Author Topic: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?  (Read 11017 times)

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Offline Manticore_Arms

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I stumbled across pictures of it a few days ago, and now can't find them.

Just wanted to see some of the details again...you know, brainstorming and all.  ;)

Sven
Manticore Arms

Offline vblue42

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2014, 11:56:04 PM »
I beleive its the CZ958 being offered in Canada.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2014, 11:57:44 PM by vblue42 »

Offline Database121

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2014, 05:39:22 AM »
You aren't by chance referring to the Slovakian VZ 58 modernization program from 2010 are you?

Offline Manticore_Arms

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2014, 08:11:49 AM »
Database,

Yep, that is it!  Thanks!

Offline MariusVZ

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2014, 08:26:56 AM »
Someone just pulled out all the stops!

If you make this thing, or something like it, please make it affordable!!  And VZ2008 compatible!

Offline Database121

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2014, 09:21:27 AM »
Here are a few more pics of that modernized VZ I was able to rack down










I hope these help out some. Personally I would kill just to have a version of the stock they have on it, let alone the whole system.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2014, 09:24:08 AM by Database121 »

Offline BA Glover

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2014, 02:37:20 PM »
I like the way it looks.  Don't think I want to mess with moving the charging handle....

Offline Manticore_Arms

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2014, 04:34:34 PM »
Outstanding, those pictures are great!

The last pictures appear to be a rapid prototype- I can tell by the texture of the material (it is made of rapid prototype black nylon, we have used the same process on a few R&D pieces!)

FYI, if we do something crazy like this, it would work with the existing charging handle location on the right and the existing iron sights- it would simply attach to a stock VZ58 or VZ2008 and require no permanent modifications to the gun.

The main trick with a monolithic top rail like that is to still have the ability the remove the bolt carrier group for cleaning and maintenance, and I have an idea how that could be accomplished.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2014, 04:36:11 PM by Manticore_Arms »

Offline BA Glover

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2014, 08:08:57 PM »
Your the man then.  I'm down for two then.  Well not at the same time I'm sure my budget won't stretch for two in the same month.  Besides she who must be obeyed is less likely to notice that way:) But two for sure.



BA

Offline Manticore_Arms

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2014, 11:09:44 PM »
OK, been looking at a few things and needs some feedback.  It looks like we can go one of two ways on a top cover for a handguard:

1.  Superlow picatinny gas tube that allows you to co-witness an Aimpoint Micro and similar sized optics.

2.  A higher top rail that is continuous from the front of the gas tube to right before the rear dust cover (i.e. would cantilever back over the open bolt area).  There would be a cutout in the top rail so you could leave your rear iron sight installed, and you could probably use the irons without an optic mounted, but the irons would not be visible if an optic was attached to the rail.  Of course a Quick Detach optics mount for your optic would solve that issue.

Let me know which way you would prefer.


Offline Holz

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2014, 04:20:57 AM »
I would choose the second option. I already have NEA gas tube rail and feel the need for more flexible solution that would allow placing bigger variety of scopes with better magnification range. Such long rail would also allow me to install flip-up BUIS, so original front and back sights could be eliminated.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2014, 04:23:02 AM by Holz »

Offline BA Glover

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2014, 10:32:30 AM »
I agree with Holz.  I'm not really worried about retaining the original sights though.  With a continuous rail I'll do a red dot and a set of BUIS.

Offline Manticore_Arms

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2014, 10:58:31 AM »
Cool, thanks for the feedback.

Honestly I am personally leaning toward option #2 as there are already several companies making option #1.  Also, I have to check one potential fitment issue, but I *might* have figured out how to do a full length top rail from the front of the gas block to the rear of the dust cover. 

The only other issue is cost- the bigger the parts, the more machine time, and the higher the cost.  Just splitballing here based on experience, but once we start to extend back from the normal handguard area we could easily be talking the $250-$300+ range.  Just wanted to give fair warning, and if you guys think we should stick to something in the under $200 price point we can certainly do that, but it will be a bit more conventional in handguard design- just an upper and lower handguard. 

I also might be able to make a lower handguard that works with both option #1 and option #2, but that creates some additional engineering problems to solve. 

Anyhow, as I said, just trying to get a feel for what the market wants!

Sven
Manticore Arms

Offline BA Glover

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2014, 12:14:17 PM »
I'm sure you will sell more of the $200 version than a $300 by far but you guys know that otherwise you wouldn't be in business. 

A matching lower handguard would be definitely desirable either way you go .02$

Offline Manticore_Arms

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Re: Anyone have pics of the VZ58 prototype with the monolithic rail system?
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2014, 01:04:23 PM »
I think I might have this continuous top rail figured out conceptually.  On to CAD to work this bad boy out.  8)