Safety vs Decocker for carry?

[Rigidman]

Wanted to refresh this thread a little. Because I'm new here and it's an interesting read. I have carried several different types of handguns. From wheel guns to autos. My hands are XL, at least that's what it says in my gloves. So I've never had a problem reaching or operating anything.

One time, only once. I'm not sure if it was the grips, or the back strap. It was a 1911. The back strap was about 75% thicker than stock. The grips were wood. Never knew if they were stock, homemade, custom, or aftermarket. They were 50% thicker than stock. Usually my fingers wrap around and touch my palm. Not this gun. I felt like a 5 year old holding this thing. I've had a Kimber double stack .45. I've had a custom .45 magnum. Got to say this, thing the LAR GRIZZLY magnum cost me $1000 used. It was a beast. I loved it. Only complaint was it made the web of my hand sore. Bullets weren't cheap. Lucky if you could find them or if they were in stock. That's why I wound up selling it.

I had a SS version. The guy that bought was going on about how long he'd been looking. How much everyone wanted. So I asked double what I wanted. Was going to try to break even. Caveat Emptor. It was before the internet.

I've always carried cocked and locked. BUT, and I'm sure there are some that are gonna fuss. I've had 1911s with only the grip safety. I've had wheel guns where you were the safety. So no bullet in the chamber. Yes while drawing you could put one in your foot, leg, hopefully just the floor. So I practiced. Like Samurai did and still do. Bushido. Way of the warrior. Perfection in all things.

Right now I have a Tokarev with only a trigger safety. I'd carry it cocked and locked. The trigger is going to be swapped soon for an original. So eventually it will have no safety except me. Think I should mention that when I draw a weapon, my finger runs along the slide, on wheel gun it's on the cylinder. Some place it on trigger guard. I dont.

The other part of this equation is the holster. Is there anything that can activate the trigger while drawing? If I thought it would, I would either not buy it or if I thought it could be removed or duck taped. I'd remove whatever the trigger could catch on or tape it. I have never had an accidental discharge. Yet.

Yes I know, sometimes the first time can be the last. But these days the SA trigger pull is much heavier than they used to be. I remember they used advertise how light the pull was. You can breath on it and it'll go off. Hell where do you think the drop test came from? Most modern manufacturers have added hammer blocks. With safeties. I wonder why they don't have them on decockers? I mean the type that only when the trigger is pulled that's when the block moves. I had a 1911 that worked this way. Also a .357, not the Rossi. Similar, heavy under lug, no vented rib.

So give to me. Tell me how bad and stupid I am. But I do really believe handguns are a lot safer today than they used to be.

[SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM]

Handguns were just as safe 50 years ago as they are today. Decocker guns such as the CZ decocker models have firing pin block safeties just the same as anything else. Trigger pulls are lighter than they ever were on today's guns. Early semi autos in their stock form had pretty sad SA pulls while in contrast nothing had a better out of the box SA pull than an S&W revolver.

[Rigidman]

I agree, but many weapons weren't available as they are now. The gun world was somewhat small when you think about it. The internet made the world far bigger. Most things were word of mouth, magazines, and manufacturers catalogs.

There were many guns that had questionable safety. Drop it and someone could get hurt. Many guns had no safety except for you. I can't say with any certainty about weapon trigger weight. I just don't have that info, I can get it if I wanted to. But many times when I turned 21, actually sooner. Started thinking about guns about the same time I noticed girls. Anyway, they were advertising 2, 2.5, and 3lb SA trigger pulls. Most manufacturers where at 5-8lb+ SA. Gun safety has come a long way. Some were minute improvements while others were complete redesigns. I truly believe modern firearms are far safer than some of their antiquated older brethren.

[SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM]

 Single action revolvers way back when were not drop safe but Ruger fixed that after they got sued.  DA revolvers have pretty much always been perfectly safe with their hammer blocks there's no possible way the gun can fire without a deliberate pull of the trigger. 1911's are still made in high numbers without firing pin block safeties and the potential is there for a discharge if dropped. Not dropping the gun goes along with safe handling.Most other semi autos had a safety lever or decocker or a combo there of and they were not going to fire either without a deliberate stroke of the trigger.
yeah there alot more designs available today then ever before but you can't show me in any way that a gun such as the modern striker fired pistols are in any way shape or form safer than most older guns unless your talking an 1800's Colt SAA.  My 35 year old S&W 3rd gen auto is as safe as anything new as is any of my 40's-50's era S&W revolvers. Whether a mechanical safety is present or not SAFETY begins and ends with the person holding the gun.

[Texas377]

PCR with decocker.  Since sending it to CGW for TLC and a Defensive Carry Package, the SA trigger is 3.7lbs.  Love it!

[Rigidman]

Single action revolvers way back when were not drop safe but Ruger fixed that after they got sued.  DA revolvers have pretty much always been perfectly safe with their hammer blocks there's no possible way the gun can fire without a deliberate pull of the trigger. 1911's are still made in high numbers without firing pin block safeties and the potential is there for a discharge if dropped. Not dropping the gun goes along with safe handling.Most other semi autos had a safety lever or decocker or a combo there of and they were not going to fire either without a deliberate stroke of the trigger.
yeah there alot more designs available today then ever before but you can't show me in any way that a gun such as the modern striker fired pistols are in any way shape or form safer than most older guns unless your talking an 1800's Colt SAA.  My 35 year old S&W 3rd gen auto is as safe as anything new as is any of my 40's-50's era S&W revolvers. Whether a mechanical safety is present or not SAFETY begins and ends with the person holding the gun.

