Author Topic: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM  (Read 7931 times)

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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2022, 08:41:15 AM »
Just make sure you don't flare the case mouth before seating the bullet.  It won't work if you are loading lead/coated lead bullets because the bullet will shave off when seated or it will hang up on the case mouth.  The flare could cause the cartridge to hang up before finding the max oal.

Excellent point.

Next time you shoot your TS2.... pick up 5 or 6 cases off the ground. THAT'S ALL ! Don't Size them. Don't flare them. Don't de-prime them. Don't polish them. Don't step on them. Simply pick them up.

Then when you get back to the reloading area, try a new bullet in each one. It will be difficult, but on 1 or 2 instances the bullet will go inside the case, but not fall back out. The bullet will be free to move, but it will fit tight enough that you'll need to push it, to get it to move inside the case. That's the perfect case !

Set the test cartridge length to something very long, like 1.200".


A snug fit that holds the bullet in place in all positions

Then, push that very long test cartridge into the gun's chamber all the way, until the head of the case comes up flush with the barrel hood.


Push the test cartridge until it goes all the way in

Then, carefully pull the test cartridge out of the chamber, and measure it's length WITHOUT changing its length. Do this 5 to 10 times until you start getting the same number over and over. That's your measured length.


In this example, the measured length was 1.100"

Finally, subtract 0.015" from that the measured length to get your calculated Max OAL. That number represents the LONGEST cartridge you should be using in THAT chamber with THAT bullet.

Now you are free choose any OAL between 1.000" and your calculated Max OAL. Of course, there are many reasons not to go too short. When the calculated Max OAL falls shorter than 1.100", then the calculated Max OAL is most proabably a good number to use.

Hope this helps.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2022, 10:09:58 AM by Wobbly »
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Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2022, 07:38:35 PM »
Progress update : 
Chrono and  powder won't be here until Tuesday Jan 3.
 I successfully "push test" to confirm COL 1.040" for 124 gr RMR-JHP Nuke. I already shot about 200 rounds at this COL through the TS2 with no feeding problem with HP-38.
I did little research I found some info about the 125 gr. Sierra JHP bullets( part# 8125) on Blue Collar Reloading supply  website, this bullets is almost identical to the RMR nuke .
RMR bullet OAL is .545" the Sierra OAL .554"(.009" longer)
I think I will be safe to start my load at 3.4gr N320 and work up . If don't get a good result I will try the precision Delta V2.

 As soon as I have the result you are the first one to know Mr Wobbly.
Thank you all  for the overwhelming support.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2022, 08:32:27 AM by wa1911 »

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2022, 08:15:20 PM »
I successfully "push test" to confirm COL 1.040" for 124 gr RMR-JHP Nuke. I already shot about 200 rounds at this COL through the TS2 with no feeding problem with HP-38.
Confirmed. If 1.040" is your OAL of choice, then the web page data using the OAL of 1.035" is your best and safest bet.


I did little research I found some info about the 125 gr. Sierra JHP bullets( part# 8125) on Blue Collar Reloading supply  website, this bullets is almost identical to the RMR nuke . RMR bullet OAL is .545" the Sierra OAL .554"(.009" longer) I think I will be safe to start my load at 3.4gr N320 and walk up . If don't get a good result I will try the precision Delta V2.
That is a very bad assumption, and very poor reloading practice. I would warn you away from making those type comparisons in the future.

What's required is 1) they are the same weight (124/125gr) and construction (both jacketed), and 2) there is published load data that is for an OAL that is shorter than what your Push Test says is OK. Those are the only criteria you should be concerned about.

Here's why... Look at these 2 beautiful 124gr bullets and tell me if they will load the same ? Both are 124gr bullets sold in bulk for reloading and both are 0.355" diameter bullets for 9mm auto pistols.




In the same CZ barrel, the Max OAL for the Zero is 0.985", while Max OAL for the Berry is 1.190". More than 0.200" difference in their Max OAL according to the Push Test in the same barrel. Didn't see that, did you ? And that's why I'm telling you simple comparisons are dangerous.

Hope this helps.
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2022, 08:06:22 AM »
 I got it Mr Wobbly! The 1 thing that make me worry is that the Siera 125 gn bullet information from that website(Blue collar reloading ) is trustable or not. I wish I have that Sierra bullet on hand so I can measure the OAL or any one from this forum have used this bullet to confirm the OAL. Thinking to order 1 box from them but when see the cost $30.60 /100 plus shipping I am kinda .....
   Next time I will try to buy bullets from company that at least provide load data so I don't have to guess work like this.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2022, 08:34:04 AM by wa1911 »

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2022, 08:30:27 AM »
I got it Mr Wobbly! The 1 thing that make me worry is that the bullet information from that website is trustable or not.
VihtaVuori has been making powder for over 100 years. It's a huge company in Europe. Their powders and data is used by top shooters all over the world. I have never had any trouble with their published data.


Next time I will try to buy bullets from company that at least provide load data so I don't have to guess work like this.
That's crazy talk. Bullet makers don't provide load data... powder companies do that.

The "guessing" is because you've decided on such a short OAL, not because of the bullets. Luckily the Vit site has that data. In a couple of days you'll have a chrono and will be able to verify any load data you want. I don't see an issue.

Picking a load from a manual and blindly following it, especially following it without a chrono, is simply following a recipe. All this prep work, measuring and calculating is Reloading. Welcome to reloading !

 ;)
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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #20 on: December 31, 2022, 12:38:53 PM »
"What I did on my summer vacation"...





