30-06 crimped primer pocket or not or sometimes or......and powder question

[Dan_69GTX]

Just got an old gun chambered in 30-06.

Of course that means I need (too much to list) but will plan on getting that stuff to load 30-06 plinking rounds.

So - first off - do non military rounds have crimped primer pockets?  I'm guessing the older military rounds would - but am I correct?

What powder(s) have you used with good success?  Again - NOT wanting something hot - just a plinking round.

Thanks in advance!

Dan

[Crawl]

From the Sierra manual:

[Crawl]

The accuracy loads (not as hot as the hunting loads, so probably closer to plinking preferences) they list for various bullet weights generally include Benchmark, 4895, H4350, and 4064.

[Wobbly]

Most military cartridges have some form of crimped primer, and possibly a crimped bullet. This is simply over-the-top insurance to make sure that military ammo gets where it needs to be in a usable state. No civilian needs to crimp in any of these places. However, for anyone to reload these cartridge cases, all the crimps need to be erased.

There are several methods to remove crimped primer pockets, including cutting and swaging. All of them must be done at least once to all military cases to make them reloadable. Cutting is usually done with a common 82° countersink cutter in a drill press. A single-flute cutter gives a smoother cut than a multi-flute. This takes about 2 seconds per case while the case is presented by hand to the spinning cutter. No clamping or fancy jigging is required to hold the case.

Swaging on the other hand simply pushes the brass back to it's former position. As such it take tremendous force... meaning you need to do it in a press. (Not all reloading presses are strong enough for this process.) Special tools and case holders are part of the tooling required for this process.

Standard case Sizing and Trimming usually removes any leftovers from bullet crimping.

• If your new 30-06 in an M1 Garand, then know that those cartridges need to be loaded within VERY strict limits. There is usually a page in your reloading manual specifically for M1 Garand.

• If you're truly are simply going to "plink", then there may be no need to buy a special powder. These are not in your manual, but back in the 1960's people developed loads using pistol powders. You might want to Google "RedDot loads for rifle". This info is safe, but being "old", most of the load data is for older powders.

Hope this helps.

[Dan_69GTX]

Thanks for the info!

The current gun is a bolt action, but an M1 is in the plans - hopefully - so great to know!!

If I can accumulate brass w/o crimped primer pockets, great - if not, I have an RL1100 that I hope I can use to swage them.  I know it isn't "rated" for the 30-06 due to size, but I won't reload on it, only decrimp.  I have the 308 stuff for it already, and the shell plate is the same so....
Reloading will take place on the Hornady.

I'll have to deprime some of the federal that I just shot and see if the cases are crimped primer - it doesn't appear that they are.

Great site - thanks!

[M1A4ME]

Up to this point in my reloading (nearly 50 years) I've not run across military .30-06 cases with a crimped in primer.  Same for civilian/hunting ammo brass.  Could be some military brass some where that had primer pocket crimps, I just haven't seen them yet.

Lightest bullets I ever had accuracy from was 147/150 grain bullets.  Tried a box of 110 grain bullets a long time ago and never felt the need to buy anymore of them.  Heaviest bullets I ever went with were 180 grain. 

Best accuracy I ever had was with IMR4350 powder and Sierra 180 grain Matchking boat tail hollow points.  That 03A4 loved those loads.  No where near maximum (sorry don't remember the powder charge now) but they had a healthy recoil in that old rifle, but not a max charge either.  It was only about 40 years old then.  Much older now.

Best accuracy in my M1 rifles has been with standard 150 grain bullets (flat based FMJ 150 grain) and IMR4895 powder.  Or with the Greek surplus HXP ammo the CMP used to sell.  It's good brass for reloading, too, if you run across some at a good price.

Unlike .308 vs. 7.62X51 NATO brass the GI brass and commercial brass are pretty much the same weight after resizing and trimming to length.  I've never reduced powder charge weights when using surplus/GI brass for .30-06 reloads.  Never crimped the case mouth into the bullets either.

