Missouri Bullet (MBC) 135gr IDP#8 Hi-Tek Coated bullet test

[viking499]

Why do you think the Winchester components made a difference?

[Wobbly]

Why do you think the Winchester components made a difference?

Winchester is nothing more than a marketing company, which means it's run by accountants. They buy whatever they can and arrange to have the "Winchester" logo placed on it. (This is why W231 costs more than HP-38.) So when it comes to brass, you had better believe that they are scouring the world to contract with the cheapest maker. And although their primers are only made by Olin, they are probably pushing them cut every corner in order to save a nickel on every 50,000 pieces.

So while I have tons of "Win" brass, it covers 2 decades and possibly 4 to 5 contracts. So there could be huge variations in internal volume, even within a lot of 10 individual pieces.

So I've simply stopped using anything Winchester for testing. It's good enough for competition, but in a test where you want to see low SD numbers to confirm your process, I'm simply not convinced their particular variations are small enough considering the time (hours) it takes to build a set of test cartridges. In other words, the risk is too high considering the immense labor content.

 

[IDescribe]

I?ve found how shiny the bullet is to have a noticeable impact on SD.  Coated is generally better than jacketed, and jacketed tend to be a bit better than the super shiny plated.  So one thing I?d consider is whether or not the fact you?ve been loading a lot of MBC coated bullets is contributing to your lower SD numbers.  I have also found the angle of the sun to affect SD, and I would wonder if the time of year is playing a role, as well.

Just two more factors to consider. 

I can?t speak to Winchester brass, but I use Winchester primers a lot (my preference, really), and my SD numbers are typically great once I get into the middle of the charge window and higher.  I expect 5-7, and rarely do I not get that. 

[Wobbly]

I have been using the Bear Creek Supply 135gr LRN coated. It is slightly longer than the MBC 135gr LRN (0.628" V 0.622"). Bear creek supply recommend seating it at 1.110" , a recommendation I have been following. Using HP38, I ran a ladder from 3.0gr to 3.6gr. The 3.0gr didn't cycle well. Knowing that it is seated deeper and slightly longer do you think I could try a higher load?

Yes, even without a chrono. If you've got stock springs, then you should be throwing brass 4-6 ft. As my test shows, the load range for W231 (aka "HP-38") is over 1.0gr. If you're testing down at 3.0gr, then I would work up in 0.2gr increments until 3.6gr. As we all know, powder burns more efficiently as pressure builds, so at 3.6gr I'd begin using 0.1gr increments.

Using this, you could possibly go as high as 4.0gr, but I bet your best loads are going to be around 3.7 or 3.8gr. You can "read" the primers if you want, but personally I'd put more stock in the interior color of the cases and ejection distance. When 231 is burning "right" it's going to burn light gray and the cases are going to loose their blackness on the case mouth exterior.



In the case of 231, what's good for the powder is also good for the gun.


Hope this helps.

[Long Branch Setter]

Never loaded the 135gr in a 9mm but have fired thousands in 38 super. My standard load for 9mm is the 124 gr MBC coated bullet w/ 4 gr of Bullseye. A friend was getting out of reloading and gave me 8 lbs of old Bullseye, no idea how old it is but the powder is loose in a big cardboard “can”. It’s a bit dirty but still goes bang every time.......using 4 gr a round 8 lbs goes a long way.

LBS

[Gnnut2]

Great thread guys. Sort of reminds me of a family reunion talking about old times, Elvis songs, and guns. Seriously, this thread was filled with good information exchanged by folks from different walks of life and different perspectives on things, but each share a love for firearms and shooting.The respect exhibited here should be packaged in a textbook for Political Science 101. This forum is the best!