Thinking about a Bren 2 MS SBR but a little worried.

[Matt85]

I like the idea of building a 5.56 Bren 2 MS 14" SBR but after looking at a variety of reviews I've found myself a bit concerned.

1. I've seen repeated reports of butt plates being very loose. I know this to be a common problem with the adapter that comes with the pistol but is this also a problem with the folding stocks?

2. Stocks seem pretty darn rare and there appear to be two types of stock. One stock with an adjustable cheek riser and that only allows LOP to be adjusted. Will both of these stocks fit the 14" pistol?

thank you
-Matt

[scotheocelot]

I like the idea of building a 5.56 Bren 2 MS 14" SBR but after looking at a variety of reviews I've found myself a bit concerned.

1. I've seen repeated reports of butt plates being very loose. I know this to be a common problem with the adapter that comes with the pistol but is this also a problem with the folding stocks?

2. Stocks seem pretty darn rare and there appear to be two types of stock. One stock with an adjustable cheek riser and that only allows LOP to be adjusted. Will both of these stocks fit the 14" pistol?

thank you
-Matt

1) Dan Haga offers a “shim kit” to remove the but plate wobble (when using the factory butt plate). OR you can go with either one of his stock adapters or the CZ stock. My experience with one of his adapters is zero wobble. I’ve heard similar of the CZ Bren stock. Long lead times for those but people are getting them.

2) Both fit. You just have to decide if the want the SBR stock of the Carbine stock.

I wouldn’t hesitate. I love my Bren 2MS.


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[czkyle1776]

I like the idea of building a 5.56 Bren 2 MS 14" SBR but after looking at a variety of reviews I've found myself a bit concerned.

1. I've seen repeated reports of butt plates being very loose. I know this to be a common problem with the adapter that comes with the pistol but is this also a problem with the folding stocks?

2. Stocks seem pretty darn rare and there appear to be two types of stock. One stock with an adjustable cheek riser and that only allows LOP to be adjusted. Will both of these stocks fit the 14" pistol?

thank you
-Matt

1) Dan Haga offers a “shim kit” to remove the but plate wobble (when using the factory butt plate). OR you can go with either one of his stock adapters or the CZ stock. My experience with one of his adapters is zero wobble. I’ve heard similar of the CZ Bren stock. Long lead times for those but people are getting them.

2) Both fit. You just have to decide if the want the SBR stock of the Carbine stock.

I wouldn’t hesitate. I love my Bren 2MS.


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I really hate that you have to shim the rear plate to eliminate wobble. That's just janky on a gun that is $1600+. My 805 is rock solid and nothing wobbles on it. I feel the bren 2 was rushed to market and some things were poorly executed. See: 7.62x39 issues, rear adapter wobble, no spare parts, and breaking rear adapters. I still have two though...

[Aries144]

The factory folding stocks have zero wobble. It's just the buffer tube adapter.

The stock you see on the 7.62x51 version of the Bren 2 (the newer, non waffle pattern one) does look like you can swap out the cheek comb, but it is not adjustable. It uses a different shape for the shaft from the butt that goes into the main part of the stock for adjusting length of pull. The shaft has a triangular cross section that appears to allow less wobble if the stock is fully extended.

[scotheocelot]

The factory folding stocks have zero wobble. It's just the buffer tube adapter.

^^Spot on.  The buffer tube adapter was simply not machined correctly but I can forgive CS because it was intended to run their stock. The Bren 2MS was not rushed to market IMO. The military platform had seen various design changes before the MS was released to the Civ market. CZ has simply dropped the ball with supporting replacement parts. I have not experienced a single issue with my 5.56 version. And with the addition of HBIndustries drilled gas port for Suppressor use, its is a DREAM to shoot suppressed. Zero gas to the user. The platform is hands down my favorite as is. When Haga Designs releases their Forged lower for the Bren 2 that accepts AR lower parts kit, I will need a small loan to cover the ammo I’ll run through [emoji23].

