CZ TS2 tiny trigger snap

[dabljues]

Hi.

Right from the start I want to say that this may be nothing, I don't exactly know if the gun action should work that way or not.

Basically, I was just playing with my gun (CZ TS2) by pulling the trigger (yes, unloaded) and enjoying the trigger breaking. However, I noticed something strange. Right when I hit the wall, if I pull the trigger really, really slowly, I can feel that it passes some kind of barrier, it snaps like a 1mm backward. Look at this:

https://i.imgur.com/dVsRIAx.mp4

1-2s before the video ends you can see the trigger snapping backward. It's really small, you have to really focus, but it's there.

I thought this was maybe due to gunk in the trigger bar or something, but then I tried doing what I was doing before, but without the slide on. And I noticed, that when this "snap" is happening, it is the sear that is moving. It's not moving far enough to drop the hammer (same as in previous video - "snap" happens, but hammer is still cocked). Here's the video:

https://i.imgur.com/AGTgoOH.mp4

Here it's more noticeable than in the video of the trigger. You can see the sear moving.

Now, I would think that this is how it's supposed to work - I pull the trigger some distance, then the sear "kinda engages" (it moves and I can feel it in the trigger), then I pull just a tiny lil' bit more - and break happens, hammer falls.

However (it's not quite shown in the video), if I get pass this "snap" without dropping the hammer, I get my finger of the trigger and I try again (really slowly) - there's no "snap" in the trigger. A clean "takeup, wall, crisp break", no "snap" before the break. That's what got me thinking - if the hammer can be dropped without this sear movement before - then maybe I can do something to eliminate this thing, so I would have cleaner trigger breaks.

So, is this something that is supposed to be here? And if not, can I somehow get rid of that? I mainly shoot bullseye (freestyle) and sometimes it can screw up my shot, because my hand thinks that this is the break and can involuntarily flinch, when in fact it's just a snap in the trigger due to the sear moving.

[tdogg]

That isn't normal.  I'd take as close look at the sear, hammer hooks, trigger bar, and sear leg.  That can't all be creep, some of that must be pre travel.

I'm wondering if you can tune that out by adjusting the pre travel screw on the trigger?  Is it set right at the reset?

Cheers,
Toby

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk

[Redhemi]

I wish you had sound so I could possibly hear it. When I bought my TS2 i was terribly disappointed in the trigger. It had a terrible amount of creep but i could not say if it had the "snap" you're talking about. If I pulled back the hammer and watched the sear as I was pulling the trigger I could see the sear slowly come up until the break. I like to bullseye shoot so I pull on the trigger slowly. The amount of creep it had drove me nuts so I purchased a race hammer from CGW and it cut the creep in half if not a little more and now I am happy with the trigger.

[dabljues]

I'm wondering if you can tune that out by adjusting the pre travel screw on the trigger?  Is it set right at the reset?

Right now - yes. After I recorded those videos I actually changed the trigger to an aluminum one and while doing so, I also configured the pre and over travel. However, I unscrewed it and made the pre travel much longer - same thing. If I make the pre travel really short - it's less noticeable, I guess (nothing huge), but still it's there.

I should maybe rephrase what I said before. It's not like it's a violent snap. If we were talking about Glock triggers, people would say that's creep. And maybe I would too, but the sear movement before hammer drops (moves, stops and I have to pull the trigger a little tiny bit more, like 1mm or less) - it's kinda strange to me. And especially the fact that if I manage to get through this part without dropping the hammer, get my finger of the trigger, try again and it's not there anymore, it tells me that the gun can somehow work without it, so maybe there's a way around it

But maybe, I don't know, the hammer drop occurs almost immediately after this "snap" or creep (or whatever it is), then maybe it's alright, I'm not sure. What I know is that when I'm really focused and muscles in my hand are tightening, I can definitely feel this while shooting bullseye. Maybe it's how it's supposed to be, I don't know if I explained it and shown everything on the video properly. It could be me just overthinking this and pulling the trigger too slow, that's why I even notice... Right now when dry firing at home, the trigger feels excellent (especially after changing it to a flat alu one), really crisp. It's only noticeable when I pull the trigger really slowly (and even then I can miss it, just drop the hammer).

