CGW Race hammer..

[dannyvi]

From what i understand, safety will work in up positionat at all modes but does not say, do  not! For the very reason that people buy the safety design would be in keeping with the traditional 1911 design of carrying locked and cocked where the safety can not be applied with hammer down or halfcock. Adding the feature that safety is applicqble to the three scenarios might not be to the liking of 1911 afficionadoswhich is why CGW is saying that should you now like this, dont use the race hammer! My opinion!

[cntrydawwwg]

From what i understand, safety will work in up positionat at all modes but does not say, do  not!

   It absolutely does say Do Not.

Per the CGW site. ......

?DO NOT cycle the action in DA with the hammer down and the manual safety in the "up" position.  The manual safety was never designed to be applied "up" with the hammer down, whether using OEM parts or CGW parts.  The manual safety is only designed to be used with the hammer at full cock.  If 1, 2, & 3 listed above are unacceptable, then do not purchase this hammer kit.?

    What they?re saying is the safety is only meant to be used at full cock position. Ergo, just because it can be flipped up at hammer down or half cock....... Don?t do it. [emoji6]

[dannyvi]

Thanks! Your probably right! Problem i find the 3 acceptqble ro what i want to use the safety! I dont know, i hope I'm not confused with age, lol ! We'll see. Really appreciate yours and all tne input!

[schmeky]

I don't see how something so simple can be so misconstrued.

Safety should only be applied at full cock in SA. 

[dannyvi]

Thats all i wanted to hear! Guess I'll just stay with the OEM hammer for now. Thanks, Schmesky!

[Earl Keese]

Why would anyone want to apply the safety hammer down?

[M1A4ME]

If you don't want to carry it cocked and locked, get a BD.

Carrying a SAO gun with the hammer down is a recipe for getting hurt bad, or worse.

[Earl Keese]

Why would anyone want to apply the safety hammer down?

Perhaps someone who is familiar with, and/or prefers, the Beretta M9/92FS style of carry?

If you don't want to carry it cocked and locked, get a BD.

Carrying a SAO gun with the hammer down is a recipe for getting hurt bad, or worse.

No argument there. But I think the question is more about carrying a DA/SA gun in DA mode with a safety engaged (e.g. similar to a Beretta M9/92FS).

Beretta or not, I still don't see the purpose. That's like a clutch pedal for an automatic transmission.

[Earl Keese]

Why would anyone want to apply the safety hammer down?

Perhaps someone who is familiar with, and/or prefers, the Beretta M9/92FS style of carry?

If you don't want to carry it cocked and locked, get a BD.

Carrying a SAO gun with the hammer down is a recipe for getting hurt bad, or worse.

No argument there. But I think the question is more about carrying a DA/SA gun in DA mode with a safety engaged (e.g. similar to a Beretta M9/92FS).

Beretta or not, I still don't see the purpose. That's like a clutch pedal for an automatic transmission.

Personally I agree with you. But for decades this was the manner of carry for the US military and multiple LE agencies.

Gotcha.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

[dannyvi]

Simply put, all  i wanted to stress was i usually carried an HK P30SK that had both decocker and safety. I carried it at halfcock with the safety on chamber  loaded. To use, i would simply push safety off and ready to fire  . I had hope ut would be the same in same case as i thought the race hammer disabled the double action pull with the safety up. I will stay with more knowledgeable decisions not to!

[dannyvi]

So sorry it has to end this way! Thanks for coming in my behalf. I suppose the only way to find out is actually doing it but cant afford something going wrong. Personally, i see no reason not to carry it this way. For some improvements associated with the race hammer it works just like the OEM hammer except for the 1,2 and 3 stated by CGW. I do think it us a worthwhile addition.

