Author Topic: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?  (Read 3413 times)

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Offline Insert

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“No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« on: October 14, 2019, 11:03:51 PM »
Just found out about this in my states USCCA page



How could I possibly (legally)  carry at all since I’d have to check every single establishment I enter? I can’t teleport to my gun to my cars glove compartment every time I see one of those signs. I always assumed (shame on me, I suppose) that these can be ignored legally since it’s just a businesses policy and not written into the the gun free zone act of 1990. At least in some other states you are granted the ability to leave the premise upon being caught but here in CT it’s just straight up a felony. I only started carrying very recently and now I don’t know anymore...

Offline SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2019, 04:51:21 AM »
In Ohio a business may post a no guns allowed sign and you are REQUIRED to heed the sign. It is a misdemeanor citation in most places if you are caught in violation. Government properties such as court houses and police stations are another matter.
I have no problem carrying most places I go since most places here do understand that bad people will do bad things regardless of signage. There are places that fly the sign though and signs must be posted at ALL entrances in plain sight so you can't post a sign in the back of the shop and try to catch someone carrying.
It is up to you to pay attention to where signs are posted and yes if you walk across the parking lot only to find a no guns sign posted then yes you have to walk all the way back and remove your gun. Since it is a felony where you are I would pay particular attention. If you are still unsure your very best bet here is to consult an attorney on the matter. I would not want to get hit with such a life altering charge based on information I got on an internet forum.

Offline Earl Keese

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2019, 06:19:44 AM »
When you carry, you quickly learn which businesses get your money and which ones do not.

Offline John A.

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2019, 07:15:40 AM »
When you carry, you quickly learn which businesses get your money and which ones do not.

This is what I was going to say too.
When people ignorant of guns make gun laws, you end up with ignorant gun laws.

Offline SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2019, 08:02:19 AM »
When you carry, you quickly learn which businesses get your money and which ones do not.

This is what I was going to say too.
I completely agree with this but I have yet to find a doctors office or hospital that allows carry on the premises so unfortunately allowances have to be made. I have turned around and walked away from many restaurants however.

Offline Earl Keese

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2019, 09:01:54 AM »
When you carry, you quickly learn which businesses get your money and which ones do not.

This is what I was going to say too.
I completely agree with this but I have yet to find a doctors office or hospital that allows carry on the premises so unfortunately allowances have to be made. I have turned around and walked away from many restaurants however.
Same here, sometimes disarming is prudent.

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Offline Joe L

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2019, 09:16:54 AM »
Check a little deeper in to the physical requirements for the no firearms sign.  Here's why. 

In Texas, we have a very clear definition of the details of the sign.  It has to be a certain size and have the exact wording prescribed by law.  In other words, a Post-It note in pencil stuck on a window 6 feet from the entry door isn't sufficient.  And a banner with 2 foot tall letters on an awning visible from a block away isn't sufficient either.  The wording, font, size, color, and location of the sign is prescribed by Texas law.  Intent to prohibit is not sufficient.  The business owner must obtain and post the notice properly.  A post-it note or index card won't cut it. 

In Texas, some businesses try to have it both ways, with some success I think.  The business owners will post a non-official sign that looks official enough for most people to think they are entering a no-carry zone, but most licensed-to-carry people see the sign does not meet the requirements and can choose to ignore the sign from a legal standpoint, IF the permit holder is carrying concealed.   Everyone is happy, at least until one side or the other challenges the signage and presses the owner either to post the proper sign or take down the non-conforming one. 

Joe

Joe
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Offline CzechLands

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2019, 11:39:22 AM »
If I conceal and they don't have metal detectors, they will never know. I love to break mental laws O0

Offline Old-Duckman

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2019, 12:29:52 PM »
If I conceal and they don't have metal detectors, they will never know. I love to break mental laws O0
Agreed, and if they don't how would they know you are carrying? Should you need your firearm in their "no carry" establishment...would you care about their stupid no carry sign laws if you saved your life or the lives of your loved ones or other innocent patrons ? I'd take that chance. 

Offline Old-Duckman

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2019, 12:35:36 PM »
I recently attended a class at the club I belong to and a retired DA spoke about PA laws regarding such signs. They are legal to post but have no legal authority. If the owner of the establishment asks you to leave their place of business and you refuse you could be charged with trespassing.

