Tell us how much you like the CZ 527

[sirgilligan]

Have you ever had the wind completely taken out of your sail?

I just got a 527 in .223 with the idea I could use my 5.56 NATO. I don't have but a handful of .223 rem ammo.

Just a few days after I got my rifle a friend emailed me that the bolt's edge had blown off and is trying to figure out which failed first the case head or the bolt. It was the 8'th round ever shot through his new rifle. Another person has stated the he has shot 10 - 20 rounds and had the same failure twice.

Last night I reluctantly installed the CZ modified bolt handle and the CZ picatinny rail. The excitement completely gone from my long quest of saving money and tracking one down. I should be out getting a scope, but I have lost interest.

So, help a guy out and tell me about the reasons you love the 527.
Have you shot it much?
Do you shoot 5.56?
Do you hand load and shoot max loads?

[painter]

Sorry to hear of your disappointment, but why would you think you could use 5.56 in a .223 chamber?

My guess is the 5.56 ammo used was longer than the CZ leade which is what caused the overpressure you described in the other thread. A little research will show that the cartridge specs are different.

I love my 527 FS because it does exactly what it was sold to do...shoot .223 Rem factory and handloads to sub MOA accuracy at 100yds.

[bobanddog]

I have a CZ 527 American in .223 and think it's great.  I've read your posts about your friend's incident and if it's affected my opinion of the rifle at all, it has reinforced my confidence in one of the few hammer-forged receivers still in production.  Some criticize hammer forging as 'old fashioned', but it's the method that produced the best of the firearms and artillery used to fight both world wars.  Those actions not only saw higher power service rounds, they endured terrible abuse, neglect, and repeated cycling/sustained fire no sporting rifle will ever see.  I would not feel the same way about an action made extensively of investment cast parts (Ruger, newer Sako & Tikka, Kimber, Montana Rifle, and others), or simply cast mystery-metal or brass with hardware store screws and plastic barrel-bands (Henry).  Remingtons are simply drilled from round stock.  Winchester CNC mills theirs from block of solid billet. 

I understand your shaken confidence and enthusiasm, but I hope you'll look at the situation in a rational way and consider that CZ probably has the fewest stories such as your friends floating around out there, despite being one of the biggest arms manufacturers in the world (although uncommon in America).  There's a reason they (and their BRNO ancestors) are favored by professional hunters in Africa; they can be counted on to work safely when they are needed most.

By the way, these are examples of what can happen when rifles that aren't built like your 527 fail:







Notice that none of these pictures (of three separate rifles) show the heat discoloration evident in your friend's blown case and bolt. 

[sirgilligan]

Sorry to hear of your disappointment, but why would you think you could use 5.56 in a .223 chamber?

My guess is the 5.56 ammo used was longer than the CZ leade which is what caused the overpressure you described in the other thread. A little research will show that the cartridge specs are different.

I love my 527 FS because it does exactly what it was sold to do...shoot .223 Rem factory and handloads to sub MOA accuracy at 100yds.

This is what CZ USA told me:

I'm sure you know this already, but our rifles are built to CIP spec, which doesn't differentiate between .223 and 5.56, it uses the higher pressure of the two and considers them one cartridge. So our rifles are built to shoot anything from match .223 to surplus 5.56.

I am just trying to regain my excitement and get out there and start shooting.

[sirgilligan]

I have a CZ 527 American in .223 and think it's great.  I've read your posts about your friend's incident and if it's affected my opinion of the rifle at all, it has reinforced my confidence in one of the few hammer-forged receivers still in production.  Some criticize hammer forging as 'old fashioned', but it's the method that produced the best of the firearms and artillery used to fight both world wars.  Those actions not only saw higher power service rounds, they endured terrible abuse, neglect, and repeated cycling/sustained fire no sporting rifle will ever see.  I would not feel the same way about an action made extensively of investment cast parts (Ruger, newer Sako & Tikka, Kimber, Montana Rifle, and others), or simply cast mystery-metal or brass with hardware store screws and plastic barrel-bands (Henry).  Remingtons are simply drilled from round stock.  Winchester CNC mills theirs from block of solid billet. 

I understand your shaken confidence and enthusiasm, but I hope you'll look at the situation in a rational way and consider that CZ probably has the fewest stories such as your friends floating around out there, despite being one of the biggest arms manufacturers in the world (although uncommon in America).  There's a reason they (and their BRNO ancestors) are favored by professional hunters in Africa; they can be counted on to work safely when they are needed most.

By the way, these are examples of what can happen when rifles that aren't built like your 527 fail:







Notice that none of these pictures (of three separate rifles) show the heat discoloration evident in your friend's blown case and bolt.

I do see that. I also noticed the ammo box as well. 

[sirgilligan]

Those photos are helping me get my feet grounded again. The timing of the news couldn't have been worse. Brand new rifle, ordering scope mounts and extra mags, and my friend has the issue with his brand new rifle.

Keep the info coming if you have anything to share.

[painter]

Sorry to hear of your disappointment, but why would you think you could use 5.56 in a .223 chamber?

My guess is the 5.56 ammo used was longer than the CZ leade which is what caused the overpressure you described in the other thread. A little research will show that the cartridge specs are different.

I love my 527 FS because it does exactly what it was sold to do...shoot .223 Rem factory and handloads to sub MOA accuracy at 100yds.

This is what CZ USA told me:

I'm sure you know this already, but our rifles are built to CIP spec, which doesn't differentiate between .223 and 5.56, it uses the higher pressure of the two and considers them one cartridge. So our rifles are built to shoot anything from match .223 to surplus 5.56.

