Author Topic: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?  (Read 2264 times)

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Offline M1A4ME

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2018, 07:45:56 AM »
I don't have one with that rear sight.  But, it looks like a FAL type windage adjustment set up. 

On a FAL, if you need to move the rear sight to the left, you loosen/turn the left side screw slightly.  Then you tighten down the right side screw.  It will move the rear sight to the left as it tightens and then lock it in place (against the left screw) once tightened/torqued (won't take a lot of torque, it's a screw not a bolt).

Do the opposite to move the rear sight to the right.

As far as opening up the right side of the frame goes, once it's done you won't be able to see it.  The hole is still smaller in diameter than the width of the slide stop, so you won't see the hole.  A referee/judge, whatever they call them, would have to be suspicious, know the frame hole diameter of the old Pre B models and then measure the hole.  Like the internal mag. well mod. to allow the use of modern magazines, you'll never see it with the right side slide stop in place.

Wait, I may have numbers from my project.  Darn.  I didn't record the frame hole diameter on the right side for the slide stop.  I did measure and record the right side slide stop OD from my Pre B CZ85.  It was 0.2275" according to my calipers.  The OD of the modern right side slide stop is 0.2500".  Not much difference, just enough to make the modern piece more robust.
I stopped carrying the SIG 556R.  SIG changed models and couple/three times and stopped supporting it with parts.  So, I stopped supporting SIG.  Back to the tried/true AR15 Carbine.

Offline zhuk

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2018, 10:44:43 PM »
Interesting, thanks for the info. An FAL-style sight, huh? My best mate (who still keenly feels the loss of his L1A1 service rifle, being unable to own an SLR as a civvie) will be amused to hear that!

Re the right slide stop - taking on board your comments and measurements, plus reading how some pre-B frames haven't faired too well long-term with the drilling out process...would it be possible to just add a bushing and do without the lever altogether? To be honest, even though the M&P is fully ambi, I do tend to drop the slide with my trigger finger on the left lever in any case.

Also got back to the shop today, the one mag the gun comes with drops free, so that augers well. It'll be about 3 weeks until they get the motherlode of 75/85 mags in so that would be the final check...if it's a transitional model as you point out, could be lucky if they all fit/drop OK. Possibly being 10 rounders that might help.




« Last Edit: November 22, 2018, 11:50:08 PM by zhuk »

Offline M1A4ME

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2018, 06:17:41 AM »
Good luck with the magazines.

I have hear of people making/installing bushings (some people don't like the right side slide release or the right side safety).  I've even read some people will grind off the protruding part of the slide release shaft on the right side so it doesn't stick out past the side of the frame.
I stopped carrying the SIG 556R.  SIG changed models and couple/three times and stopped supporting it with parts.  So, I stopped supporting SIG.  Back to the tried/true AR15 Carbine.

Offline zhuk

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2018, 09:45:24 AM »
Cheers mate. It may or (possibly not) sell before the mag question is resolved but will wait and see.

So there would be nothing detrimental to takedown in grinding down the protruding lever? Hmmmmm!


I also quite like this mod lol

Quote
Update, so I basically bought a SS CZ75B and shelved my (Pre B) CZ85,
After retiring now have time in my life to address the issue and get the CZ85 back up and running.

Just disassembled both guns and compared slide stops, besides the 85 stop being longer the pins are the same diameter...
Only the right side frame hole on the (Pre B) CZ85 is larger and that is the dilemma ...

When I called CZ they said it involved drilling the left side frame hole but that would require using a slide stop with a larger pin,
Checked CZ's website but could find no such animal ...

After noticing that a .22lr casing is the exact diameter needed inside and out made a bushing in about an hour,
Inserted a fired .22lr case into frame with the primer side facing out and pushed all the way flush with the frame, Next just trimmed it to length inside the frame with a Dremel tool,  drilled the hole from the right side then sanded the face smooth...After that pushed it out and cut the spring groove,

VIOLA the CZ85 is up and running again !

https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=77899.msg666197#msg666197

Offline M1A4ME

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2018, 10:35:39 AM »
That does sound like a neat/quick and cheap fix.

But, it might make it harder to get the left side slide stop out.

The way the frame is made on the right side there are two sections with a slot (for the spring that holds the slide stop in place) in the middle.  The internal section of frame is wider than the external section and does not need to be drilled completely through to allow the use of the modern slide lock lever.

And, there is not difference in the left side slide safety stops - it's the right side that was modified to have a larger outside diameter to increase the wall thickness and strength the part.

I didn't say anything earlier about the frame cracking from being drilled (I'm not a gunsmith/gun designer) resulting in cracking of the frame.  The part you drill through to allow the use of the modern right side slide stop is not very thick anyway and the internal section soaks up a lot of the "shock/stress" the barrel lug imparts to the slide lock.

