CZ 97 and IDPA

[dale59911]

With the rule changes on the weight, it seems that the CZ97B is legal for IDPA.  How many are using it for that and if so, what mods did you do? I would appreciate your honest evaluation of cost/return.  By that I mean, what do you consider to be essential mods for the gun and what are the "nice to do" if you don't care how much you spend kind of stuff. 

The second part is which of the 9MM would you recommend for IDPA?

I have to admit I was really sort of skeptical about the CZ but after a couple of range sessions, I am shooting my out of the box CZ 97B way better than any of my dearly beloved Sigs.  To be honest, it fits my hand like a glove...the manual safety takes me back to my 1911 days...the safety is just natural to me.

Stocking up on 45 ACP....the UPS guy is starting to be scared bleepless of me  LOL

[tdogg]

So is the gun legal for SSP, ESP, or just CDP?

I am planning on using my 97BD for USPSA Limited 10.  I currently have not shot it in competition but love shooting it too much to let it sit in the safe.  I recently ordered a Bladetech and some mag pouches to fit the larger 45 magazines.  I'm waiting for the Bladetech to arrive.  If I can shoot it in IDPA too that is just a bonus!

As far as mod's go you can do everything to the 97B that is available for the 75 series (the same internals).

Here is what I've done to my 97BD:

Full action polish - Free just follow the stickies in the gunsmithing section, worth the time and effort.
CGW SRS-2 kit - Worth the cost in order to be able to use the Type 2 Disconnector.  Added benefit for reduced DA trigger pull (first shot for 97BD and all SSP).
CGW Type 2 Disconnector - Really cleans up the feel of the trigger.  There is less wasted movement and it equates to better follow up shot times/accuracy.
CZ Custom decocker hammer - This takes all the creep out of the SA trigger pull.  It is a very crisp break point all the while retaining a good feel for when it is going to break.  Worth the price of admission.
CZ Custom Original 85C Trigger - improves the feel of the trigger, a nice to have but not totally necessary.

Wish list:
CGW Fitted Barrel Bushing - I can't complain about the stock accuracy but someday I will send my slide to CGW to have a precision bushing fitted.  It's my splurge item.
Dawson Fiber optic front - I really like the Dawson sight on my SP01 but haven't added one to the 97BD yet.  I'm going to shoot a couple of matches first.
CGW EZ drift Rear sight - Same as above
Thin Aluminum Grips - I'm beginning to like the thin set I won here on the forum, and maybe some day I will try them on the 97BD (if someone actually makes them)?

If you are going to shoot ESP (can the 97B?) and can start locked and cocked, I would polish the action and replace the hammer.

Have fun!
Cheers,
Toby

[warrior]

The rule change last October made the CZ 97 legal for idpa. It is legal for all pistol classes. The weight for all pistols for all classes is 39 oz. Even with the no full length dust cover rule it still is legal for CDP because it fit in the SSP rule. If it is ok for SSP it is ok for CDP as long as it is .45 acp. So with that rule no SA only 97. It still must be a SA/DA gun. You can run it cocked and locked or decock for DA first pull.

I have shot mine some in CDP. I'm focusing on SSP with my sp01. I put Shadow Safety(SSP legal because it's a factory shadow part) and CZ Custom tactical rear sight ( factory fiber optic front sight) on my 97b. I put a CGW spring kit in also. I think it a great CDP gun. Double stack mags are easier for me for reloads over a 1911. Don't have to "Barney mag" with the 10 rd mags. CDP requires 8 rds in mag, start with 9rds.

Warrior

[dale59911]

Is the weight not 43 oz?  The CZ 97 weighs in at just over 41 oz with an empty magazine. 

[Smitty79]

I would think that a 45 ACP would be dominating L10.   With a 10 round limit, why would you go with the snappier 40?   If I wanted to do L10, I think a Tanfoglio SA gun for some kind of 2011 would be the way to go.

[warrior]

Dale you are correct, old weight was 39 oz. New 43 oz. My bad.

Warrior

[dale59911]

I agree but the +10 is USPSA and not IDPA.  The other question I have is about the "cocked and locked" comment.   From the way I ready the rules, and please correct me if I am wrong, but IDPA, in a DA pistol or a DA/SA, you must start with hammer down.  The confusion comes with the part about engaging the manual safety at shooters discretion.  I don't think you can shoot this pistol, or any pistol with a DA/SA "cocked and locked".  It looks like at the start of the timer you can cock it at your discretion but you can't holster it "cocked and locked"??

Lots of information/misinformation off of youtube videos so if I have this sort of screwed up......don't hesitate to correct me....I am very thick skinned.

