Author Topic: Minimize trimming on 223/556  (Read 348 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline newageroman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 275
    • BrassBucket.net - buy/sell/trade for free - site owner
Minimize trimming on 223/556
« on: July 17, 2019, 12:25:22 PM »
I'm looking into ways to minimize trimming on these rifle rounds, mainly because I have a few k's of them and only want to go through it once if possible. When I sized my new starline 6.5 cm brass with forster bushing die and shot them, they didn't grow, they actually shrunk (Bonus - no trimming!). I'm wondering if I use bushing dies on the 223 if it will have the same effect. I've also heard about the RCBS x-dies that are supposed to minimize trimming, but I can't figure out how exactly they are different and why that should work.

I bought a few 40mm ammo cans a few weeks ago and am determined to fill them up, starting with 223. I honestly don't shoot the AR that much, but still would like the stockpile. I've settled on a standard load using 55gn bullet and mild load of H335 powder. I'll most likely use a brass catcher to keep my trimmed and PP champhered brass separate from the public range brass that might be picked up.

So... right now I have resized them all (SS), and have about half of them sorted into "needs trimming" pile and "doesn't need trimming" pile using 1.758" as a max trim length. After I get them sorted, I will champher the primer pockets using a champher tool in a hand drill, then hot wash and dry them and have them ready to load on the 650.

The ones that need trimming will be done with the Lee Quick trim (either on SS or the 650) down to ~1.754", but they will still need to have the PP champhered/swaged (I don't have the super swager, but I'm now considering it).

So in summary, is there anything you can do (aside from using mild loads and trimming them back more initially) to minimize the need for trimming on 223. Anyone have experience with the RCBS X-dies?
75B-SAO-USPSA gun, SP-01

http://brassbucket.net/ - buy/sell/trade for free - site owner

http://brassbucket.net/ace-digital-brass-trim-kit/" - Ace Digital Brass Trim Kit - low cost rifle brass trimming for D650 and SS presses

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1377
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2019, 08:53:19 PM »
Don't bump the shoulder as much.   Set your sizing die to only bump the shoulder .004".  You could try less but for an AR that is safe.  It only needs to be pushed back enough to chamber the round.   This is assuming you only have a single 5.56 rifle.   If you have more then you have to set the shoulder bump to the tightest chamber.

Cheers,
Toby

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Offline newageroman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 275
    • BrassBucket.net - buy/sell/trade for free - site owner
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2019, 10:17:16 AM »
I have only 1 AR. I have the SS setup to cam over and have already sized them all! Good tip though - thanks for reminding me about that point. I'll keep that in mind for next time. I looked at the swageit for the 650 and it was like $169, so yeah, skipping that and just going primer pocket reamer with hand drill for now.
75B-SAO-USPSA gun, SP-01

http://brassbucket.net/ - buy/sell/trade for free - site owner

http://brassbucket.net/ace-digital-brass-trim-kit/" - Ace Digital Brass Trim Kit - low cost rifle brass trimming for D650 and SS presses

Offline xhairczs

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2019, 11:15:53 AM »
I am not sure how much difference a die makes in the need to trim bottle neck brass and I’ve always been under the impression that neck growth is a function of firing the cartridge.  For years I have always just trimmed them back to the minimum the 1st time and spot checked length when reloading again.  Once they start to approach maximum, then they get trimmed again.

Offline jwc007

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7652
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2019, 03:03:45 PM »
My technique for resizing .223/5.56 has been:

1) size and decap the shell in a carbide .380 ACP sizing die, which squeezes the base down only,
2) then resize the Case in the regular sizing die, without the case mouth expander installed
3) expand the case mouth with the Case Mouth Expander shaft installed

This method insures that the Case neck and shoulder are not pulled forward, artificially lengthening the case.
I've only had to trim every 5th loading or so.  Use Lubrication, as required!

With a standard 5.56 chamber, you can skip step 1,  but my AR15A2 HBAR was built with a Barrel with a very tight Match Chamber.  Something I'll NEVER do again.
Instead, I'll probably opt for a 223 Wylde Chamber, and it is time I re-barreled that Rifle.
"Easy is the path to wisdom for those not blinded by ego." - Yoda


For all of those killed by a 9mm: "Get up! You are not dead! You were shot with a useless cartridge!"

Offline Wobbly

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9358
  • Loves the smell of VihtaVuori in the morning !
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2019, 06:01:32 PM »
Buy a Dillon 650...
...then buy the in-press Dillon trimmer I have for sale. Let the case feeder drop the cases into place while you sit back and only pull the op lever. You can de-prime, swage, and trim all in one smooth pass.

It's only "one low monthly payment" !!   O0
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Immature reloaders ask: What's wrong with this gun?
Mature reloaders ask: What did I do wrong?

Check out my reloading equipment for sale CLICK HERE

Offline mauserand9mm

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 278
Re: Minimize trimming on 223/556
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2019, 11:31:04 PM »
Case stretching comes about from headspace from FLS. The more "slop" in the headspace (full length resizing down too far), the more the cases will stretch.

The expanders on reloading dies don't stretch cases - the neck sizing operation swages the brass, so it will get longer, but all the stretching happens when the case is fired. The brass that results in the case stretching comes from just above the solid web.

Even tight fitting brass will stretch because the firing pin will drive the case into the chamber and set back the shoulder a little bit - sharp angled, large shoulder cases are less prone to this though.

The 8x57 Mauser round has a small, weak shoulder and tend to stretch quite a lot in my ex-mil Mausers even though I set the FLS die to give a tight fit of brass in the rifle. I suspect the firing pin force is "above normal" in the ex-mil Mausers - must be, it sets off the hard primered machine gun ammo no problems.