Author Topic: ATF whistleblowers Biden admin proposal that effectively bans private gun sales  (Read 8241 times)

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Offline gatorb

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Whistleblowers at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) are sounding the alarm on a reported 1,300-page draft document that allegedly justifies a proposed rule that would effectively ban private gun sales, according to a watchdog group.

"The proposed rule would amend the regulations applicable to the Gun Control Act by, among other things, conforming those regulations to the new BSCA definition and clarifying the conduct that presumptively requires a license under the amended definition," the statement continued, adding that "unlicensed dealing undermines the public-safety measures required for" federal firearm licensees.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/atf-whistleblowers-sound-alarm-biden-admin-proposal-effectively-bans-private-gun-sales-report
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Offline SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM

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Such a rule is 100% unenforceable unless they are able to pass universal registration across the entire country.

Offline crosstimbers

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Such a rule is 100% unenforceable unless they are able to pass universal registration across the entire country.

I no longer feel much comfort in notions of what is or isn't enforceable, constitutional or anything else. I feel like we have entered an era where all the old assurances are now void, or at least much more weak than they once were- I've felt that way for awhile.

I've seen various laws enacted, that even legal minds presenting "legal changes" for the benefit of the enforcers, said were "probably not going to stand the 'constitutional test'....yet they have, without so much as a serious challenge. This is not some one-off thing or some recent single thing, but changes in the law (of at least my own state) that have alarmed others and myself enough that (speaking only for myself) I have much less confidence in constitutional protections than i once had.

I can't get too detailed, without violating forum guidelines...but when laws are put in place that punish motivations rather than actions, that openly discriminate while condemning discrimination, call for confiscation of private property firearms and that allow the promotion of falsehoods and vilify the truth....Exactly what sort of "faith" is appropriate?

I apologize in advance and hop I haven't went too far in describing my point, but dont see how I could make it without at least this much explanation- which I've tried to give the least details of.....and that was as mentally painful as a bad sneeze.. so here's hoping :-X
« Last Edit: February 05, 2024, 11:31:28 PM by crosstimbers »
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Offline Gunnerdad80

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Comply?… No.

Offline Lock-n-load

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Thou shall trade or sell guns as they please …un enforceable

Offline Rum River Jedi

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Unfortunately we are living in a post Constitutional era, and have been for awhile. The only solution is mass non-compliance with laws that we all know are not Constitutional no matter what SCOTUS or Legislators tells us.
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Offline Born2vette

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Not sure if there is a little pandering to the audience here, but from these guys interpretation of the final rule will online forums have to shut down their classifieds?

Would love to hear mod/administrator take on this. 

https://youtu.be/i63SlESvpTk?si=iEd5ImiNSEHOWJ_x
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Offline Wobbly

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....will online forums have to shut down their classifieds?

After working with some of the "know it alls" in our Classifieds section, I'd have to say it might not be a big loss.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2024, 07:47:13 AM by Wobbly »
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Offline Earl Keese

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Not sure if there is a little pandering to the audience here, but from these guys interpretation of the final rule will online forums have to shut down their classifieds?

Would love to hear mod/administrator take on this. 

https://youtu.be/i63SlESvpTk?si=iEd5ImiNSEHOWJ_x

Classified sales are completed via FFL transfer/shipping…that should comply right?

Offline Born2vette

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Classified sales are completed via FFL transfer/shipping…that should comply right?


According to the pundits, just using a ffl for transfer would not protect one. The definition makes almost anyone who sells firearms subject to being accused of being an unlicensed dealer. Also to create an unofficial registry of all firearm sales leaving a paper trail to follow if there is ever a federal gun grab.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2024, 07:49:04 AM by Wobbly »
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Offline Skookum

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Armed Attorneys — ATF Final Rule On Sales: Your Questions Answered


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C9ibswxgL4k

The liability lies entirely with the seller, and what makes a seller a dealer is an intent to make a profit (in cash, goods, or services) from the more than occasional sale. So, involving an FFL in a sale is irrelevant, selling for a loss is irrelevant if the intent was to make money, and 'occasional' is undefined.  Gifting seems to be a safe loophole.

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Offline Wobbly

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Whistleblowers at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) are sounding the alarm on a reported 1,300-page draft document that allegedly justifies a proposed rule that would effectively ban private gun sales, according to a watchdog group.

And why would anyone wait until an election year, knowing that just as many Dems own guns ? Think about this... wouldn't this effectively be the end of the ATF ? Really. Making your own liquor is a non-issue today. Tobacco is fast becoming a non-issue. If firearm sales went away, wouldn't the ATF eventually go away ? Why would the Federal government continue to fund a multi-million dollar department, especially one so divisive ?

This sounds suspiciously like someone trying to arouse anger in voters in an election year. Another fake Obama birth certificate, so to speak.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2024, 08:39:37 AM by Wobbly »
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Offline Gunnerdad80

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This sounds suspiciously like someone trying to arouse anger in voters in an election year. Another fake Obama birth certificate, so to speak.

Whaaaaat, someone stirring the pot around election time to arouse anger and further divide folks?! Does not compute.  8)

Offline Grendel

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Please confine yourselves to the ATF rule and not drift off into generalized politcal commentary.

Thank you.
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Inter arma enim silent leges - Cicero

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Offline Gunnerdad80

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Beep boop. Affirmative. Beep boop beep. ;D