[armoredman]

Guys, the safety works the way the safety works, regardless of aftermarket addons - the basic design is still pretty much the same, as much as I know, hard to change a whole lot without massiver rengineering. if it doesn't work the way you want it to, don't use it that way or change parts until it works how you want it. As for why anyone would carry hammer down safety on, that would be the same crowd who wear belts and suspenders - just in case. I personally wouldn't, I carry at half cock, and use decockers on my hammer guns.
On the other hand, it is interesting when hammer types that go hammer down with safety on freak out at a striker fired pistol with only the safety dingus on the trigger. Keep them away from revolvers....

[M1A4ME]

I could be wrong here, but this is my take/understanding.

The left had safety shaft has a cam lobe on it that rotates downward/forward to fire and upward/rearward to stop the pistol from firing when in the safe position.

What the cam lobe does is rotate (when put on safe) under the forward arm on the sear to keep the sear from moving.  Sear doesn't move?  Hammer won't drop/fire the round in the chamber.  The trigger bar moves the sear to fire the hammer, the trigger moves the hammer bar.

The safety cam to sear arm fit is crucial.  If it's not right, the pistol can be unsafe.  That's one reason why CGW sells that adustable sear with their race hammer - unless you want to do a lot of fitting/filing/stoning/polishing on that cam on the safety shaft (like I did on my first hammer replacement job.

If the safety will rotate into the "safe" position with the hammer not at full cock that's telling you the combination of parts are not operating as CZ designed the CZ75 (or another CZ pistol) to operate.  The clearance between the cam and the arm on the sear is greater than it should be.  It's a geometry thing.

If you pull the trigger, when the safety is in the safe position and the hammer is in a position other than full cock, you have a gap between the cam and the sear arm that allows some movement (movement equals some inertia as well) that is suddenly stopped when the sear arm moves downward enough to finally contact the safety cam.  And the rear of the sear is moving up/forwards some amount as well.  That reduces the contact area between the sear and hammer and may put more force/stress on a small portion (that critical corner that releases the hammer) of the sear with no release possible.  If doing it during a stressful situation you may be putting a lot of force on that small part of the sear surface trying to get that hammer to cock/fall/fire the pistol.

When people with a lot of experience (whether from designing/building a device or just from working on a lot of devices) recommend not trying to do something that piece of equipment wasn't designed to do there is a good reason for it. 

Just my take on this thing.  Sear to hammer full cock notch fitment is key.  If I buy an aftermarket hammer I'm buying the adjustable sear, too.  The internal fit/condition of my self defense handgun is important to me.

Oh, I'm a cocked and locked guy.  It's a 1911 thing that the CZ (happily) fits right in with for me.

[Earl Keese]

I struggle to see why this discussion comes up periodically and then goes on and on. The safety doesn't work with the OEM hammer down, and shouldn't be used with with an aftermarket hammer down. I understand Schmeky's frustration. Now I know why CZ made a striker fired gun.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

[cntrydawwwg]

I had hope ut would be the same in same case as i thought the race hammer disabled the double action pull with the safety up.

Which is an excellent question that schmeky (CGW) never answered.

So I PM'd him on your behalf.

   Quite frankly, since you PM?d him, keep it as a personal message. It is neither right, nor fair of you to quote snippets of a PM, on the open forum. There?s no way for us to know for sure what was asked, and what exactly was answered.

    Maybe the question wasn?t answered in the EXACT wording you wanted, but it?s been answered many times.

Not everything in life has to have exact wording. There has to be a point where people go back to using their brain to infer what something means.

 ?Only use safety at full cock?, ?Do Not pull DA thru the safety?

IE:: Don?t do it. The safety may or may not hold. The firearm may or may not fire. Parts may or may not break. It?s not safe.

     ?The firearm is designed to  use safety at full cock whether with OEM or aftermarket parts. ?

IE::: Don?t Do It. The safety may or may or hold. The firearm may or may not fire. Parts may or may not break. It?s not safe.

 Sheesh, this is why we have warning labels on plastic bags saying ?Do Not place over head. Death may occur.?