Here I recorded some trigger pulls (fast, slow etc.) with sound:
https://i.imgur.com/DCSAjwr.mp4

Fast ones look clean as hell, those slow, I don't know, you be the judge (on the last one especially you can see what this whole thread is all about)

I wish you had sound so I could possibly hear it

Like I mentioned above, maybe I shouldn't say "snap", because there's also no sound. The trigger kinda jumps (it's really nothing that big, people would say it's just creep), but this is caused by the fact that the sear moves (also just a little bit)

[tdogg]

I have two tsos and that would have been addressed right away.  It is not normal.  The cgw hammer will impress even the most trigger snobbery.

Cheers,
Toby

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk

[dabljues]

I have two tsos and that would have been addressed right away.  It is not normal.  The cgw hammer will impress even the most trigger snobbery.

Do you mean something like this: https://cajungunworks.com/product/tactical-sport-hammer-kit/?

Full width direct replacement full Race Hammer Kit with all the parts needed.  This kit will actually increase the SA pull weight to average of 2.5#’s.  The factory pull of 1.5#’s or less can be to lite for some shooters.  The CGW kit also eliminates the annoying creep present in many of the Tactical Sport models.

Huh, increased pull weight, but no creep, interesting. I'm wondering if my issue is the "creep" that they mention here or is it something different. Anyway, I don't really have access to CGW parts (no local dealers and CGW doesn't deliver outside US) - could I do something about this without the CGW parts? I'm not sure if it's the hammer, sear or something else

[tdogg]

Yes both my tsos were upgraded with that hammer kit to try and improve the feel of the trigger.  The kit improves the wall before the break.

I'd see if there is an international dealer that has that kit.

Or I'd send it to CZ for repair.

Cheers,
Toby

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk

[Redhemi]

Huh, increased pull weight, but no creep, interesting. I'm wondering if my issue is the "creep" that they mention here or is it something different. Anyway, I don't really have access to CGW parts (no local dealers and CGW doesn't deliver outside US) - could I do something about this without the CGW parts? I'm not sure if it's the hammer, sear or something else
[/quote]

I'd say it is the hammer/sear creep you are feeling. Like I said if you pull back the hammer and look down into where the sear meets the hammer and slowly pull the trigger you can see the sear slowly come up until the hammer breaks. Just a thought maybe your hammer has a small burr or is rough on the surface where the sear meets the hammer. You might want to give that part of the hammer a good inspection.

[dabljues]

Or I'd send it to CZ for repair.

Due to the gun laws in my country, which are pretty good as Europe goes, but still, it's Europe, I wouldn't wanna do that. This would be the last resort for me. Waiting period (for now it's my only good 9mm target gun) + the bureaucracy, ugh. There's a gunsmith in my city. Just a couple of guys, they make custom 1911s. From what I know they also take people with CZs (as they are most popular competition guns in my country by far). Maybe they could take a look at it, so I wouldn't have to (mess it up).

I'd say it is the hammer/sear creep you are feeling. Like I said if you pull back the hammer and look down into where the sear meets the hammer and slowly pull the trigger you can see the sear slowly come up until the hammer breaks. Just a thought maybe your hammer has a small burr or is rough on the surface where the sear meets the hammer. You might want to give that part of the hammer a good inspection.

That's what I had on my mind. Maybe something on the hammer catches the sear. I got sandpaper, so I could potentially get rid of that, I hope that I won't mess up the timing or something like this. Do people polish hammer parts without destroying the gun on their own? I mean people like me, not experts

[Redhemi]

Or I'd send it to CZ for repair.

Due to the gun laws in my country, which are pretty good as Europe goes, but still, it's Europe, I wouldn't wanna do that. This would be the last resort for me. Waiting period (for now it's my only good 9mm target gun) + the bureaucracy, ugh. There's a gunsmith in my city. Just a couple of guys, they make custom 1911s. From what I know they also take people with CZs (as they are most popular competition guns in my country by far). Maybe they could take a look at it, so I wouldn't have to (mess it up).