Picture of the CZ 75 Compact I modified for CZ85 controls.  On the right side you can see the divided section of the frame.  It has a cut in it to allow the retaining spring to sit down in the cut/groove and fit into the slot in the right side slide release and the groove in the left side slide release shaft.  That right side slide release is not so wide (the hollow section that slides over the left side slide release shaft) that it requires drilling of that internal frame section completely through, maybe a small amount???  I don't remember for sure, that project was a couple years ago.  The fact that a CZ85 will function normally without the right side slide release lever tells me (someone else may disagree) that the left side slide release shaft is full supported by that thicker internal section of the frame.  To paraphrase that old Teddy Roosevelt saying - The stress stops here (that internal section of frame).



If I were going to use a piece of .22 brass for a bushing, I'd cut the rim off (so the left side slider release shaft could still stick through the bushing/frame enough to be able to push it out/loose with a magazine floorplate (all mine have plastic bases on them so there's no chance of scratching the new finish).  You could still cut the slot in the case wall so the retaining spring could hold the bushing and the left side slide release in place and cut the bushing down so it was flush with the outside of the frame.  The retaining spring would still hold it in place when the left side slide release was removed.

No matter which route you go, good luck with it.  While my old Pre B CZ85 is not the most accurate CZ I have (several shoot better groups) it has the most history with it (even if it looks bright and shiny now) and I will someday pass it on to one of my sons.  It isn't a collector item (replaced parts and refinish) but it's a good shooter.  And stout as hell.

Stout?  You ask?  How many times have you seen those pictures on the internet of destroyed plastic/polymer framed pistols when a case head gives way from high pressure/weak brass?  I've seen several.  Let me share a picture of my CZ85 after a case/rim completely blew off the walls of the case.  The rim ejected and fell on the table, the next round failed to chamber, I tipped the pistol over, racked the slide back to clear the jammed round and it fell on the table.  When I let the slide go the next round also failed to chamber.  That's when I stopped to see (closer look) what was going on.  I had to take the barrel out to get my fingernails on the case wall edge sticking out of the chamber to pull it out.  The top rounds in the magazine and the feed ramp on the barrel, breechface on the slide were really black/dirty.  I put the pistol back together and went on shooting it.  No visible damage, to the CZ85.  Built like a tank.






I stopped carrying the SIG 556R.  SIG changed models and couple/three times and stopped supporting it with parts.  So, I stopped supporting SIG.  Back to the tried/true AR15 Carbine.

Offline bang bang

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2018, 07:58:22 PM »
that funky dogleg slide stop is not OEM.

Its off a tangfoglio, TA90 type

if you got it, i would give CZ a call and let them know about its issues.  they maybe able to fix it for you.

the early 85s had a thinner right side slide stop and they were prone to breakage.  my first 85 did so and they just reamed it out for the newer larger unit. 

to me i wouldnt micky mouse it unless that the last option, but its your toy.

Offline zhuk

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Re: Is this 85 missing the slide stop?
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2018, 08:30:40 PM »
M14ME, mate thanks a lot for the detailed info and going to the trouble of dragging up the pics for me, I really appreciate it. And that is NUTS how your gun held up!  :o Certainly speaks volumes for Czech workmanship!

Right...there's been a bit of a development heh

I've been in touch with CZ's official importer here (also a personal friend & fellow IPSC shooter) and he's advised it's just not worth it altogether, alas. He thinks the front is staked and the rear sight would need to be replaced...think 110% added prices compared to what you guys pay in the US (which is the case for anything gun related here) If the ejector or other parts break he said "we don?t and can?t get any" so I'm afraid its kinda a lost cause unfortunately  :(

So it seems I'll just sit on the man stash lol and maybe one of these days a Combat might show up somewhere...I know they were a limited edition in any case and the likelihood of any more than a handful making it out here would be slight - we are such a tiny market (of the 5% of adults who have firearm licenses here, about 98% of those are for longarms) And as an illustration, I was waiting 18 months for an HS2000 - XD to you - from Croatia, but twice Australia's entire shipment of 50 guns was postponed as Springfield USA had ordered 50,000 Lol

Gives you some idea....but still you never know, huh!

In the meantime, looks like I won't be deserting the M&P and the Tupperware Nation any time soon...sorry to have to be the bearer of bad news. All you guys have been brilliant contributing to this thread with so much info and time just to help a rank newbie from the other side of the world. Hell I would buy you all a few rounds of (aussie-strength lol) beers if only I could  ;D

Who knows, I may get lucky and be back here...with such a great forum, it would be an honour if I could.

Cheers everyone, and many thanks again  :)
« Last Edit: November 23, 2018, 08:57:30 PM by zhuk »

 

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