Author Topic: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...  (Read 6345 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #60 on: June 04, 2021, 12:14:46 PM »
Made some more rounds the past couple days.
The first group was som OLD 748 over the last of my Barnes Match burners (105)

http://brassbucket.net/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/HistoricPowder6ARC_v01A.jpg
With some new Wolf small rifle magnum primers, I'm hoping they will be a bit stiffer and thus testing a tad higher velocity for the Leverevooution loads. I loaded about 90 with my old load and left 2 groups of 5 for further testing. These rounds are made with freshly converted brass (not fire formed yet)...Pumped them out on the 650, pretty easy/quick.

I found 3# of Leverevolution from Precision reloading a couple days ago. I'm calling that my go to powder along with W748 and sticking with 105 bullets. I'm looking for more 500 pack of 105s, but I might try some of the new hornady Atips since they are available. But, they don't have 105s, only 110s and 100s (leaning to the 100s). Accurate shooter just did a review on those bullets.

Now my problem is that I have 2 different cans of W748 to finish off (1 from the 80s and one from 2020) and no bullets to load them with - I don't want to waste my GOOD Berger 105 VLD Targets with the 748 (they are reserved for leverloution high vel loads).

I did confirm that the next match is a 1000/1250 yd match! I'll be taking some others that day just in case. I need a good spotter to go with but if I can't drag anyone up there I will not be sitting on the couch because of that.

How's the scope coming?
I've decided to sell my ATN4k as I've fallen for the Valdada...





75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #61 on: June 04, 2021, 05:33:41 PM »
Just got notification the scope shipped today.  I should have it next week. 

I have prepped 50 Lapua and am doing a mini load work up with the new brass and the Berger 108's with varget.  I think I'm going to shoot these then mount my scope and fireform the rest while getting the scope zero'd.  Based on the Saami chamber spec's and my loaded neck diameter, I don't think I need to neck trim the Lapua so that saved a bunch of time in brass prep.  I still had to form them and trim down to Arc length. 

I did receive 500 90gr Sierra Gamekings they were closing out.  I will have to work up those as well.  I may use up another powder shooting those and save my varget for hunting/precision stuff.  I may burn through my n550 and see how fast I can push them.

Vihtavouri did get back to me on load data for the Arc.  They wouldn't email it as it wasn't published but they would tell me over the phone so I got data for N133 and N550 as those are the two I have.  I should have asked about N140 too but I don't have it.  N133 is too fast and N550 is too slow for the Arc.

Cheers,
Toby

This forum rocks!

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #62 on: June 05, 2021, 10:58:50 PM »
Made it out and shot some groups this week.  I think I have two loads that I can rely on going forward.  I also shot some lapua brass and at least on target wasn't impressed.  I will continue to work the lapua brass up but right now Starline is repeatedly outshining Lapua (even though the neck runout is worse).

Varget and Berger 108 Targets, 26.2 will most likely be my load going forward (Better ES):


The super stellar group at the starting load of N133 won't lock the bolt back.  It's a little too fast a powder for this cartridge but the groups are on point.
 N133 and Sierra Gameking 90gr:


Varget and Berger 108 with Lapua Brass:


I gained about 25-35 fps with the Lapua brass with varget and the berger 108.  I may need to drop down a bit more to get back into the accuracy node.

Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #63 on: June 06, 2021, 09:24:37 AM »
good looking groups Toby, thanks for sharing.

Bald Eagle spotted on the way to the range yesterday - I took the IHC Garand w/bayo as a show ender and the pings did bring the grins. Figured it was fitting seeing how today is, you know....

I would go with the 26.2 load as well and as things heat up you should still be in the 26.4 node. Where if you started at the slightly better looking node of 26.4 as things heat up you may be out of the node. Just explaining/thinking out loud in case any pistol shooters are following...

I shot the ARC again yesterday. It performed very well as expected. I didn't get any target groups or chrono data because it was more of a fun shoot with a few different guys sending rounds down.

I left it zeroed at 600 yds from the last match, and left my fancy DOPE cards at home so had to remember/get on with a few test shots. I had to dial out about 4" of windage to be on at 200yds, but after that it was smooth sailing for me and the other shooters there.