I will give you the point about CZ replacement parts like bolts, firing pin and other small but essential items to keep the platform operating. I think they didn’t anticipate the popularity from civilian side, coupled with overextending their military contracts and a worldwide pandemic crushed their support stream. Perhaps we are being a little harsh on CZ. I’m sure with the Stoner AR platform hit the market, you couldn’t easily acquire all the parts within the first year or two.  Maybe someone older and wiser could verify.


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[czkyle1776]

The factory folding stocks have zero wobble. It's just the buffer tube adapter.

^^Spot on.  The buffer tube adapter was simply not machined correctly but I can forgive CS because it was intended to run their stock. The Bren 2MS was not rushed to market IMO. The military platform had seen various design changes before the MS was released to the Civ market. CZ has simply dropped the ball with supporting replacement parts. I have not experienced a single issue with my 5.56 version. And with the addition of HBIndustries drilled gas port for Suppressor use, its is a DREAM to shoot suppressed. Zero gas to the user. The platform is hands down my favorite as is. When Haga Designs releases their Forged lower for the Bren 2 that accepts AR lower parts kit, I will need a small loan to cover the ammo I’ll run through [emoji23].

I will give you the point about CZ replacement parts like bolts, firing pin and other small but essential items to keep the platform operating. I think they didn’t anticipate the popularity from civilian side, coupled with overextending their military contracts and a worldwide pandemic crushed their support stream. Perhaps we are being a little harsh on CZ. I’m sure with the Stoner AR platform hit the market, you couldn’t easily acquire all the parts within the first year or two.  Maybe someone older and wiser could verify.


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Fair enough. I only have pistols so I'll take your word on the stock being better. Like I said, I do have two of them, so I do believe in the platform and am willing to pay for it. Just frustrated as a consumer. The fact that I can't get anything for my 805 biases me to the Bren 2. I'll give CZ the benefit of the doubt that they won't ghost the Bren 2 like they did the 805, but I remain cautiously skeptical. I mean, what's it been now? 2 years? Going on 3 even? I'm not a manufacturing guru, but surely that length of time is sufficient to scale production to meet demand for a company as established as CZ....even taking the pandemic into account.

At a certain point my faith and loyalty are going to melt away. CZ guns are awesome, don't get me wrong....but when you have a critical part that breaks...it doesn't matter how awesome the gun is if you can't fix it. It becomes a $1600 amalgamation of plastic and metal that doesn't have a function. Hopefully the acquisition of Colt will only help things and not overextend them even more...

When you say the buffer tube wasn't machined correctly. Are you suggesting that it's not to actual spec and may be batch dependent? I thought it was pervasive across all bren 2s. Has this been rectified recently to your knowledge that tells you it was out of spec? If that's the case, I should be able to have it replaced under warranty. If it's not supposed to wobble, as you suggest, then it was a fairly obvious HUGE qc problem that managed to slip by if it affected so many guns that DH created a product to address it.

[Barn Owl Lover]

One problem is that CZ have massive orders for the Bren 2 from the Czech Army amid the pandemic.  Just before the SHTF with Covid, the Czech Army signed a contract with CZ for over 35,000 firearms, of which over 16,000 are Bren 2s, 21K are P-10s and 1600 805 G1 40mm grenade launchers.  That contract is worth over $111 million USD.  On top of that, I don't know if the Hungarians are building their own Bren 2s, P-09s or Scorpion Evos yet (they supposed to build them eventually under license, but initially were supplied by CZ as knock down kits).  And I'm sure that the Bren 2 will be looked at by other countries and will compete against the likes of the FN SCAR, HK416 and 433, and other newer modular service rifles to replace aging weapons.

This compares to issues that HK are having in Europe, where new MR308 rifles are hard to come by and new MR223s are basically non existent.  That's due to HK filling a huge order for 416s from France (over 93,000 rifles), various LE and other armed forces contracts (including an ongoing Norwegian Army contract), and will likely win the German Army rifle tender to replace the G36.  Even if that gets ditched, HK will likely upgrade G36s, and that'll probably occupy them for a while.  Not to mention that the 433 is going to be offered for sale this summer as a replacement for the G36 for export.

It's kinda like the supply and demand for computer components and raw materials for them in the electronics industry.  There's a lot of demand, and finite supply, and it'll likely be a while before supply and demand level out.