Author Topic: Why safeties on the Shadow 2  (Read 782 times)

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Offline oakengineer

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Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« on: January 05, 2019, 10:52:26 PM »
This has been bugging me for a while.  The Shadow 2 was built from the ground up as a USPSA/IDPA production gun.  So why didn't CZ put a decocker on it instead of safeties?  Clearly they recognized the safeties weren't very useful by putting the super slim safeties on it.  Why not just put a decocker on it instead?  Would it somehow ruin the trigger pull?
 Or put it in a different division?  I can't think of a reason that would be the case.

Manually dropping the hammer is certainly an operation that can be done safety.  But it is still more trouble than using a decocker.  That is part of the reason I'm now shooting a P226 Legion instead.

Offline aandabooks

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2019, 10:58:55 PM »
Limited Minor with the hammer back and safety on.  3-gun in the same condition.  You can always buy a wider safety to compete in these other divisions but if CZ builds the gun as a decocker there is no option there. 

Offline Varooom

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2019, 08:29:47 AM »
Interesting oakengineer,

Just ordered a Shadow 2 yesterday.

I have a 226 Legion but did not consider that a good weapon for production.

Now that I think about it my 226 would probably be great for production except mine is a SAO.

Still might try it.

Thanks for opening my eyes to something right in front of me!

Happy shooting,

Varooom

Offline oakengineer

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2019, 09:03:56 AM »
Limited Minor with the hammer back and safety on.  3-gun in the same condition.  You can always buy a wider safety to compete in these other divisions but if CZ builds the gun as a decocker there is no option there.

I know you can shoot it in limited minor, but in practice does anyone actually do that?  I figured the TS Orange in either 9mm or in .40 would be the better choice for Limited.

Offline oakengineer

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2019, 09:09:31 AM »
Interesting oakengineer,

Just ordered a Shadow 2 yesterday.

I have a 226 Legion but did not consider that a good weapon for production.

Now that I think about it my 226 would probably be great for production except mine is a SAO.

Still might try it.

Thanks for opening my eyes to something right in front of me!

Happy shooting,

Varooom

As a range gun the SAO probably makes more sense.  If there were no other factors at play I would have picked the SAO one.  They will probably hold their value better.  But I already have some nice SAO P226s, and I wanted to be able to shoot my Legion in Production, so I bought the SA/DA.

To comment on Legion vs. Shadow 2, the Shadow 2 is probably the more competitive choice.  They both have very nice triggers, but the Shadow 2 weighs more and has a lower slide, so it should recoil less.

Offline 2morechains

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2019, 11:17:20 AM »
I never used the safeties on my SP-01 Shadow or 75 Shadow, in fact I installed detent springs from DSperman to prevent the safety from being inadvertently flicked on.  Either the hammer is down or I’m shooting. Manually dropping the hammer is pretty easy and doing the thumb roll becomes second nature after a bit of practice.   

Offline Stuart

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2019, 12:31:09 PM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.
stuart@czcustom.com
czcustom.com

Offline scroadkill

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2019, 02:07:31 PM »
imo a shadow 2 with a sao trigger and wide LHS would be the best starter uspsa pistol - in limited minor. holds lots of bullets. always goes bang. good and heavy. inexpensive mags. great sight radius. honestly with a sao conversion it would be very very similar to a tso 9mm and probably better than a tso for a new shooter. 

Offline aandabooks

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2019, 05:16:34 PM »
Limited Minor with the hammer back and safety on.  3-gun in the same condition.  You can always buy a wider safety to compete in these other divisions but if CZ builds the gun as a decocker there is no option there.

I know you can shoot it in limited minor, but in practice does anyone actually do that?  I figured the TS Orange in either 9mm or in .40 would be the better choice for Limited.

We have a couple guys that shoot Limited Minor with essentially a production gun.  Either because they don't care about the point loss or just want to load up the mags.  If CZ doesn't put the safeties on the S2 then it is not an option.  The TS/TSO would be a better choice but that gun doesn't fit into Production at all. 

Offline coolbox

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2019, 05:47:54 AM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.
^^^This. The trigger on SA/DA without fpb is easier to tune, and has a shorter rest.
Life is too short to waste on a bad trigger pull

Offline Raining_Brass

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2019, 03:14:54 PM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.
^^^This. The trigger on SA/DA without fpb is easier to tune, and has a shorter rest.

Even though literally no competition shooter actually shoots off the rest anyway, but....
Every single competition shooter I've ever talked to has told me they couldn't care less about how short a gun's reset is. When you're shooting for speed, you never feel it anyway.

Offline oakengineer

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2019, 08:48:13 AM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.

That was basically my question.

I think Greyguns and CGW clearly have found a way to make trigger pull nice despite a firing pin block.  So I'm sure its possible.  Maybe just harder.

Offline Raining_Brass

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2019, 10:07:07 AM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.

That was basically my question.

I think Greyguns and CGW clearly have found a way to make trigger pull nice despite a firing pin block.  So I'm sure its possible.  Maybe just harder.
Trigger can be made 100% equally as nice on a FPB gun vs non FPB gun. Only difference is the non FPB gun will have a little nicer reset. With CGW short reset kit in a FPB gun, the non FPB reset is marginally better.

Offline zhuk

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2019, 03:41:16 AM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.
^^^This. The trigger on SA/DA without fpb is easier to tune, and has a shorter rest.

Even though literally no competition shooter actually shoots off the rest anyway, but....
Every single competition shooter I've ever talked to has told me they couldn't care less about how short a gun's reset is. When you're shooting for speed, you never feel it anyway.

Well no you don't really when you're in the thick of things, that is true. But you've obviously never shot a gun in competition with an 11.49mm reset like my M&P lol

Offline Raining_Brass

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Re: Why safeties on the Shadow 2
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2019, 08:44:25 AM »
To do a decocker CZ would put a firing pin block in the mechanism.
Something they would not do on a competition series gun.
^^^This. The trigger on SA/DA without fpb is easier to tune, and has a shorter rest.

Even though literally no competition shooter actually shoots off the rest anyway, but....
Every single competition shooter I've ever talked to has told me they couldn't care less about how short a gun's reset is. When you're shooting for speed, you never feel it anyway.

Well no you don't really when you're in the thick of things, that is true. But you've obviously never shot a gun in competition with an 11.49mm reset like my M&P lol
Lol, no I totally understand that an overbearing, long reset is definitely ridiculous, but when you start comparing differences like a Pro Kit SP-01 vs a Pro Kit SP-01 Shadow, you're talking super marginal differences in resets.