Results posted here: https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=71923.0
« Last Edit: December 31, 2022, 07:31:48 PM by Wobbly »
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Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #21 on: January 07, 2023, 08:14:37 AM »
David -
Got any targets and/or chrono data you'd like to share ? Interested to find out how working with the chrono is coming along.
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Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #22 on: January 07, 2023, 02:14:15 PM »
Sorry it was raining all week here in So cal so I can't go to test. No rain today and tomorrow, but my son is not available to go with me. From where I live I have to drive to the BLM land about 2 hours away and it's very dangerous to go alone there. Hope I can make it next Sunday.

But I got everything ready included the Precision V2 bullets. Here is some load I just finished up this morning.
• RMR 124 gr Nuke  COl 1.040" at 3.4 gr, 3.5,  3.6,  3.7, and 3.8 gr of N320
• PD 124 gr V2-JHP COL 1.098" start load at 3.4gr then 3.6, 3.7, 3.8, 3.9 and 4.0gr of N320. Please correct me if I did something wrong.

I tried to attached a picture, but not sure if it work.  [Mods repaired]
Thanks for the follow up Mr Wobbly.



« Last Edit: January 07, 2023, 05:49:34 PM by Wobbly »

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #23 on: January 07, 2023, 06:13:02 PM »
From where I live I have to drive to the BLM land about 2 hours away and it's very dangerous to go alone there. Hope I can make it next Sunday.
It's not every day you get to shoot with Black Lives Matter.  O0

But I got everything ready included the Precision V2 bullets. Here is some load I just finished up this morning.
• RMR 124 gr Nuke  COl 1.040" at 3.4 gr, 3.5,  3.6,  3.7, and 3.8 gr of N320
• PD 124 gr V2-JHP COL 1.098" start load at 3.4gr then 3.6, 3.7, 3.8, 3.9 and 4.0gr of N320. Please correct me if I did something wrong.
Just round the 1.098" up to 1.100". Your round-to-round variation will be more than 0.002".

I tried to attached a picture, but not sure if it work.  [Mods repaired]
Thanks for the follow up Mr Wobbly.


• Read the Image Posting Guide... especially the 2nd post. 1, 2, 3, 4, then Paste.

• What !! No chopsticks ??  O0
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #24 on: January 07, 2023, 07:06:42 PM »
Yes, it will be with chopsticks post. I watched a youtube video of the guy who shot down his Chrono.  I know now what you meant by " the first time you shoot it you will find out "  :) :)
  I can't wait to run my first load with a chrono. Anyway my son Rival nerf gun average 92 FPS and SD 2 

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #25 on: January 08, 2023, 08:22:36 AM »
Yes, it will be with chopsticks post. I watched a YouTube video of the guy who shot down his Chrono.  I know now what you meant by " the first time you shoot it you will find out "  :) :)

I can't wait to run my first load with a chrono. Anyway my son's Rival nerf gun average 92 FPS and SD 2.
• Shooters that shoot their chrono simply forget that the bullet is not flying along the line-of-sight. Especially with the AR rifle, where the bullet is 2-3" below the LOS. Play with the Nerf gun some more. You'll find out that the projectile doesn't need to hug the top of the chrono to get a good reading. Being 6-10" above the unit is better.... for both parties.

• I see you found a nice camera tripod. Good job! The chrono only works with natural or incandescent light; not LED or florescent light. Experiment with tilting the chrono toward the window/ light source. Also notice that the diffused light of cloudy days is much better than direct, bright sun light.

• Also note that battery voltage is important. Don't store the unit with the battery in-place, and measure the voltage to be at least 9.00V before each session.

• You can now measure the velocity of almost anything: BB's, spit balls, baseballs, arrows... even bullets. Average velocity of 8-10 is far more desirable than individual velocities.

The more you play with the unit, the better off you'll be.
In God we trust; On 'Starting Load' we rely.

Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #26 on: January 11, 2023, 08:58:17 PM »
Can I test it inside my garage ?  It rain like hell here in So Cal and it is going to rain again this weekend. What can I do???

Offline Wobbly

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2023, 07:44:29 AM »
Can I test it inside my garage ?  It rain like hell here in So Cal and it is going to rain again this weekend. What can I do???

Only if you get the chrono more than 10ft away and use incandescent lighting.
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Offline tdogg

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2023, 01:30:37 PM »
Unless he lives in the boonies, I'd argue garage testing isn't advised!

Just make sure you add floatation to the chrono and head on out!  Stay out of the major drainages and you should be fine.  SoCal weather can't be that bad  O0!

Good Luck!

Cheers,
Toby

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Offline wa1911

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Re: Good load for CZ TS2 Blue 9MM
« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2023, 08:13:24 PM »
Finally I made it to the range today, here is the range report, please pardon me for my handwriting and my number all over the place.

RMR Nuke 124 gr
COl 1.040"
N320 @3.8
Avg Vel 1012 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds


PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @3.4 gr
Avg Vel 880 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @3.6
Avg Vel 937 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @3.8 gr
Avg Vel 960 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @3.9
Avg Vel 966 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @4.0 gr
Avg Vel 1024 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

PD-V2- 124 gr
COl 1.100"
N320 @4.1 gr
Avg Vel 1056 FPS
Ts2 at 10 yards
8 rounds

I think my CZ Ts2 does not like the RMR Nuke, out of 5 loads only the 3.8 gr has an ok grouping about 3". I will upload picture at the end so you can see. The rest are all over the place.

All the Precision delta v2 is good, at this point I just focus on accuracy and not worry about PF yet. So far I like the PDv2 with 4.0gr of N320.

The orange sticker is 2"dia, and I don't know why but all of my POI was  about 2" high. I was aiming at the center of the circle. (May be my aging eye.)

Link to final targets.... https://imgur.com/a/GQaGYcg

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« Last Edit: January 29, 2023, 12:42:00 PM by Wobbly »