Author Topic: Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)  (Read 1700 times)

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Unregistered(d)

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« on: April 04, 2002, 07:42:16 PM »
Well I currently shoot a Ruger .22/45 and I think I am ready for my first 9mm.  I want to stick with a single action pistol.  So basically I am looking at a 1911, a Hi Power, and a CZ75 B SA.  Ok, obviously on this forum you are going to say CZ, but WHY?  Other than price (could almost get 2 CZ's for 1 HP or 1911), why should I get a CZ?  I have average to small hands, so grip size is an issue.  I see that the CZ has a 10 rnd capacity (there are pre-bans I assume?).  I am right handed, so no need for the ambi levers.  On the other side the ergonomics of both the HP and the 1911 are unbeatable!  1911 has less capacity, but I am not going to be in an all day shoot out (still just plinking and maybe IPDA someday).  I also don't think you can beat the looks of a 1911.  The Hi-Power just has its history and quality that scores high in my book.  So why the CZ75B SA?

CZ75ID

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2002, 06:43:26 AM »
Documented 1/2 inch groups. HANDGUNS March 2001.

I doubt if a stock 9mm HP will do that. yes , CZ75-CZ75B hi-caps are now $38.00 thru VonFatman at the CZF SHOP.
They will fit and function in the 9mm 75SA.

I wish i'd now bought the 9mm SA. I wanted to convert my
.40 to .357 SIG.

Now i'm off to other calibers, and my superb 75SA sits idle.



www.czfshop.com

Steve9mm

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2002, 10:57:46 AM »
I have a 75B SA in 9mm which is more accurate and has a better trigger than my Glock-17. When I went gun shopping for another 9mm, I planned on buying a Sig,Walther, HK or Browning but every gun store recommended that I consider the CZ and customers in every store who owned one said it was the best value. Mine cost $396, so I was able to buy 2 15 round mags and still spend less than anyother gun including my Glock. From the first time at the range, I am shooting tighter groups compared to the Glock, which I have fed 10.000+ rounds.

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2002, 04:10:19 PM »
I here nothing but good things about CZ's!  A couple of my buddies shoot them, so the next time I am at the range with them, I will try 'em out.  I just wanted some "outside"  opinions instead of there propaganda, but sounds like it is legit (sp).  Thanks.  I will let you know what happens, and if I need some grips, I will let you know Hakan!  Thanks.

SteveYC

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2002, 01:33:40 AM »

   I recently got a surplus Browning Hi Power, and have been eying the CZ-75SA for a while, here are my thoughts:

   1) The stock BHP trigger pretty much sucks. You can improve it quite a bit by removing the mag safety and replacing the hammer springs. The mag safety is easy to remove (if you have punches), the hammer spring is a enormous pain in the rear (but you can find decent instructions). The stock CZ-75SA trigger is much nicer - it is lighter - but it still has some camming, which can seem like creep, but is apparently a design choice by CZ to increase reliability.

   2) The CZ-75SA has less felt recoil (IMO) than the BHP. The CZ is a bigger gun, and if it weren't for the louder sound, it is kind of like shooting my Ruger .22

   3) A NIB CZ-75SA will cost you about $200 less than a NIB BHP practical. That $200 could buy you upgraded grips, better sights and maybe even a trigger job - which would give you a vastly superior value than the stock BHP practical.

   4) As Kevin noted, the CZ-75SA has excellent accuracy, supposedly more accurate than the BHP. New BHP's are supposed to be sub 3" @ 25yards guns, the CZ-75SA seems to get about half that size. On the other hand, that is accuracy that I am incapable of using.

   5) The internal slide rails of the CZ-75SA contributes to a tighter gun. BHP's are known to rattle quite a bit. My BHP rattles more than my CZ-75PCR, but the barrel to slide fit on the BHP seems tighter than on my PCR. I am assuming that my PCR's tolerances are comparable to the CZ-75SA.