I'd say it is the hammer/sear creep you are feeling. Like I said if you pull back the hammer and look down into where the sear meets the hammer and slowly pull the trigger you can see the sear slowly come up until the hammer breaks. Just a thought maybe your hammer has a small burr or is rough on the surface where the sear meets the hammer. You might want to give that part of the hammer a good inspection.

That's what I had on my mind. Maybe something on the hammer catches the sear. I got sandpaper, so I could potentially get rid of that, I hope that I won't mess up the timing or something like this. Do people polish hammer parts without destroying the gun on their own? I mean people like me, not experts

As long as you don't touch the hammer hook you should be ok. When you take it apart run your finger on the flat spot under the hammer hook to see if it's rough. If your going to sand it I wouldn't go any lower than 400 emery type sandpaper and just a little then some type of metal polish to smooth it out. Good luck and maybe check with those gunsmiths to see if they can get you the parts you need and maybe some extra springs and whatever else you might want to get for your gun.

[dabljues]

As long as you don't touch the hammer hook you should be ok. When you take it apart run your finger on the flat spot under the hammer hook to see if it's rough. If your going to sand it I wouldn't go any lower than 400 emery type sandpaper and just a little then some type of metal polish to smooth it out. Good luck and maybe check with those gunsmiths to see if they can get you the parts you need and maybe some extra springs and whatever else you might want to get for your gun.

I took yours and @tdogg's advice and took a look at the hammer and sear. Sear underside had wear but it had some rough edges. Hammer had some irregularities near the hooks and the part that touches the underside of the sear. I took 2000 grit sandpaper (was scared as hell) and gently polished those areas. Not much, more on the sear than on the hammer. I thought, well, this probably didn't change much.

However, look here. I'm not sure if this is visible on the video, but:

https://i.imgur.com/J8RK8Mg.mp4

I don't feel the "creep" or anything now. I mean, I'm sitting here pulling the trigger as slowly as I can and nothing. Right when I expect the trigger snap (cause of the creep) - the trigger actually breaks. I may go back and polish stuff here and there a little bit more, but this could be it

[tdogg]

Video doesn't work for me.  Congrats on tackling polishing.  A little will go a long way so don't get too aggressive.

Cheers,
Toby

Sent from my motorola edge (2022) using Tapatalk

[dabljues]

Hmm, I double checked the URL, it should be working. However, imgur screwed up the audio sync from what I see, so I uploaded it again, you can check my post above, I updated it. If it still doesn't work, this is the link to the post, rather than a direct link to the video: https://imgur.com/a/LJpGkw1, it should work.

Congrats on tackling polishing.  A little will go a long way so don't get too aggressive.

Yeah, exactly. I might go back to it if the grittiness/creep comes back or something, but for now I'm happy.

[Redhemi]

Good deal, glad you were able to fix the problem yourself. Now go out and enjoy that TS2.

[Strife21]

I have two tsos and that would have been addressed right away.  It is not normal.  The cgw hammer will impress even the most trigger snobbery.

Do you mean something like this: https://cajungunworks.com/product/tactical-sport-hammer-kit/?

Full width direct replacement full Race Hammer Kit with all the parts needed.  This kit will actually increase the SA pull weight to average of 2.5#’s.  The factory pull of 1.5#’s or less can be to lite for some shooters.  The CGW kit also eliminates the annoying creep present in many of the Tactical Sport models.

Huh, increased pull weight, but no creep, interesting. I'm wondering if my issue is the "creep" that they mention here or is it something different. Anyway, I don't really have access to CGW parts (no local dealers and CGW doesn't deliver outside US) - could I do something about this without the CGW parts? I'm not sure if it's the hammer, sear or something else

I had CGW install the adjustable sear and hammer kit on my ts2 green and it actually decreased trigger pull from 1# 14oz to 1# 4oz.  When i asked them about and told them what the description on their page said they sounded kind of surprised it said it would increase pull weight.