Dale

[dale59911]

LOL and don't get me wrong I am not a big competition guy....hell, never shot any of this.  What I have found is that the CZ97 is such a sweet shooting gun that is a shame not to use it.  This is a pretty good endorsement from an official SIG FANBOY.

I have seen the light!!!!  LMAO

[warrior]

No the IDPA rule book states it is the shooters choice to decock or cocked and locked( safety engaged). In CDP or ESP. If your gun has a decocker you must decock it before holstering. SSP you must decock it. By manually lowering hammer or decocker.
The 97 is legal in all IDPA pistol classes, but being it is .45 it is better served in CDP. Plus it always fun when the 1911 guys ask "what is that?"
Warrior

[dale59911]

I went back over that and now I understand.  The SSP is the odd man out on the cocked and locked.  I know the CDP is the division of choice.  My gun club has a relatively small membership and turnout for the local IDPA and at times you might be the only person shooting CDP so it is nice to be able to shoot in SSP as well.  And yes, the CZ does seem to draw attention. 

[dale59911]

One final question......SSP seems to be the most restrictive division in terms of allowed modifications......for example, I would think that adding the CGW SS 1911 match barrel bushing would eliminate it from SSP. 

If that is true, then the gun could not be used in either ESP or CDP because the CZ97 exceeds the 3.25" dust cover rule and is only allowed into those categories because it is compliant with the SSP rules.  Once you do something that makes it not eligible for SSP, then it is out of every division in IPDA.

Is that a correct interpretation of the rules?   

[Alpha Sierra]

No the IDPA rule book states it is the shooters choice to decock or cocked and locked( safety engaged). In CDP or ESP. If your gun has a decocker you must decock it before holstering. SSP you must decock it. By manually lowering hammer or decocker.

I'm not exactly clear on what you are saying, so let me rephrase

The pistol's condition of readiness are as follows:
CDP and ESP
1. Single action pistols must start cocked with the safety on
2. DA/SA pistols with no decocker can start EITHER cocked and locked OR with the hammer manually lowered to its lowest position (half cock not allowed).  If starting hammer down, the safety can be engaged at shooter's discretion
3. DA/SA pistols with decocker MUST have the hammer lowered using the decocker and the hammer can stop wherever the decocker lowers it to (half cock notch on CZ pistols for ex)

SSP
1. Single action handguns not allowed
2. DA/SA pistols with no decocker MUST start with the hammer manually lowered to its lowest position (half cock not allowed).  The safety can be engaged at shooter's discretion
3. DA/SA pistols with decocker MUST have the hammer lowered using the decocker and the hammer can stop wherever the decocker lowers it to (half cock notch on CZ pistols for ex)

In all cases the hammer must be dropped on an empty chamber by pressing the trigger (never by using a decocker) at the command "hammer" by the SO when unloading and showing clear.

[Alpha Sierra]

One final question......SSP seems to be the most restrictive division in terms of allowed modifications......for example, I would think that adding the CGW SS 1911 match barrel bushing would eliminate it from SSP. 

If that is true, then the gun could not be used in either ESP or CDP because the CZ97 exceeds the 3.25" dust cover rule and is only allowed into those categories because it is compliant with the SSP rules.  Once you do something that makes it not eligible for SSP, then it is out of every division in IPDA.

Is that a correct interpretation of the rules?   

The 1911 bushing is out as an SSP allowable mod.

I'm not sure if making it illegal in SSP would violate the SSP into CDP rule, but a common sense reading of the rules would seem so.  Only IDPA HQ could say for sure.  Here's the rulebook interpretations, maybe the answer is there: http://www.idpa.com/misc/RC/IDPARulesClarification-v2014-06-15.pdf

But I wouldn't bother with any of that.  This isn't bullseye and buying bullseye levels of accuracy is not going to buy you points.

Leave your pistol alone, except for maybe cleaning up the trigger and sights, and spend your money on ammo and your time on shooting.

[dale59911]

Thanks for the input.  Buying points in IDPA is not the goal, but I do want to be able to use it in the local matches for the training value of the experience.  The pistol is already way more accurate than I am and is likely to stay that way in age/vision/coordination race that you run when you reach your mid sixties.  I think a trigger kit and a little internal work is all that is required.  My UPS driver, and out here we tend to get the same one all the time) calls my ammo deliveries "boat anchors".  Last week he commented "you must have bought a bigger boat"

[warrior]

Dale from the way I understand the rules. The CGW 1911 bushing would make the gun illegal for use in IDPA. That said most club matches would not care. where you would run into an issuse is at larger state and regional matches. As stated before IDPA is not bullseye. You will be more than accurate enough with the stock bushing.

Warrior