more accurately with all of the residue removed/tumbled off. I wear gloves and I barely have a blue tint on my nitrile gloves after loading a thousand of them. I shoot too much to be bothered with that.

But to each their own! :D

Offline Earl Keese

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2018, 05:52:50 PM »
Why would they even make undersized bullets. What purpose do they serve?

Offline painter

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2018, 07:42:41 PM »
Why would they even make undersized bullets. What purpose do they serve?
OOOOPs?
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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #24 on: December 04, 2018, 07:44:13 PM »
Why would they even make undersized bullets. What purpose do they serve?
OOOOPs?
Serious question, this is normal for Blue Bullets correct?

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Offline painter

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #25 on: December 04, 2018, 08:04:18 PM »
Why would they even make undersized bullets. What purpose do they serve?
OOOOPs?
Serious question, this is normal for Blue Bullets correct?

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Earl, I don't know if it's normal for the brand.

If Blue Bullets are regularly sized too small for a standard 9mm barrel, why would anyone buy them?

Personally, I wouldn't buy any non jacketed bullet smaller than .356.
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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #26 on: December 04, 2018, 08:09:36 PM »
Why would they even make undersized bullets. What purpose do they serve?
OOOOPs?
Serious question, this is normal for Blue Bullets correct?

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Earl, I don't know if it's normal for the brand.

If Blue Bullets are regularly sized too small for a standard 9mm barrel, why would anyone buy them?

Personally, I wouldn't buy any non jacketed bullet smaller than .356.
I've previously read about Blues being undersized, not .354, but undersized for lead at .355. Idescribe mentioned it in post #7.
 I know they sell a lot of bullets and sponsor a lot of matches. Just wondering what their reasoning is.

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Offline painter

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2018, 08:16:33 PM »
I don't shoot lead, but I'm going to fall back on Jameslovesjammie's theory that lead bullets should be sized at .358 in 9mm. It does no harm being perhaps .001 oversized, and you'll never have an issue with leading.

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Offline Earl Keese

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2018, 08:22:28 PM »
I don't shoot lead, but I'm going to fall back on Jameslovesjammie's theory that lead bullets should be sized at .358 in 9mm. It does no harm being perhaps .001 oversized, and you'll never have an issue with leading.
I'm waiting on a case of 135's sized to .357. All of my barrels have been slugged and .357 should be good. I've had some that were .3555 from Acme and had some leading issues. If I was shooting blues, I can only imagine the leading I would've  seen.
 I may end up with Jacketed for my pistols and keep the coated lead for the pcc. The pcc goes through too many to pay for jacketed. Sorry for the thread hijack.

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Offline IDescribe

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Re: N320 or Sport Pistol with 125 BlueBullets?
« Reply #29 on: December 05, 2018, 06:09:15 AM »
Cast bullet and coated cast bullet manufacturers list the diameters of their bullets.

The standard for 9mm jacketed is .355.  The standard for 9mm cast and coated cast lead is .356, and almost all 9mm cast and coated cast lead bullets are listed as .356.  IF you take a micrometer (not calipers) and measure them, you can see that they vary a little, and some manufacturers vary more than others. 

A couple of years ago, Wobbly sold me a couple of fine micrometers, and I measured the 7 bullets (from 6 manufacturers) that I had on hand.  Those results are below, plus measurements for the SNS 125gr CN that I bought at some later point:

PD .356 124gr RN  -- 1 @ .3560  |  1 @ .3561  |  3 @ .3562  |  5 @ .3563
PD .355 124gr JHP -- 2 @ .3550  |  6 @ .3551  |  2 @ .3552
MG .355 124gr JHP -- 1 @ .3551  |  1 @ .3552  |  7 @ .3553  |  1 @ .3554
ACME.356 147gr FP -- 7 @ .3561  |  3 @ .3562
Bayou .356 124 TCG - 1 @ .3565  |  2 @ .3568  |  5@ .3569  |  1 @ .3571  |  1 @ .3572
Blue .355 125gr RN -- 4 @ .3555  | 6 @ .3556
SNS .356 135gr RN -- 1 @ .3559  |  3 @.3560  |  5 @ .3561  |  1 @ .3562
SNS .356 125gr CN -- 1 @ .3554  | 6 @ .3555  |  2 @ .3556  |  1 @ .3557

In the post where I reported the SNS 125gr CN, I also measured some SNS 125gr RN, and I did not go all the way to ten bullets and make a record for some reason, but there is a note that I measured several and that they were all coming in at .3555.

I should note that the SNS 135gr RN that averaged out at/around .3560/.3561 were bought at a different time than the two 125gr SNS bullets.  I do not know if the difference in the average of .3561 for the 135gr RN vs the .3555 for the 125gr CN is a difference in mould, sizing dies, or how much coffee the guy sizing the bullets had that morning.

NOW, Blue Bullets lists their bullets at .355.  That's what they tell you they are selling you.  My micrometer says they're .3555/.3556, or at least that's what it was a couple of years ago with that batch.

Earl asked why Blue Bullets makes them under-sized.  Blue Bullets says they have done extensive testing and that .356 offers no advantage of .355.  This is unfortunate because it is flat wrong.  The mantra of the lead bullet caster is fit is king -- at least the bullet caster who hangs out here ;)  (AND every other one I've read anything from on bullet to barrel fit).  There is little to no debate among bullet casters about bigger being better. 

I'm not saying Blue Bullets are bad bullets.  The consistency shown above was equaled only by the one ACME bullet measured.  In my Glock and my VP9, Blue Bullets are lasers.  I think they are excellent bullets, but they are under-sized, and they don't do as well as "standard" sized or over-sized in my CZ Shadowline, which is the pistol that EVERY 9mm bullet I buy is first tested in.  I don't know how many bullets I've tested in that CZ, but the trend is clear -- for cast lead, .3555 (Blue Bullets and those two SNS) is not as good as .356, and .356 is not as good as .3565, which is not as good as .357.

Some people have used Blue Bullets .38/.357 (sized .358) 125gr bullets in their CZs with great results.  I know of one guy at Benos who bought their 147gr bullet sized .358, but the extra diameter meant that it had to be seated too short for a CZ, so I would not recommend that.  Blue Bullets also now allows you to buy 9mm sized .356, but I haven't tried those myself.  I don't even know if they are properly sized.  I do know of someone who ordered oversized bullets from SNS and had them come in standard sized, called SNS and reported it, SNS shipped new over-sized bullets to him again, and they came in not over-sized again.  I really don't know what the deal is there, and I know too little about post-sizing cast bullets to speculate.  Again, could have been an issue with coffee.

At the end of the day, I question whether the poster above got Blue Bullets at .354.  I have never heard of that with them or anyone else.  And I think it's more likely that there's a calibration issue with the tool he used to measure.