New reloader seating depth question

[painter]

That would work.

For some reason, I forgott we started with  RN.

[Wobbly]

The only data they give for that weight is 124gr Jacketed Hp. Would that be the data I work off of using the Berry's 124gr RN? Or am I missing something?

You're using Plated bullets. Your data states Jacketed. The way I read your question, you're asking is that the appropriate data to use.

Your answer is under the "Frequently Asked" heading on the Berry Mfg web site, question number 3.


Hope you're recording all this in your new Reloading Notebook.

 

[LarryBoy]

Ok so this is what Berry's Wed site reads

You can use published load data for lead/cast bullets or low to mid-range FMJ data, as long as it is the same weight bullet.

The Lyman data for 124 gr Jacketed HP using 231 powder list starting grains at 3.8 and max grains at 4.5 with a OAL of 1.060.
The Hodgdon data for 124 gr BERB HBRN TP using HP-38 list starting grains at 3.9 and max grains at 4.4 with a COL of 1.150

So if I were to use a OAL of 1.135 would I still start at 3.8 gr and build up to 4.2?

[painter]

I'd use 4.3 as a max load for your OAL adjustment.

Truth be told, your OAL reduction is so small that a combination of OAL and powder throw variances could put you right within the published data.

[LarryBoy]

Well spent some time with the machine. Made up some dummy rounds with a OAL of 1.135 and crimp is at .378. Dialed in the powder at 3.8 gr. I think I'm ready for some test rounds going to start at 3.8 and build to 4.3.

[painter]

How many of each?

I hope you're going to say 10.

[LarryBoy]

Of coarse 10 of each. I've read to many post with you guys yelling at guys!

[painter]

Of coarse 10 of each. I've read to many post with you guys yelling at guys!

I wouldn't call it yelling.

A kinetic hammer is a great tool...but not that much fun to use.

Chances are the rounds at 3.8 will get disassembled after you shoot 1 or 2, or you might just shoot them all up.

I'm guessing you'll find the sweet spot somewhere around 4.1 or 4.2 gr.

[LarryBoy]

Thanks for the help. Heading out of town this week won't get to try them until the end of the week.

[Wobbly]

Ok so this is what Berry's Wed site reads

You can use published load data for lead/cast bullets or low to mid-range FMJ data, as long as it is the same weight bullet.

And you got it ! Not all plated bullets use Jacketed data, so you need to check. It's all based on the thickness of the plating.

? The Lyman data for 124 gr Jacketed HP using 231 powder list starting grains at 3.8 and max grains at 4.5 with a OAL of 1.060.
? The Hodgdon data for 124 gr BERB HBRN TP using HP-38 list starting grains at 3.9 and max grains at 4.4 with a COL of 1.150

So if I were to use a OAL of 1.135 would I still start at 3.8 gr and build up to 4.2?

I know you've been advised, but I would go about this a different way...

? First of all, realize that the load data is not a recommendation, but a report on what the safety zone is.
? Secondly, if you load LONGER than the report, you're still going to be safe. So I always look for data with an OAL shorter than what I intend to use.
? Thirdly, that you need to get used to using that Lyman manual so you can trust it.

So in your shoes I'd be using the Lyman data: 3.8 to 4.5gr at your OAL of 1.135". Nice and safe.

Load ten at 3.8gr, ten at 4.0gr, ten at 4.2gr, ten at 4.3gr, ten at 4.4gr. Note that due to the lengthening OAL, 4.5gr is no longer the Max Load but it doesn't matter. The best accuracy is hardly ever anywhere near Max Load. So we're simply not going to shoot 4.5gr.

You're going to shoot these off a sand bag or some other bench rest at 5 different targets. Ones that hopefully have a 2" black circle or some other well-defined center the eye can't miss. All 5 targets placed at 30 feet.

That will get you some information !!

 

[LarryBoy]

Ok I was able to shoot the test loads. The 3.8gr and 4.0gr loads had very light recoil with pretty good groups. The 4.2gr and 4.3 gr loads grouped a little better put had considerable more recoil and the 4.4gr load had the best group but a lot of recoil. All cycled well and had one CCI primer that failed. I think I NEED TO LOAD MORE AT 4.0gr, 4.1gr and 4.3gr to get a better idea of what works the best for me.

[Wobbly]

LB -
Ignore the recoil ! Go for the accuracy !

In your flip flops, I'd load the 4.2gr, 4.3gr and 4.4gr again.  Slow fired off a support at new 30' targets. You may want to shoot 7 or 8 and discard the wildest shot on each group. (No one's perfect !) Then take a caliper and measure the remaining group.



Once you find what the barrel likes, then we can change the springs to make the recoil more manageable. Tune the load, then tune the recoil.

Remember, use small (~2 inch) jet black circles for your bulls eyes. None of this fancy orange diamond bulls, no human outline stuff, no Obama photos. It has to do with how the human eye works. Small targets produce small groups.

Then you'll be ready !!

 

[LarryBoy]

Ok I loaded up 15 rounds each at 4.1gr,4.2gr,4.3gr and 4.4gr. I shot 7 rounds free hand and 8 rounds at bench rest. The 4.3gr and 4.4gr had the tightest groupings. I did have 3 failure to fire with the CCI primers. I haven't been able to find Federal primers so I picked up some Winchester.

[1SOW]

Re primer fails:  did they fire on a second or even third hit by the firing pin?
If they did,  then the primers weren't seated deep enough to push the three anvils up against the primer compound.  The first strike(S) can just push the primer deeper into the hole so they'll fire with the next strike.
Yes,  Feds and Wins will fire with lighter strikes,  but all primers need to be fully seated in the primer cup.
 

[Wobbly]

Re primer fails:  Did they fire on a second or even third hit by the firing pin? If they did,  then the primers weren't seated deep enough to push the three anvils up against the primer compound.

Exactly correct.

Poorly seated primers is a common novice reloader thing you'll quickly get over. But you have to do the double strike thing to see if it's the seating of the primer or the cup thickness making for incomplete ignition.

You're doing good.