I am just trying to regain my excitement and get out there and start shooting.

All the CZ products I own seem to be quality firearms, and none have ever had any issues.

If whoever told you that is correct I'd be testing the ammo for interference with the rifling. I do wonder why the rifles are specifically stamped .223 Remington if they are indeed built to accept the NATO loading.

As discussed in your other thread, it's impossible to double charge a .223/5.56 case. Most of my hand loads bring the powder to very close to the top of the case and that is to SAAMI spec. That would leave only a defective case, or interference with the rifling causing overpressure to occur to cause that kind of damage.

I don't think it was the rifle.

I would chamber a round and then extract it to see if there are any marks from the rifling on the bullet. It would show better with the bullet colored with a marker.

[bobanddog]

So, help a guy out and tell me about the reasons you love the 527.
Have you shot it much?
Do you shoot 5.56?
Do you hand load and shoot max loads?

I failed to completely answer your specific questions, so here goes:
1.  I've run 140 rounds through it since I got it this spring.
2.  I have used 5.56 in it (about half of the above); at first, that was all I could find.  Since then more .223 has become available, and I generally be sticking with that because I bought the rifle for hunting, and 5.56 NATO FMJ rounds, while okay for plinking, are poor hunting rounds.
3.  No.
I like the 527 because it is well executed version of a great design.  No manufacturing shortcuts to save money, no cheap plastic stock, cast or stamped parts (excepting the magazine) or 'matte' finishes.  A trigger that didn't need a bunch of lawyers to approve.  All the proven features of a controlled round feed action are there, and proportioned 'just right' for the cartridge, but with good length of pull and ergonomics for a knuckle-dragger like me.  The more I shoot it, the smoother it cycles and more accurate it gets.  I plan to hunt wolves, coyotes and varmints with it, and yes, all my hunting rifles and shotguns are blue and walnut. 

[sirgilligan]

So, help a guy out and tell me about the reasons you love the 527.
Have you shot it much?
Do you shoot 5.56?
Do you hand load and shoot max loads?

I failed to completely answer your specific questions, so here goes:
1.  I've run 140 rounds through it since I got it this spring.
2.  I have used 5.56 in it (about half of the above); at first, that was all I could find.  Since then more .223 has become available, and I generally be sticking with that because I bought the rifle for hunting, and 5.56 NATO FMJ rounds, while okay for plinking, are poor hunting rounds.
3.  No.
I like the 527 because it is well executed version of a great design.  No manufacturing shortcuts to save money, no cheap plastic stock, cast or stamped parts (excepting the magazine) or 'matte' finishes.  A trigger that didn't need a bunch of lawyers to approve.  All the proven features of a controlled round feed action are there, and proportioned 'just right' for the cartridge, but with good length of pull and ergonomics for a knuckle-dragger like me.  The more I shoot it, the smoother it cycles and more accurate it gets.  I plan to hunt wolves, coyotes and varmints with it, and yes, all my hunting rifles and shotguns are blue and walnut.

Thanks. I have to get motivated tomorrow and go find the scope I am going to use. I think I will upgrade my eye protection and maybe get some shooting gloves. 

[TCups]

Be EXCITED!!!  You have one of the finest bolt action .223 rifles on the planet.  Even a middle of the road shooter (like me) should be able to squeeze off sub-MOA groups at 100 and 200 yards routinely, with a factory stock rifle.  The Mauser action is smooth and reliable.  Put some decent glass on the rifle.  Treat it well, and it will reward you for many years to come.  Can't ask more than that, Sir G.

[bobanddog]

Thanks. I have to get motivated tomorrow and go find the scope I am going to use. I think I will upgrade my eye protection and maybe get some shooting gloves. 

Glad to hear it, and your eye protection is always prudent with any firearm. 

[sirgilligan]

Be EXCITED!!!  You have one of the finest bolt action .223 rifles on the planet.  Even a middle of the road shooter (like me) should be able to squeeze off sub-MOA groups at 100 and 200 yards routinely, with a factory stock rifle.  The Mauser action is smooth and reliable.  Put some decent glass on the rifle.  Treat it well, and it will reward you for many years to come.  Can't ask more than that, Sir G.

Thanks!

[sirgilligan]

Thanks. I have to get motivated tomorrow and go find the scope I am going to use. I think I will upgrade my eye protection and maybe get some shooting gloves. 

Glad to hear it, and your eye protection is always prudent with any firearm.

Thanks.

[truckjohn]

Love it!  It's an incredibly handy little carbine that makes a fine walking hunter....  I really do love the weight - as it's about 30% lighter than the next heavier rifle in my closet.... and that's quite welcome when you are Hunting - AKA Carrying around rifles and not shooting them....

Remember that these are in fact CIP proof tested... each and every single one before it leaves the factory.....

It takes a large amount of overpressure to destroy a rifle.... Typically - somewhere in the vicinity of 2x maximum pressure.... but quite a few rifles take more abuse....

I would personally suspect something else went afoul....  Obstructed barrel, bad reloads, firing out of battery, etc....

Thanks

[Striper Sniper]

Well....I have a 527 lux which is gorgeous. I never thought about buying a .223 bolt gun but saw how darn beautiful it was and had to grab it.  Since then....I added a Burris Timberline 4.5-14x32. I am shooting sub one inch groups at 100 yards. Many times I hit direct bullseye on the fIrst cold barrel shot. It is a blast to shoot and simply amazes me and everyone at the range when they see it.