The bad things about the CZ-75SA

   1) The CZ-75SA has a bigger grip. The BHP has a compact sized grip on a full length slide. The BHP is a very flat gun with a fairly narrow grip. In my hands, the BHP with the "fat" Hogue rubber grips feels better than a CZ-75SA with Hakan's custom wood grips (my PCR with Hakan grips feels almost as good). No doubt with some Spegels, the BHP would be even flatter. You may be able to approach the flatness of the BHP with very thin grips on the CZ, but the shape of the backstrap on the BHP is subtly better (imo). The trigger and safety on the CZ-75SA are within easy reach, but the slide release is not. On the BHP (and the CZ compacts) all controls are reachable without shifting my grip.

   2) The CZ has fewer customization options and fewer smiths who know it. The BHP is an old design that is remarkably easy to work on - you can make real improvements in the trigger of a BHP on your own - it is easy to get parts.

   3) The BHP trigger, while heavy, is much crisper than the CZ-75. I'm going to swap in a new hammer spring, and if I run into Spazz at the range, I'll compare them side by side. Breaking in the triggers on CZ's will make them silky smooth, but I don't think they ever become crisp. Mike@CZ-USA can give you a crisp trigger for about $60 + shipping.

   4) The BHP is a flat gun with a short grip, so it is not out of the question to use the BHP has a CCW weapon (the BHP seems easier to conceal than my PCR, due to it's flatness but it is much heavier). The CZ-75SA is definitely a full sized gun - probably never a contender for concealed carry.

   5) The BHP seems to be faster to bring on target, I think that this is because the balance is weighted more towards the grip on the BHP, and more towards the muzzle/top on the CZ-75SA.

   Subjectively, I think the BHP is a faster, more elegant gun than the full sized CZ's, but I think that objectively, the CZ-75SA is in many ways the better gun. I got my BHP for (relatively) cheap, it fit my hands better and I wanted a project gun, so it was the right gun for my purposes. But I think you can't go wrong with the CZ-75SA.

   Steve

Offline VonFatman

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2002, 10:27:15 PM »
I too favor the BHP in my hand, I just love the way it feels.
I GOTTA get a trigger job on my BHP...the trigger is sooooo awful.
Steve, you have any suggestions for a good BHP trigger job 'smith?
VF
"A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves ... and include all men capable of bearing arms."
- Richard Henry Lee

SteveYC

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2002, 11:57:44 PM »
VF,
   There isn't any rocket science to a BHP trigger job, a smith that knows 1911's should be able to do it easily - and Mark Graham (the smith at arizonaresponsesystems.com/ ) posted directions: www.pistolsmith.com/viewt...7&forum=13

   If you are feeling up to it, you can do a good bit of trigger work on your own.
   I picked up the BHP as a "fixer upper". and without any gunsmithing skills, I've got the trigger down to about 5lbs with no creep. I spent $16 on a set of springs (for tools you will need punches, sandpaper/files to smooth some edges on the spring strut and a small vise). My PCR's SA pull is still lighter, but not nearly as crisp.
   I did get my thumb whacked pretty hard by a runaway hammer, and spent a few hours cursing at my mainspring assembly though, so it wasn't a total walk in the park. But it isn't beyond the abilities of an average, but patient guy with a decent mechanical sense.
   You can spend an extra $100 and get an aftermarket hammer/sear assembly that is supposed to get you down to a crisp 3.5lb trigger.
   If you want to send it out, Mark Graham looks like he does honest work for a good price, and many folks seem to happy with Apex tactical. There are a whole bunch of super-Gunsmiths out there that do incredible custom guns, but that stuff is out of my league.
   Check go do a search on the forums (old and new) on  www.FNHiPower.com for more info, there are a couple of guys there who are really helpful for home smithing projects, among them the ever accurate Stephen Camp, who is quite the HiPower guru.

   Steve

Offline VonFatman

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Looking for first 9mm (want a SA)
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2002, 07:36:12 AM »
I gotta get the ol' girl's trigger up in shape...I just can't stand a bad trigger!
My BHP is the "El Capitan" (sp?) with the weird rear sight.
It's pretty, blued finish and it is the best fitting gun (in my hands) of all my guns.  Once the trigger is working, I am going to shoot the barrel off.
VF
"A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves ... and include all men capable of bearing arms."
- Richard Henry Lee

 

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