Offline Insert

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2019, 01:22:15 PM »
I recently attended a class at the club I belong to and a retired DA spoke about PA laws regarding such signs. They are legal to post but have no legal authority. If the owner of the establishment asks you to leave their place of business and you refuse you could be charged with trespassing.

See, that I’m fine with since I would probably never refuse to leave so therefore the potential consequence is very low. But if I’m charged with a felony straight up if I’m caught printing or whatever, then that makes me incredibly nervous about where I go when carrying. The problem is that it not only makes it a logistic nightmare to vet every store but it also adds complication to carry in general. Sometimes I’m not always the one driving or going back to the car isn’t really feasible. I’m probably going to consult a lawyer or someone knowledgeable locally since it seems every state that has this provision has all sorts of weird provisions about it. What a great and totally not confusing system we ha be to live with! I’m so glad I bothered to get my permit!

Offline Rcher

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2019, 03:23:58 PM »
Concealed or open carry is not even allowed at the gun ranges I visit.
Gun must be unloaded in the gun case or bag or in the holster, but holster must be in the bag.

Offline Earl Keese

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2019, 06:22:31 PM »
I recently attended a class at the club I belong to and a retired DA spoke about PA laws regarding such signs. They are legal to post but have no legal authority. If the owner of the establishment asks you to leave their place of business and you refuse you could be charged with trespassing.

See, that I’m fine with since I would probably never refuse to leave so therefore the potential consequence is very low. But if I’m charged with a felony straight up if I’m caught printing or whatever, then that makes me incredibly nervous about where I go when carrying. The problem is that it not only makes it a logistic nightmare to vet every store but it also adds complication to carry in general. Sometimes I’m not always the one driving or going back to the car isn’t really feasible. I’m probably going to consult a lawyer or someone knowledgeable locally since it seems every state that has this provision has all sorts of weird provisions about it. What a great and totally not confusing system we ha be to live with! I’m so glad I bothered to get my permit!
You're over complicating this, it isn't really that difficult. Once you actually start carrying you learn the ropes pretty quickly. You should be avoiding gun free zones and soft targets in general anyway. Concealed carry done correctly is about state of mind, awareness,  and readiness. It's not a casual choice.

Offline deadguy

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2019, 07:04:22 PM »
Driving by the front door looking for a posted sign is an easy way to avoid walking up and having to walk back. 


Offline Insert

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Re: “No gun” signs carry legal weight in my state; what to do?
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2019, 08:13:12 PM »
I recently attended a class at the club I belong to and a retired DA spoke about PA laws regarding such signs. They are legal to post but have no legal authority. If the owner of the establishment asks you to leave their place of business and you refuse you could be charged with trespassing.

See, that I’m fine with since I would probably never refuse to leave so therefore the potential consequence is very low. But if I’m charged with a felony straight up if I’m caught printing or whatever, then that makes me incredibly nervous about where I go when carrying. The problem is that it not only makes it a logistic nightmare to vet every store but it also adds complication to carry in general. Sometimes I’m not always the one driving or going back to the car isn’t really feasible. I’m probably going to consult a lawyer or someone knowledgeable locally since it seems every state that has this provision has all sorts of weird provisions about it. What a great and totally not confusing system we ha be to live with! I’m so glad I bothered to get my permit!
You're over complicating this, it isn't really that difficult. Once you actually start carrying you learn the ropes pretty quickly. You should be avoiding gun free zones and soft targets in general anyway. Concealed carry done correctly is about state of mind, awareness,  and readiness. It's not a casual choice.

I am well aware of gun free zones (ie schools and federal buildings) and while I don't agree with them at all, at least it's pretty cut and dry. As for a "casual choice", I feel as though I am advocating the opposite! I want to carry about as 100% as possible (minus the specific GFZ areas) and now the fact that I actually have to obey some dumb stores "no gun" sign (which I can't even find if there's a mandated sign so I guess they can post any kind of sign and I'd have to follow it lol) is pretty disheartening. Like as of now, I only know of one place where I get gas that has said sign but I have to be ready to disarm myself at any given storefront or property or risk receiving a felony; aka F-ing my whole life up. As for avoiding these signs, I think that's way easier said than done; like I sometimes have to go places in life where I don't have a choice. I could be over thinking this but finding this out really scared me. It's funny that I am more scared of not violating some stupid, unclear state law than any actual deadly threat lol.

 

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