Author Topic: Multi-caliber Bren?  (Read 645 times)

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Offline MeatAxe

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Multi-caliber Bren?
« on: January 28, 2018, 04:53:23 AM »
It seems to me that the initial concept of the Bren was as a multi-caliber platform like the Tavor -- I could be wrong, but that was my impression when they first started being sold in the US.

So, we've only seen 5.56 in the US (boring), 7.62x39 only in Europe so far. I would love to see these chambered in 6.5 Grendel or even 6.8 SPC or .300 Blackout, etc., which seems like an easily done no-brainer to bring to market, either barrels or complete uppers.

What is the status of CZ coming out with additional calibers in the Bren or any custom shops adapting to them to alternative calibers?

Thanks!
« Last Edit: January 28, 2018, 04:54:59 AM by MeatAxe »

Offline armoredman

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2018, 05:34:53 AM »
The BREN 805 was listed as being available in 300 Blackout for a short time, but I don't think any actually were sold. The 7.62x39mm model is a select fire model sold to the Indian Army, IIRC, and wasn't considered for US sales, not sure why. I would love a BREN 805 in 6.5 Grendel, but again it's market demand opposed to the cost of BATFE approval and manufacture, is there enough call for one to make it a productive effort? I would love it, but no idea. Now the buzz is all about the BREN 2 possibly coming in, will they kill off the 805 for the BREN 2, or run two competing rifles made just for the US market, or perhaps build rifles here at the new US factory when it gets spun up? Who knows, we'll see.

Offline rdcinhou

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2018, 05:36:56 AM »
This article explains the development of the Bren--the original expectation of being multi-caliber and how it ended up:

https://www.shootingillustrated.com/articles/2016/8/29/cz-usa-805-bren-s1-rifle
CZ 24, CZ 27, CZ 38, CZ 45, CZ 52, Vzor 50, Vzor 70, CZ75BΩ, CZ75D PCR Compact, CZ 75 P07 Duty, SP-01 Phantom, SP01 Tactical, CZ Shadow 2 Urban Grey, CZ P09 Duty, P10C, CZ 82, CZ 83, CZ 97BE, CZ 100, CZ 2075BD RAMI, CZ 452 American, CZ 550 Urban Counter Sniper, CZ 805 Bren, CZ Drake G2, DUO & Z

Offline MeatAxe

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2018, 08:04:57 PM »
The BREN 805 was listed as being available in 300 Blackout for a short time, but I don't think any actually were sold. The 7.62x39mm model is a select fire model sold to the Indian Army, IIRC, and wasn't considered for US sales, not sure why. I would love a BREN 805 in 6.5 Grendel, but again it's market demand opposed to the cost of BATFE approval and manufacture, is there enough call for one to make it a productive effort? I would love it, but no idea. Now the buzz is all about the BREN 2 possibly coming in, will they kill off the 805 for the BREN 2, or run two competing rifles made just for the US market, or perhaps build rifles here at the new US factory when it gets spun up? Who knows, we'll see.


With a gun friendly President and Congress, the panic and gun sales have slumped, particularly with ARs / 5.56. The only bright spot in the market are "super gun owners" like us who are always on the lookout for a better gun / caliber and are ready to buy.

Frankly, I'm sick of ARs and direct impingement problems, have been for years. Really, with a civilian semi-auto rifle, why bother with 5.56 anyway? It's relatively expensive and can't defeat common barriers like 7.62x39 can. I mean, since I'm limited to semi-auto and don't have an unlimited supply line at tax payer expense, I want my few personal bullets to reach out to distance, penetrate and be effective. 7.62x39 is good, but 6.5 Grendel in an a reasonably accurate piston gun is even mo' bettah -- especially if Wolf can keep the supply of good, cheap com bloc ammo flowing.

I hope CZ is listening. The hard core, gun-buying public in the US dwarfs every standing army on this planet.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 08:10:47 PM by MeatAxe »

Offline thehun

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2018, 08:31:04 PM »
Multi caliber always sounds good on paper...but hardly ever succeeds...Rob Arms honestly nailed the concept and truly the only one that offers one platfrom-many calibers

Offline armoredman

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2018, 09:29:19 PM »
Amen, MeatAxe.
rdcinhou, thanks for the link, good article. 8)

Offline Psyop96

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2018, 12:33:23 AM »
Looks like this attempt at multi-caliber is going to get vetted in Ukraine....

“It is now up to Ukrainian soldiers to decide if the brand new M4-WAC47 assault rifle – a special descendant of the legendary American-made M16 rifle – is good enough to eventually retire their decades-old workhorse Kalashnikovs.

A year after the initial announcement, the first batch of 10 new rifles is now undergoing firing trials by Ukraine’s Special Operations Forces, National Guard and Border Service.”

https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/new-ukrainian-m4-wac47-rifle-strong-political-message-russia.html?utm_content=buffera7c6f&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Offline MeatAxe

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2018, 01:17:09 AM »
Looks like this attempt at multi-caliber is going to get vetted in Ukraine....

“It is now up to Ukrainian soldiers to decide if the brand new M4-WAC47 assault rifle – a special descendant of the legendary American-made M16 rifle – is good enough to eventually retire their decades-old workhorse Kalashnikovs.

A year after the initial announcement, the first batch of 10 new rifles is now undergoing firing trials by Ukraine’s Special Operations Forces, National Guard and Border Service.”

https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/new-ukrainian-m4-wac47-rifle-strong-political-message-russia.html?utm_content=buffera7c6f&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Sounds like a logistical nightmare if they're going to field both 5.56 and 7.62x39, especially in a DI M-4. Why repeat that historic mistake, especially if they're running dirty ammo in a DI rifle?

If they use a piston AR platform like the Taiwanese, it might be ok, otherwise I would stick with their AKs, or switch to 6.5 Grendel AKs like Serbia.

Offline MeatAxe

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2018, 01:22:20 AM »
Multi caliber always sounds good on paper...but hardly ever succeeds...Rob Arms honestly nailed the concept and truly the only one that offers one platfrom-many calibers


Switching from 5.56 to 6.5 Grendel ought to be relatively easy. 6.5 G has been hugely successful in the AR platform already. The lowers/magazine wells are the same and since CZ is already making 7.62x39 bolts, they can use those and just change out the barrel and some incidentals.

Sounds like a slam dunk to me.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 01:25:22 AM by MeatAxe »

Offline armoredman

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2018, 09:04:25 PM »
It's all about supply and demand. If not enough people are demanding it, why waste the money supplying it? I would love for 6.5 Grendel in both the BREN 805 and the 527M, but....it's not viable enough yet.  :'(

Offline MeatAxe

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2018, 10:16:32 PM »
It's all about supply and demand. If not enough people are demanding it, why waste the money supplying it? I would love for 6.5 Grendel in both the BREN 805 and the 527M, but....it's not viable enough yet.  :'(

Well, with the firearms industry in a slump, somebody needs to do something to stimulate sales among those still buying guns. Hopefully, CZ Custom or CGW or somebody will step into the arena to at least prove the concept.

Offline armoredman

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Re: Multi-caliber Bren?
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2018, 03:00:56 PM »
There's plenty of new ideas out, and especially inexpensive ones to grab the dollars remaining - people are full up and it's gotta be a good deal to get attention. I'd lvoe to see a BREN 6.5 Grendel loss leadered at $700-800 to get some headlines.