 Posts: 408 (02/28/2003 17:33:53) |
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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2003, 07:51:02 PM »
Actually, I have owned a Pre B, a SA, a Compact, several standard 75s still have a satin nickle. Obviously I like CZs very much. The pre B was totally reliable as were some of the standards, but the SA, compact and three of the standards have had slide stop and extraction problems. Easy enough to fix, but out of from a NIB gun a disappointment. Sorry if the truth is considered "bad mouthing." I don't mean to offend.
Bob.
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« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2003, 08:14:43 AM »
OK, "Bob G", nice to see you at least had something to say besides a bland one-line statement. Now, a couple questions:
Do you really think the problems the original poster had with his 85 were characteristic of "all to many CZ's?" Were there chunks of metal hanging from the inside of your guns? Were there "razor-sharp" edges everywhere? Given this guy's horrible machining on his 85, it seems like his other problems are easily accounted for. This gun was just a lemon. I'm sure CZ will replace something that out of whack.
If you were that disgusted with the out-of-box berformance of your CZ's, why did you buy so many? From what I read on your last post, you owned more CZ's than any other person I've ever come across. What was you "easy fix" for the extraction problems?
That's all. I'm sorry to be so rude, but I find it hard to believe one person has owned so many "bad CZ's" and continues to buy them and even call himself "someone who obviously likes CZ's very much". According to your post, it looks like 75% of the CZ's you had were bad. I WOULD NOT be a fan at that point. If I'm wrong, then I'm out of line and am sorry for my cynicism.
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n-75BDdude
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2003, 11:11:49 AM »
Hey I'm a solid CZ lover, but I'm batting 0 with my 2 CZ's. I first bought a 75BD that I had to fiddle with it for a month or so to get it to stop the premature slide lockback issue. Now.... partly that's my fault as it was most prevalent with my personally loaded ammo from my previous 9mm that had the bullet out a little far. (Although it DID occur with Rem UMC once also)
Then I bought a PCR. Before I took it to the range I had already modified the slide stop like what I did to the 75BD. But when I did finally take it out the only ammo it would shoot reliably was FMJ's. Hollow points gave me an average of 4 jams per magazine. I solved that by finding a bit of a burr at the top of the chamber on the barrel. So I chamfered the chamber slightly all around and polished judiciously. Now it feeds everything with no problem. Also the magazine follower would hang up in the PCR's 10 round mags when loading between the 4th and 5th round. I found it was the retaining slot in the off-side. The follower was hitting it and it was shaving material from the follower. I solved that by slightly chamfering the inside bottom of the slot with a diamond cut dremel bit.
Now, what does this mean? I personally LIKE doing this kind of work to my pistols. And I get personal satisfaction from doing some tweaks that turn it into an amazingly reliable weapon. But many of my shooting buddies aren't into attempting repairs on firearms and if they run into issues either get rid of it, or call me. I know quite a few people that want something they paid good money for to work right out of the box. Problem is... these little tweakings cost money in mass produced items and they drive the cost up considerably. The good thing is, most of my issues were related to a machining burr that would probably have worn away over time given enough usage.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, I can see how someone could develop the attitude that CZ's could be problematic if they are not into diagnosing their problems and also happen to get some that give issues early on. Many here have reported that their CZ's have never given any problems. And that is good. CZ makes many very good firearms but a few have issues. Just like EVERY other manufacturer.
But for the money, feel, accuracy, and ergonomics, I'LL TAKE MY CZ's ANY DAY !!! I personally don't feel there is a line of handguns on the market that can deliver the same balance of above criteria like the CZ 75 and it's brethren.
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« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2003, 12:49:58 PM »
I can't help wondering if the problem 85B was accidentally pulled off the production line and shipped before the final fit and finish was done. Perhaps at change of shift, or during a break, one worker left his station and another guy saw the gun and thought it was ready to go when it wasn't - something like that.
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« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2003, 07:39:31 PM »
Greetings fellow CZ addicts:
The easy fix for the extraction problems was to reverse the extractor spring. It was in backwards. Before the switch, the gun failed to extract about 10 percent of the time. The slide locking open with a mag full of ammo has been covered by others. In most cases, the slide stop has a little too much engagement surface.
I have bought many CZs and then either traded or sold them, but I always come back. I love the feel and accuracy, the 75 SA I had and my present satin nickle 75b rank among the most actuate handguns I have worked with including a Kimber Custom, and a few Sigs, so I like CZs, and I have been able to address the shortcomings. Nevertheless, The fact that so many fail to function properly out of the box makes me conclude that the problems have become all too typical. It's not just me. There are other threads about the shortcomings. The crude machining mentioned, however is atypical. I wonder how the people who call me a "Troller" can be so lucky as to have never had experienced these problems.
Happy shooting,
Bob.
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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2003, 09:27:36 PM »
Bob G-
My apologies. Both of my posts were rude and too harsh. I shouldn't question another person's situation as I did. The first post was what got me, but I can see that you are at least someone who cares enough about what they stated to follow up with the inquiries that myself and others have posted. And you were much nicer than anyone else was, to boot.
Once again, I'm sorry. I did EXACTLY to wrong thing to accuse. I hate it when others do this, and I just did it myself.
I'll have you know I administered twenty "wet noodle" lashings to my hands as penance. I'd hate to see this forum turn into bashing, and I'll make sure I don't do it again.
Mark
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« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2003, 10:33:56 PM »
I remember reading somewhere else in the forum how CZs are supposed to go through a rather involved function and fitting process, including being cycled many hundreds of times in an oil bath. That should take care of any metal flakes. But the real kicker here is that each gun is supposed to be test fired by a real person and the target included with the gun. (Was the target included with the 85B in question? or might that step have been overlooked too?) You'd think the such obvious flaws the original poster encountered would have been identified and fixed before being released from the factory. I know the vast majority of people who post to this forum are CZ fans, and may be more inclined to 'forgive' some of the flaws they encounter, but I really can't believe that quality control issues like the ones mentioned here are 'all too common'. Of course, I don't have any of CZ-USA's or CZ-UB's return merchandise/warranty frequency data either, so I have no supporting evidence either way. In any case, I appreciate hearing the good with the bad, and from what I can gather, its mostly good.  -iNJ
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« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2003, 02:24:10 PM »
If you place a picture the all dude will be clear.
HTD1
Miami FL
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