I was trying to figure out who started that. Thanks for the info.

[Jiva]

FWIW...

99041 cocked and locked.

[Rigidman]

FWIW...

99041 cocked and locked.

Everyday!! Cept not your gun, my guns.

[Indy_Tim]

Whether it’s a safety equipped model or one of my decocker equipped ones, I carry at the half cock notch.  Manually decocking a pistol is not an issue if you are careful and follow the 4 rules in regards to where it’s pointing when you do.  I just don’t trust my 1911 tuned thumb to hit that little CZ safety in the heat of the moment.  All of my 1911s that get carried have a very similar, large thumb safety.  As to which is better?  It’s a personal choice I think. 

I do like the better sear pin support in decockers but don’t care for the single hammer hook in the decocker.  Neither issue is a deal breaker but it does make me very reluctant to carry a decocker with a race hammer installed.  There is very little sear engagement in that config.

[Old-Duckman]

My choice was not listed...”No preference”.

I have examples of both and have carried both. Were I ever to actually have to use my firearm in self defense (God forbid). My first round is double action, I never carry a handgun that I have to disengage a safety before using it. And, I am not so uncoordinated (at least not yet) that I fear an unintentional discharge when lowering the hammer.

IMO decockers are overrated (and overpriced), though I use them when the firearm has one.

[Rigidman]

I know there are people very proficient in racking a slide after pulling it. It becomes instinct and muscle memory comes into play. I practice drawing and aiming. But most my guns have stiff spring rates. I don't have any 9mm. I have a Taurus th40 that racks fairly easy. My CZ 97B is still very stiff. Working on it. The Tanfoglio isn't too bad. It's a .40 too. I got use to holding the front of my 1911s to rack them. My forefinger and thumb slid down the barrel. If there are large rear sights I've used them to rack a slide too. Anything that made it easier or quicker.
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I use to polish everything on a new gun. But got away from it about 20-25 years ago. The last 10 I've only had long guns. Some manufacturers are getting very good at providing quality firearms out of the box. You don't need to polish the feed ramp, the sear, and etc.

On one 1911 it was tight on the slide, I polished it. I tried oiling it first but there was a spot where it was catching. Never had one do it before or since. They were all Colts or Kimbers. So it wasn't some cheap clone.

Everything I knew about using a gun tactically, I learned in the Army. Before that I thought they were for hunting and home defence. Had a special forces friend that taught me some things too. First time he took a handgun from me was crazy. If it was real he could've shot me with my own gun. So now I know how to do it as well and if the need should arise I know to keep my distance. For all you know the person in your house took some type of self defense or martial art when they were young and innocent. Not every criminal starts out in a broken home or homeless. The rich have the same problems as the poor. Difference is they can pay to fix their problems. The poor goes to jail.

I've had guns that had no safety at all. Usually carried them on an empty chamber. Like revolvers. There are those that believe the revolver is more dependable and more accurate than a semi auto. Personally I think it has a lot to do with the one doing the shooting. And the manufacturer.

I've been to some shooting exhibitions when I was younger and those guys were something else. Never saw one miss. They held up a mirror to shoot behind themselves. Now I know some shows were like magicians shows. But these people let people examine the stuff. Most were built with 2x4s. Of course they were shooting with peacemakers, Henry rifles, Winchesters, and one woman used a Sharps rifle. Couple used 1911s. I also know how that some were shooting with lighter powder to prevent over penetration and ricochet.

They had a bunch of shows like that at the fairgrounds. Also had those dare devil stunt shows. Still have the books from those. They used cars and bikes. Sometimes I forget to make it quick and simple. I start writing and go on forever. Later.

[SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM]

What revolvers or semi autos are were you carrying on an empty chamber?

[Screwball]

For me, I prefer frame mounted safeties and slide mounted decockers.

1911, P938, SP-01, Colt M1908 (.25)... even my Yugo Tokarev and MK III. Take the safety off, flick it down. In single action, I like it. If it were in double action, I’d disregard the safety (heavy trigger pull is a great safety)... but prefer it to not accidentally pop on.

Slide mounted controls (safeties) tend to be the opposite, which I can do... but prefer not to. Down to safe, up for fire... I just don’t like. That is why all of my Berettas are G models. Also why I had my S&W 1006 cut for the TSW notch... allowing me to convert to decock only. Makes it easier. I do like SIG decocker positioning, but just prefer slide mounted instead. Think it has to do with my hand size.

Only different handgun I have is my CZ-52. While I’m not a fan of safe being a middle position, I do like decock flipped up, and fire down. But not a gun that I tend to mess around with too much... maybe getting a 9mm barrel may change that.

[Destroyer]

Hi just wanted to find out if there's any cz firearm that have a decocker and a safty? Like the hk usp p8 a1

[Tok36]

Hi just wanted to find out if there's any cz firearm that have a decocker and a safty? Like the hk usp p8 a1

Not both at the same time. The CZ P Series poly pistols and the CZ 75 Omega metal frame pistols can be swapped from one to the other and back.