135gr Reloading Question with Sport Pistol

[WNCRob]

Hello all...just getting back into pistols.  Back in the day (25-30 years ago) I shot a lot of USPS open, 38 Super.  I have about 1500 jacketed 135gr RN bullets left over that I want to load in 9X19 for my SP-01s.  I also bought some Sport Pistol as my old powder (mostly 231) is about 15 years old.  Anyway, the Alliant web site has pretty limited info...so, I'm guessing at charge weights.  I'm thinking I'll load them at 1.125" oal, and between 3.7 and 4.0 gr to get about 130pf.  Id REALLY appreciate some input here as it's been quite a while and I have no experience with Sport Pistol.

Many thanks.

Rob M.
Charlotte, NC

[tdogg]

Rob,

Welcome to the forum.  You will find many of the users will provide members help on the how and not the what. 

There is a sticky at the top of this forum that houses the directory of reloading for CZ's.  Inside that is a thread detailing how to find the max OAL for a CZ pistol.  I would review that and make sure you test your 135gr bullets in your SP01 barrel.  That is the only safe way to start this process, by understanding how long you can load those bullets in your barrel.  Link to thread:  https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=103620.0

Alliant has a pretty good selection of load data available online but nothing for the 135gr.  You could use the data from the next heavier bullet or try to interpolate between the 124 and the 147.  There is a Sport Pistol thread here as well you could reference but it's just that a internet reference (use at your own risk).  https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=89615.0

I'd wager that your 231 powder is still good assuming you sealed the lid tight when you put it away.  I'm not sure if that powder has undergone any changes over the years but if you have your old load data/notes you should be able to work up a new load with it in the SP01.  I would use caution relying on the latest data on Hodgdon's website in the event that powder has been updated.

Cheers,
Toby

[mkd]

might want to load a handful up and give them a try !  Wouldn't want to load a large run only to find out you have something amiss! 

[George16]

My go to load for sport Pistol is 4.0-4.1 Gr with 124 Gr JHP @ 1.125-1.130” OAL for 128-130 PF on my shadow 2. For 147 Gr RNFN bullets, I was using 3.4 Gr of sport pistol @ 1.102-1.104” OAL for the same PF.

You can use this as a guide at your own risk  .

[Togmaster]

My go to load for sport Pistol is 4.0-4.1 Gr with 124 Gr JHP for 128-130 PF on my shadow 2. For 147 Gr bullets, I was using 3.4 Gr of sport pistol for the same PF.

You can use this as a guide at your own risk  .

Means nothing without oal and specific bullet.

[Wobbly]

Hello all...just getting back into pistols.  Back in the day (25-30 years ago) I shot a lot of USPS open, 38 Super.  I have about 1500 jacketed 135 gr RN bullets left over that I want to load in 9X19 for my SP-01s.  I also bought some Sport Pistol as my old powder (mostly 231) is about 15 years old.  Anyway, the Alliant web site has pretty limited info...so, I'm guessing at charge weights.  I'm thinking I'll load them at 1.125" oal, and between 3.7 and 4.0 gr to get about 130pf.  Id REALLY appreciate some input here as it's been quite a while and I have no experience with Sport Pistol. 

Rob -
Welcome. And thanks for asking. Loading 135gr for 9mm gets into some very soft territory, but it can be done. I actually like and shoot a fair amount of 135gr in my SP01. After you get the load range, it's actually a much better round than 147gr in the CZ.

• An educated guess for Sport Pistol loads can be arrived at by melding data for 124 and 147, since 135gr lies exactly half way between those 2 weights. But be careful to use data from cartridges with the same OAL. You'll also want to calculate a rough Max Velocity for use with a chrono.

• I actually think it might be easier to start with W231, since there are more documented loads for W231. As Tdogg pointed out, as long at the powder was kept is a cool, dark place and doesn't smell like spoiled eggs you'll be OK. Bad powder will display a very acidic smell and have a reddish bloom "growing" inside the can.

• Either powder is going to be very forgiving. So for the sake of safety, I'd step back a further 0.2gr lower than the calculation, and start my incremental loads there. Your incremental loads will want to step up in 0.1gr increments, but only 5 each on the first run... which will be more to prove out the safety aspects than anything else. Once the pistol operation and safety have been settled you can come back with 8-10 loads testing accuracy, velocity, etc, etc.

• You do not want to guess at the OAL for your SP01. Each bullet-to-barrel fit is very discrete, and totally independent of all other bullets. Slender ogives turn out to be no problem. But if the FMJ's ogive is more blunt, then your OAL could end up exceedingly short. There is zero way to know in advance, and that's why you need to calculate OAL range and not guess.

• "Reading primers" is going to be a total waste of time. You're going to need to measure your brass at the head and watch for any physical growth.

Hope this helps.

[WNCRob]

Thanks guys.  Pretty much what I was hoping to hear, and your reinforcing & reminding me what is important is very helpful...particularly starting charges.  I've got tons of chrono data on 231 for calibers other than 9mm...9mm is new to me and am quite aware of internal volume/pressure issues with such a short cartridge. But I do want to move on to Sport Pistol. Now to see if my ProChrony still works!   

[SoCal]

Something to consider is the diameter of your 38 super rounds, often 38 super jacketed is .356 as opposed to 9 MM at .355.  Small difference but might be important to your barrel, or not.  Slugging your barrel might help.

[WNCRob]

SoCal,  thanks for the heads up.  These jacketed bullets are, in fact, 0.356".  I have not slugged the bbls, having assumed 9x19 would be the same diameter as 9x21...but these are marked 38S. I presume all CZ 9mm barrels are 0.355". But 0.001"...does it really matter?   I think I need to do a bit more research.  Again, thanks!

[SoCal]

Some people use them anyway but I prefer not too.  The Hornady 124 gr. HAP bullets are .356 diameter so I don't use them BUT the 115 gr. HAP are .355.  I asked Hornady why and the reply said the 115 are for 9 MM and the 124 are for 38 super BUT I have seen the 124 gr. advertised as 9 MM.

Good luck and welcome to the confusing world of 9X17, 9X19, 9X21 and 9X23 and there are probably a few more.

[Wobbly]

CZ barrels typically slug out at 0.3555".

Super bullets measure out all over the map. Traditionally, it was a 38, but lately more of the barrels are reamed 9mm simply due to the immense volume of that caliber being manufactured.

I've been shooting 0.356" dia 130 & 135gr in my SP01 because I have both calibers myself. Just make sure the ogive isn't resting on the lands. They can make the jump if given some clearance.

 

[eastman]

Some people use them anyway but I prefer not too.  The Hornady 124 gr. HAP bullets are .356 diameter so I don't use them BUT the 115 gr. HAP are .355.  I asked Hornady why and the reply said the 115 are for 9 MM and the 124 are for 38 super BUT I have seen the 124 gr. advertised as 9 MM.

Good luck and welcome to the confusing world of 9X17, 9X19, 9X21 and 9X23 and there are probably a few more.

9x18 adds in some extra fun, too.

[anonymouscuban]

I've been shooting Sport Pistol behind an RMR 124gr Truncated Nose FMJ for the last couple months. I load it at 4.4gr and 1.1 OAL with mixed brass and Fiocchi SP primers. That gives me about 132 PF out of my SP-01. Nice shooting round and very accurate.

For your 135 gr, I would start at 3.7. My guess is you will end up somewhere between 3.7 and 4.2. By the way, I also load this same round with 231 at same charge weight, same OAL. A little snappier. Same PF though.

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