One powder I got good results from but have never pursued is TAC.  Cheaper than a lot of other powders these days, meters great from the powder measure and gave me good groups from the M1 Garand with 150 grain Hornady FMJBT bullets.

[Crawl]

but I won't reload on it, only decrimp.  I have the 308 stuff for it already, and the shell plate is the same so....
Reloading will take place on the Hornady.

This is what I do too for 223. Case prep on an RL1050 and load using a Hornady LnL. I prefer the Hornady overall anyway.

[Dan_69GTX]

Finally found some IMR4895 at a local store.  Now to try and find time (getting harder lately) to set up the press/dies and try it out.

Thanks again for your help!

Dan

[Dan_69GTX]

Finally had time this weekend to play around.

Using starline brass, Unis Ginex primers, BL-C(2) powder, Hornady 150 BT FMJ bullets.

What I found is load of 49-51.5 powder range.  Just for testing loaded at 45 grains - talk about hang fire!!!  WOW.

No accuracy testing - just function and speed.

ave speed  -  # rounds shot - powder charge
2368 - 2 - 45 - both hangfire
2521.3 - 2 - 48.2 - one hangfire
2735 - 4 - 49.5 - no hangfire.

Next to try other powder, then do some accuracy testing.

Dan

[timetofly]

My plinking powder is IMR 3031. I use it with 150 grain bullets

[Dan_69GTX]

I bought some new starline brass as well as keeping what I've shot from factory ammo.  All of the factory ammo is NOT crimped.

I was given some OLD military brass - they guy got it from his mother when his father passed away.  It is dated from 1957 to 1961.  Anything that was not reloaded before is crimped.

Regarding loading 30-06.  I tried BL-C(2) and IMR 4895.  As mentioned the IMR seemed to be more consistent and accurate.

M1 - Horn 150 gr BT IMR-4895 49.4 gr         
#   SPEED   (FPS)      AVG (FPS)
1   2784.4   -20.7      2581.8
2   2805.9   0.8         2621.7
3   2805.9   0.8         2621.8
4   2820.4   15.3              2649
5   2808.8   3.7         2627.2

AVERAGE SPEED   2805.1      
STD DEV   11.6      
SPREAD   36      
AVERAGE POWER FACTOR   420.8      
PROJECTILE WEIGHT(GRAINS)   150      

If you remove shot 1 - the SD is 6.0

[M1A4ME]

I tried a lot of powders many years ago.  I know the reloading manuals showed loads for BLC2 and H335 but I was always somewhat leery of using those fast burning powders for .30-06.  They're great for .223 though.

The issue, always, with the IMR powders is getting a consistent powder charge.  None of the three powder measures I have ever worked, consistently.  I reverted to throwing below the wanted charge weight and topping the charge off with a powder trickler.  Slow, but consistent and the loads were accurate in my rifles.

Never had the need to crimp the case mouth on the bullets either.

Brass lasts longer if you load for accuracy vs. velocity.

[Dan_69GTX]

.........The issue, always, with the IMR powders is getting a consistent powder charge.  ..........

YES!!  This is my first time with an IMR powder and was amazed at the inconsistent speeds.   So, I stopped using the powder measure and did each charge on a scale.

Thanks for making sure I knew about this!  Much appreciated!

Boy is this a fun hobby!!!!!!    SOOOOO much to learn and grateful for all the help from this forum!

[Crawl]

Just for testing loaded at 45 grains - talk about hang fire!!!  WOW.

Dan,

Tell us about your hang fire?! I have never had it occur.

[Dan_69GTX]

I DO NOT RECOMMEND ANYONE TRYING WHAT I DID....LIKE ANYTHING ON THE INTERNET - ASSUME THEY ARE WRONG AND NOT KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT ANYTHING!!  - There you have it -  a full disclaimer.... 

I know the min charge - according to the loading manual - is 49 grains of power

I loaded a round at 45 grains to see what the FPS would be - just as test.  When fired, there was a significant delay between primer detonation and the 45 grain charge being ignited.  Felt just like a flintlock gun with damp powder.

Obviously not safe to keep doing that.