Roll pins on P10F (OR) are incredibly tight

[Rex Kramer]

Hey all, dumb question.  I have a P10F and while trying to get the roll pins out to put in a Theta trigger I noticed they are ridiculously tight. Getting the front one out took a lot of effort. The front one in the sear housing wasn't as bad, but I can't get the last one to budge at all. I'm using the proper sized roll pin punches and a weight hammer.  Anything else I can do to try to get this out without getting out a sledge hammer and screwing up the frame?


Thanks

[Wobbly]

The anvil you use makes a HUGE difference.

Not having a hunk of nylon, I drilled a 1/4" hole in a short length of pine 2x4. The pine is soft, but not soft enough to leave zero marks, so I covered the pine with several layers of denim cloth.

Then I set the block on my workbench OVER one of the table legs. (You don't want any bouncing.) Then located the single roll pin to be taken out over the hole in the block.

Put something 100% solid under the body of the pistol and you'll be rewarded with pin movement. Don't try to get the pin out in a single blow. If it moves 1/4", then you're doing just fine. Accurately placed "love taps" are highly preferential to a single crushing blow. Follow the HBI video.

Hope this helps. 

[Rex Kramer]

Thanks yeah it does. Just needed to be a little more forceful with it.

I did swap the two pins around and they were considerably easier to work with than in the original conurbation.

[Wobbly]

Glad it worked out.

[Dj1001]

My p10s was the same way. I had to hit it uncomfortably hard with a 20oz hammer to get any movement out of them.

Im guessing this is going to be common with the made in USA parts.

[Wobbly]

My p10s was the same way. I had to hit it uncomfortably hard with a 20oz hammer to get any movement out of them.

The factory is using tooling to support and align the receiver during this operation. Also, they most likely use a press, not a hammer, to minimize scratches and scaring.

Maybe the roll pins have an initial lubricant that evaporates after 6 months, or maybe the salt from the assembler's fingers causes micro-corrosion that locks the roll pin into place. Or maybe firing the gun causes the roll pin to un-roll and become tighter in the hole. Lots of strange things you never imagined happen at that level.

Im guessing this is going to be common with the made in USA parts.

I'm not fully understanding this statement.

Precision parts, from drawings with Geometric Tolerancing, can be produced almost any where in the world these days. And the parts will be fully interchangeable. The USA has invented thousands of production aids and processes over the last 200 years. (Eli Whitney [inventor of the Cotton Gin] worked on interchangeable gun parts for the US Government in the early 1800's.) Slowly these inventions and processes have been exported to places all over the globe in the search for cheaper labor rates. That's where you get these stickers "Assembled in Mexico from parts Made in the USA".

But these 3rd world countries are simply mimicing what the US, Japan, China, and western European countries are exporting. The cutting edge of invention and production still lies in those countries named above... if you want to pay for it. And that's mainly because of those country's advanced education systems.

I will also say this... Gun making ain't what it used to be. When you bought a Royal Enfield motorcycle in the 1950's their moto was "Made Like a Gun" touting extremely well-made, close fitting parts. Today, fits of +/-0.003" are laughable. The average cell phone has tolerances and fits 1/3 of that !

What is hurting the USA now is that so much manufacturing has left, that young people are no longer fully versed in (low or high tech) manufacturing. And I suspect that is the root source of the statement.

[Earl Keese]

The roll pins in my Czech made P10C had a tendency to walk. Tighter is better.

[Czechmark]

My p10s was the same way. I had to hit it uncomfortably hard with a 20oz hammer to get any movement out of them.

Im guessing this is going to be common with the made in USA parts.

Ditto with my P10 C OR. . . .

[Dj1001]

My p10s was the same way. I had to hit it uncomfortably hard with a 20oz hammer to get any movement out of them.

The factory is using tooling to support and align the receiver during this operation. Also, they most likely use a press, not a hammer, to minimize scratches and scaring.

Maybe the roll pins have an initial lubricant that evaporates after 6 months, or maybe the salt from the assembler's fingers causes micro-corrosion that locks the roll pin into place. Or maybe firing the gun causes the roll pin to un-roll and become tighter in the hole. Lots of strange things you never imagined happen at that level.

Im guessing this is going to be common with the made in USA parts.

I'm not fully understanding this statement.

Precision parts, from drawings with Geometric Tolerancing, can be produced almost any where in the world these days. And the parts will be fully interchangeable. The USA has invented thousands of production aids and processes over the last 200 years. (Eli Whitney [inventor of the Cotton Gin] worked on interchangeable gun parts for the US Government in the early 1800's.) Slowly these inventions and processes have been exported to places all over the globe in the search for cheaper labor rates. That's where you get these stickers "Assembled in Mexico from parts Made in the USA".

But these 3rd world countries are simply mimicing what the US, Japan, China, and western European countries are exporting. The cutting edge of invention and production still lies in those countries named above... if you want to pay for it. And that's mainly because of those country's advanced education systems.

I will also say this... Gun making ain't what it used to be. When you bought a Royal Enfield motorcycle in the 1950's their moto was "Made Like a Gun" touting extremely well-made, close fitting parts. Today, fits of +/-0.003" are laughable. The average cell phone has tolerances and fits 1/3 of that !

What is hurting the USA now is that so much manufacturing has left, that young people are no longer fully versed in (low or high tech) manufacturing. And I suspect that is the root source of the statement.

I think you are massively overthinking this whole situation. I wasn't suggesting the USA had any better or worse manufacturing abilities.

I think it's a pretty sound assumption that CZ-USA decided to fit the roll pins a little tighter in the USA produced guns due to some issues with pins walking out on the Czech made P10 guns.
Or it's just different tooling and it happens to be a bit tighter.

Regardless, me and the OP had very similar experiences with our USA made p10 guns. Those experiences differ from the Czech guns. It's a safe bet that in the future a person looking to disassemble a USA made P10 should be prepared to deal with very tight fitting pins.

[Wobbly]

I think you are massively overthinking this whole situation.

Well, I've been accused of that before ! 

Now I see your point. Well made.