To Lube or Not to Lube with Carbide Dies

[recoilguy]

Moderators have split off a discussion of the need for lubrication during reloading due to it overtaking the original discussion, which pertained more to lead bullets and their sizing. Original Discussion Is Here

Am I the only one who doesn't lube 9mm brass? It definitely would make sizing easier but I'm too lazy to apply and remove lube.

And yes Blue Bullets changed the coating process so there's no more blue fingers. I never cared as I ALWAYS wear nitrile gloves when reloading regardless of bullet type.

No you are not. There is no need to lube 9mm brass. I guess it doesn't hurt anything and if others like to so be it. I tried it when I read about it on this site and all the folks who did it. I noticed zero effect in my process so I don't do it.

RCG

[IDescribe]

No you are not. There is no need to lube 9mm brass.

Less wear and tear on the brass and die.
Less force needed to resize, thus less force applied (unevenly) to shellplate -- so more consistent seating and less runout.

AND in MY case, prior to my using lube, during a particularly long reloading session when I suppose the carbide ring was heating up and expanding a hair, I had a case gall inside a Redding sizing die and get torn out of the shellplate.  If you have that happen to you once, you won't use carbide dies without lube again. 

[newageroman]

I loaded up another 500 rounds of these on the D650 last night. Had to open the bell just a hair to quickly seat the bullets better and prevent them from being seated crooked which trimmed off some of the blue coating. Once I got that down, the rounds flowing out of the thing (besides checking cases for 380s and stepped cases and primer pick up tubes). I did reduce my lube to one short spray per bag or ~150 cases and there was less residual lube on the finished rounds, but its still there. Press still ran pretty smooth with this process. Man I love that machine!

Sport Pistol did seem to meter very well through the drop.

I've got a second tumbling tub on the way now and plan to use it with walnut to finish polish the finished rounds. Should be picking up my first chrono this weekend. Long Range Mentor and I are getting together to group some high vel 6.5 rounds for the 1760 shoot in Jan. It was a hard choice though, Go get the chrono, or stay local and run the USPSA match. still good choices to have.

Regarding finish polishing: would ya'll recommend just straight lizard bedding/walnut media or add dab of nufinish? It seems kind of counter intuitive to add wax while tumbling to remove wax. SS media too or just walnuts?

thx for the tips, more reports to come soon.

[newageroman]

About 1/2 a bag of lizard bedding walnut media in the new dry tub (no Nu-finish) for 15 minutes and ammo is completely gone of any lube. has a light dusting of media that falls off when handling. I will be using this method to finish tumbling all rounds. As an aside, I can see how this would add some dry lube to completely clean wet cases. I wasn't able to get the chrono, so might be a while before getting any velocity numbers on these.

[IDescribe]

What do you use to get the lube of the inside of the cases where it can foul the powder and cause an actual problem?

[Wobbly]

What do you use to get the lube of the inside of the cases where it can foul the powder and cause an actual problem?

I use care.

I lay all the cases on their side before spraying my case lube. That way none gets inside.

[recoilguy]

Wobbly, Awesome answer! The same thing that should be used in every step until the bullet is complete.

I've been trying hard and I still don't get the lube 9mm brass thing...?.but to each their own.

In my mind its like putting water in the fridge before making ice so when you put it in the feezer its colder already. A lot of extra work and the ice is still the same ice it would have been if you didnt chill it first.

RCG

[newageroman]

bullet:125 gn blue bullets 9mm
powder: Sport Pistol - 4.0gn
COAL: ~1125 (I'll have to confirm this, going off memory)

I still like using the lanolin lube - even for pistol, but I do realize I was using too much. I went from 3 or 4 sprays to just 1 spray and angle it more toward the bag as opposed to the brass. I've noticed a lot less powder clinging to the inside rim of the brass when checking/confirming powder charges. I used to have to take a case and clean it out with a Q tip to get an accurate powder measure on the scale. Now I find about 1 out of 5 have powder stick to the inside rim. With super clean wet tumbled brass, and not using lube - I've had issues with the case sticking to the drop tube before, even after polishing the tube. I believe the lube helps the press run smoother.

Previously I noticed a bit of sticky gunk in my pistols - around the sides of the action/chamber and on the feed ramp, which I believe to be residual lube from my previous method (too much lube and left it on after loading). I did still notice some of this gunk even after reducing the amount of lube sprays I used to lube the brass. I'm going to be watching for this to see if it is decreased with these rounds that are dry tumbled after loading. Also I'm hoping that dry tumbling will knock off most/more of the remaining blue powder residue of the bullets.

If I ever get my hands on a chrono I will do velocity/accuracy testing on these rounds, but that will most likely be sometime next year.

[andrew1220]

I've been trying hard and I still don't get the lube 9mm brass thing...?.but to each their own.

A lot of extra work.

Yep

[Mods cleaned up post]

[Wobbly]

I've been trying hard and I still don't get the lube 9mm brass thing...?.but to each their own.

A lot of extra work.

Yep

Sorry, I'm at a loss to see how pouring out the brass on a towel and spritzing it 1 or 2 times before I load it into the case feeder constitutes "a lot of work".

Even when I used a "lube pad" and rolled every 4th or 5th case on the pad before inserting it into my 550 didn't even come close to constituting "work", much less "a lot" of it.

If you don't want to lube, then don't. But let's not scare the new guys here to learn with 'fake news'.

[recoilguy]

My point exactly...?.Carbide dies don't require lube.... its a choice you make.
If you want to go ahead - but lets not scare people into thinking they must do what is a choice with fake news either


to be fair, I never said or ever implied not to do it and in my wildest imagination can't see how what I wrote would scare anyone into anything. I just said I don't get it and I still don't get it.

RCG

[Earl Keese]

I've tried it both ways. The difference in feel(lever effort) coming out of the sizing die is enough to convince me.

[IDescribe]

What do you use to get the lube of the inside of the cases where it can foul the powder and cause an actual problem?

I use care.

I lay all the cases on their side before spraying my case lube. That way none gets inside.

I should use quotes more.  I was responding to Newageroman's posy before yours.  😉

[newageroman]

For those who wet tumble it is not uncommon to get the cases sticking on the drop tube of the powder measure. It happened to me when loading 45 using RCBS CARBIDE DIES. I asked what's up with that in a very popular Dillon reloading group and found out it was not uncommon and lubing the inside of the casemouth (spray lube, dry lube, dry tumbling, whatever) helped resolve the issue. If you don't wet tumble you will likely never see this issue.

It really isn't directly related to sizing, OR carbide dies. For me, this is the primary reason that I started lubing pistol brass when reloading. The easier sizing is just a bonus.

[Wobbly]

Wobbly, Awesome answer! The same thing that should be used in every step until the bullet is complete.

I've been trying hard and I still don't get the lube 9mm brass thing...?.but to each their own.

I might feel (or at least DO) differently, but I had a old, worn out lube pad when I started this. And as I bought and sold reloading equipment a new bottle of RCBS lube pad 'goo' came my way. There's no way selling a press with or without case lubricant helps the price, so I kept it. I tried it, and liked it.

Then when I got my case feeder, a bottle of Dillon spray case lube came my way. Again, it was standing there staring at me, and so I started using it. Again, I liked it.

So the short story is that in the last 18 years, I've never paid for case lube, lube pads, or any of this stuff. (I should really make bumper stickers that say "Case Lube Happens"  ) And truth be known... I'm so cheap that if it didn't fall out of the sky, I'd probably never buy it. Especially at $21 a bottle of Dillon case lube ! 

But once tried, I saw a real difference, and now wouldn't reload without it.