P-10F video at 100 yards with Apex parts

[Joe L]

I went back to the range today to shoot the P-10F again at 100 yards, this time I was expecting good results and I was not disappointed.  I shot a 2nd target but it wasn't any better than this one.  It will take a few more rounds before I am 100% comfortable with the new trigger feel.  Then I will have to make the same modifications to the S and C pistols.  I shot the C today also, but the zero was so far off after tightening up the red dot that I quit when I got it close at 25 yards.

https://youtu.be/J8Cz3GrAiXE

Joe L

[M1A4ME]

So, the Apex trigger.  Is it the rolling type of trigger pull (I think you said you liked)?  Or is more crisp with short reset, shorter trigger pull and a nice crisp break?  The Apex triggers I have on my M&P 2.0 pistols are awesome.

[NEKvermont]

Your shooting ability amazes me.

[Joe L]

Your shooting ability amazes me.

Thanks.  But I'm kind of a specialist since I retired.  I rarely shoot anything other than 9mm pistols at 100 yards, once or twice per week, roughly over the last 5 years.  That's a lot of rounds down range for one discipline, so I either had to get better, or get very frustrated. 

Fortunately for me, my eyesight is still pretty good.  I think I can continue to improve as long as my eyesight is OK.  I'm 75 years old, but I have 3k rounds of 9mm stockpiled, so maybe I can shoot all that up before I get too frustrated with the eyesight limitations.

Joe L

[Joe L]

So, the Apex trigger.  Is it the rolling type of trigger pull (I think you said you liked)?  Or is more crisp with short reset, shorter trigger pull and a nice crisp break?  The Apex triggers I have on my M&P 2.0 pistols are awesome.

As you well know, striker triggers are so different from a hammer trigger that they take some getting used to.  Fortunately for me, I always liked a slightly heavier trigger than most folks, even in a hammer gun, so the transition to the striker was not too bad for me.  I found that to be a pleasant surprise, as I was very skeptical when I first got the P-10C.

A CGW striker and a 4 lb Glock striker spring and retainers got the trigger pull down to something I could work with and that is all I had done to my three P-10's prior to trying the Apex disconnector.  But the C trigger was pretty good pre-Apex, the S was maybe a little smoother, and the F was still a little sticky, with a heavy wall and then a break.  I could shoot it OK, but it took a lot more thought.  I think the differences in the three pistols some down to tolerances and perhaps some production line changes on the trigger bars, there have been 5 or 6 variations from CZ on the trigger bars themselves.  (I was not aware of that prior to reading the instructions for the Apex parts.)

Changing that ramp angle smooths out the pull, but with more trigger travel so the break happens "later" in the pull but without any spike in the wall.  It may be that the trigger bar contact surface is also smoother at the new contact location than at the original and that may be another benefit with my particular F trigger bar.  So, with the Apex disconnector, I have a longer trigger pull but at constant pull pressure and a smooth break, rather than a clearly defined wall with a crisp break like I have with the C and S.  I'm thinking a lot of people would NOT like my trigger preferences, but I think I have demonstrated that I can release a shot without moving the gun, and that is what matters to me, not speed of a followup shot.

I'm also pretty much able to adapt to some poor triggers, at least for a short period of time.  But, if I am going to shoot one or two pistols for weeks on end, I want them to be "right" for me, in order to minimize the mental challenges, LOL.

Joe L

[M1A4ME]

Joe, I found out (after decades of believing differently) that an awesome trigger may not help you shoot a gun better (M&P 2.0 9MM 5").  The Apex Tactical trigger in a 2.0 is awesome.  However, the groups were no better.  My big thing, now with the M&Ps, is consistency one gun to the next.  I've got a 5" .40 S&S slide I built up from a stripped slide and put on the 2.0 9MM frame.  Every time I go to the range with the 5" .40 and the 4&1/4" Performance Center .40 the difference gets me.  The PC gun trigger really isn't "bad" but it's not in the same league as the Apex either and it costs me a shot when switching from one to the other shooting for groups with different ammo I'm trying out.

Funny you mention trigger bars.  Ran into similar with the M&Ps.  I have a 1.0 PC 9MM 5" I really like and want to shoot more but the groups just aren't there.  The Shields shoot better.  In the interest of making improvements to the 1.0 PC 9MM I ran across the trigger bar difference "thing."  It was an almost 10 lb. trigger pull at first.  I had it down to around 6.5 lbs.  It has a really nice crisp break and sear reset.  But 6.5 lbs??  I ran across some info about the "H" stamped trigger bars resulting in a heavier trigger pull.  Sure enough, mine had the "H" stamped trigger bar.  I ordered a non "H" stamped trigger bar and the trigger pull dropped to 4.5 lbs.  And I lost any feel or sound of the sear reset.  Gone.  Could no longer tell (even when holding it next to my ear to ease the slide forward after a dry fire trigger pull.)  Finally figured out how to get the feel and sound back with that new trigger bar.  Trial and error, sometimes.  Still way off from the Apex set up in the 2.0 guns but it's a 1.0 and it takes more work to reduce it further.

What is you say about the range sessions?  Fun, but not so easy (sometimes anyway).  Yeah, I could just shoot my P09 9MM for the groups.  But working on guns and loads is fun, too.