I also was using a backup bolt that I had bought when building the rifle. I'm waiting for another ejector roll pin on the main bolt. This was a good test and it ran just fine. The new pin for the primary bolt showed up 20 mins before I left for the range.

I had some other funs that I'll put in another thread on the range day forum, but the quick list includes:
  • my first steel target setup/testing
  • Vz57 with Holoson 403C
  • first 10mm
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #64 on: June 23, 2021, 12:21:34 AM »
Made another ~300 rounds yesterday. 1/2 were slow and low 105 BTTs and 1/2 were 105 VLD Targets over leverevoltion. Local shop had four bottles of LeverEvolution which I brought 2 of.
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #65 on: June 23, 2021, 12:53:39 AM »
We're on Stage 3 fire restrictions here and I can't go shoot anymore till monsoons happen.  I got the scope and mounted it but haven't been able to zero it or shoot anything with it.  I may go to our lone indoor range and test some things but it is only 25yds so not going to test much.

Pray for moisture in the southwest, we need it sooner than later or there might be nothing left.

Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #66 on: June 23, 2021, 07:51:12 PM »
well I hope it gets better for you. There's a 1k match this weekend with an option for 1250. I'm wondering if my pews will be supersonic at 1250. I may leave that fun for the fancy bolts.
Good luck with the rain!
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #67 on: June 29, 2021, 03:00:49 AM »
I contacted Starline this weekend to discuss their spec on the Grendel brass.  I received 300 more pieces from the MeWe group buy and I think this latest batch has much better wall thickness runout.  I have a ball mic on order so I can get some data on it and compare the latest batch to the Lapua and my previous batches of Grendel brass.  I will post up my findings once the ball mic shows up.  I can't shoot so I might as well learn something at the reloading bench.

Here is what Starline stated was their specification:

Quote
Toby,

Our max wall thickness variation is .002”. The max neck concentricity on something like the Grendel is .003” runout.

Regards,

Hunter

I also learned that if I size the brass three times rotating it 90-120 degrees each time, my necks come out much straighter.  I'm running a Wilson bushing die with redding titanium bushings.  With the starline brass I've had crooked necks after sizing even after neck turning most of the wall thickness variation out.  If the neck is crooked at sizing, it will lead to bullet runout at the finished cartridge.  Sizing it three times reduces the neck runout to less than ~0.002 inch.  This translates to straighter ammo.  I have yet to prove that leads to better groups on paper.  I've been doing this rotate routine when seating bullets but it doesn't fix crooked necks, if the neck is straight it is pretty easy to seat them straight.

I have contemplated getting a Lee collet die but you can't purchase any reloading equipment right now.  Maybe someday this nutty situation will ease.  I'd really like to be able to purchase more small rifle primers at a reasonable price.

Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #68 on: June 29, 2021, 06:24:56 PM »
Well dang, I missed the mewe group buy for grendle brass? PMing you info so I can potentially get in on the next one.
I like your idea about sizing brass 3-way. I may try that. I see how that could equate to better necks.

I ran the ARC at the 1k match and it didn't go great. I qualified very quickly in only 5 rounds, but the wind was crazy. I'll post a link to my full writeup on that learning session soon.
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #69 on: June 30, 2021, 03:07:07 AM »
Well I received the ball mic and took four measurements around the neck of four pieces of from each different lot of brass.  My initial thoughts are partially confirmed.  I didn't measure enough pieces to really draw any conclusions.  It seems that the wall thickness is fairly variable within lot.

I might start sorting them to weed out the pieces that have high wall thickness variability.  It looks like I could lock the ball mic at 0.0135 and if I could spin the neck around at that gap it would "pass" meaning the wall thickness variation is less than ~0.001 inch.  The lot I've been using is Lot#1 which appears to be the worst batch I have on hand. 

Lapua does appear to have a more uniform neck thickness vs Starline.  Is it worth twice the cost?  Not sure but I'll let the groups tell me which to choose.  Maybe someday I will actually get some actual 6mmArc brass to evaluate too.



Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #70 on: June 30, 2021, 05:23:05 AM »
very interesting brass details, thanks for sharing. What ball mic did you end up getting?
Full Match results/notes:
http://brassbucket.net/1k-match-results/
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #71 on: June 30, 2021, 01:31:17 PM »
I just bought a cheap anytime tools vernier ball mic off amazon.  It looks to be the same model as the RCBS variant but 2/3rds the price.  It works but isn't a Cadillac by any means.

Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #72 on: July 03, 2021, 10:11:21 PM »
Chrono results with CCI #41 hard primers – hand primed. Berg 150 VLD Targets, Starline brass with 2.300” COAL
I think Ill load some more up of the 29.5 and 29.0 for grouping testing.
Shot the 45s today as well the cz 97 definatly had a better stock trigger than the SAR K2 45 and I had one jam on the feed ramp with the SAR. Gonna try loading longer ammo with it.
I took the steel plate swinger out to 200 and it was pretty fun/easy hits
                                             avg        Es   Sd
GP#1- w748 slows ~15rnds   2422        71   20   
GP#2-29.0 LL – 3rnds           2624        26   13   
GP#3-29.3 LL – 10rnds           2630        57   15   
GP#2-29.5 LL - 10rnds           2672        43   14   
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..

Offline tdogg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1926
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #73 on: July 24, 2021, 10:43:55 PM »
It started raining here and it rained a lot.  Flash flooding all over town.  I was up in Wisconsin on vacation and apparently I should have been home building the Ark.  You may have seen the video of the Prius washing down the street,  https://www.motor1.com/news/520521/flash-floods-washes-away-prius/, that happened while I was away.  Town is a mess but they have been staying on top of the washes and cleaning out the debris trying to keep the water in them instead of in homes.  Pray for us, this flooding problem is a result of a wildfire above town that won't be fixed anytime soon.  They are going to have to engineer some major drainage right through the middle of several neighborhoods.  I'm not sure how they are going to fix this.

Regardless we needed the moisture (maybe not all at once) and the forests are open for business again.

Today's range report:

Took out the new scope (German Precision Optics Spectra 4x 4-16x50i G4i Drop reticle) and I really like the reticle and glass.  It is clean and very clear.  It will take some getting used to converting between SI and English units.  What could go wrong?

The side focus works really well, the zoom is tight but turns smooth, and the turret clicks are positive.  It has zero reset turrets that allow you to reset the turrets so you can keep track of your clicks.  I haven't dialed up and shot at range to see how they track and return to zero yet.  Even zooming in to the maximum magnification, it stay's very bright and clear across the glass.  The eye relief is very good at max magnification too.

The biggest downside at this point is it's size, it is a big scope and on the heavy side for a hunting rig.  This gun is more of a hybrid, hunting/fun gun so I'm OK with it.

I picked up 10 lbs of CFE223 and will probably work up a hunting load with it and Barnes 95gr LRX bullets.  I expect to get 2800 fps with those and CFE223.  We'll see how that goes and I will post up the results.

Oh and I could have picked up some CCI450 primers but they wanted too much for them and I couldn't justify it ($100 per k).  I'm hopeful that the shortage is loosening and prices will return to something more reasonable this year.  If I didn't have any I would probably have paid it.

Cheers,
Toby
This forum rocks!

Offline newageroman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 827
Re: 6mm ARC - anyone ... anyone...
« Reply #74 on: July 26, 2021, 01:07:41 PM »
Hope all goes well on the water/flooding thing.
Sounds like your getting things sorted out. I would bet that powder/bullet combo would be a good one.
I took a closer look at a target from a couple weeks ago. Grouped the chrono powder loads from earlier 5 shot groups.
the top gropu was halsfway off the paper plate, but had cloverleafs (3 or 4 shots touching), the middle group opened up a bit and the third/fastest group had .8" MOA.

I'm about to convert my last 500 cases and load up a couple hundred of the 29.0 LL and see how they fly.
75B-ZomBullShadow SAO Build (current fav)
SP-01-SAO-compedOpenMajor w/DOT
97B stock for now
SAR copies
..others..