CZ97B as a carry/duty pistol?

[mighty-cherokee]

Anyone here use the 97B as their primary defence pistol? I know its big and might be harder to conceal but if you could,would you carry?
Also curious to know if any police or military  units use the 97B as a sidearm.

I often wonder why the CZ is not as popular as the Glocks,Sigs and HKs,i have already shot 200 rounds of assorted ammo through mine without any problems at all and so I decided it will be my new carry weapon.
Is my faith in the reliability of my 97 over-rated?(It took the place of my G21)

thanks in advance for any comments

[jwc007]

The PD's I interact with generally require a DA/SA handgun to have a decocker mechanism, for liability reasons.  In one PD, they have on their "Approved List", the CZ75BD, because it has a decocker.  The problem is that some LEO's are not "Manual of Arms" oriented, and a pistol that lacks a decocker mechanism presents a problem to them.

There is one agency I know of that might use a CZ97, because the Chief is a real dyed in the wool shooter, and he likes them.  However, he currently carries a Glock 21.

As for your choice in carry weapons, if you truly can conceal it, have faith in your ability to use it, have faith in it's reliability, by all means, carry it!  Hopefully, you will never need it!  Better to have and not need, than to need and not have!  Been there! (I didn't have!)

Fighting for Truth, Justice, and the last slice of Pizza!

[bullsi1911]

When I get mine, I will carry it.  No question about it.

[we00]

"The PD's I interact with generally require a DA/SA handgun to have a decocker mechanism, for liability reasons. "

I can understand this to a point, but what about SA only pistols?  None of those have decockers, yet they are used by some (perhaps not many) law enforcement agencies, or at least units within them.  As the 97B can be cocked and locked, how is it different from the SA only pistols?  

The obvious answer (IMO) is that the 97B can also be fired DA first shot.  Having a decocker doesn't prevent that, though.  

I'm a little confused by the logic of the PDs in question.  Can someone explain?

Thanks,
Wayne

[jwc007]

As you have observed there are some parts of agencies that allow SA Pistols w/o decockers.  Notably, FBI's HRT and various SWAT Teams.  There are some agencies that allow "Cocked & Locked" SA pistols for general LEO's, but they are exceedingly rare.  You have to understand that "Liability" risks are problems that Police Chiefs must concern themselves with.  And, that brings to mind that not all LEO's are "Manual of Arms" oriented.  Thus, a pistol that must be manually decocked for DA first shot operation is an accident waiting to happen, in some Police Chiefs mind, and their liability insurance isn't getting any cheaper.  Add this to the fact that the Lawyer Class (read "School of Sharks") will sue them over any possible angle.  Hence, we now have DAO pistols to keep those poor Felons from being "Accidentily" shot, while commiting a crime!  I know some LEO's who would like to carry a CZ or Witness, but it'll never happen with the agency they are with.  Not all LE agencies are this way, but they are usually small, and an exception to the rule.  Even the SWAT Team, in the town I live in, must carry a DAO pistol to back up either their M4's or H&K MP5's.  Hope this answers your question.

Fighting for Truth, Justice, and the last slice of Pizza!

[MN CZ]

Good question!
Just this past Friday I got my 97B approved as a duty weapon. Picked up an Uncle Mike's size 21 duty holster. Fits well. As for decocking, there were some safety issues that came up. Mainly decocking the weapon in a safe manner. I need to put my left thumb between the hammer and pin, pulling the trigger until it catches with the right index finger. As soon as it catches, I let go the of the trigger. Now she's in half-cock. The approving authority also had some concerns with me carrying in half-cock...

[Walt-Sherrill]

I suspect the reason that most police agencies REQUIRE that a gun have a decocker (if it can be cocked and left that way) is that police officers, far more frequently than civilians, tend to have to present their weapons, ready for use, in very stressful situations.  

Things are tense and adrenaline is pumping.  

Even if the action is over and no shots were fired, calm does not return immediately.  That is not a good time to try decocking a weapon if it doesn't have a decocker.

I think using only decockers, and DAO guns or weapons like Glocks that don't have the striker cocked until the trigger is pulled,  makes a lot of sense in the LEO world.

[we00]

Walt,

I agree with you about the Glock type guns.  My question, though, is why would the gun be cocked if no shots were fired (as you mentioned)?  The gun being a 97B of course, having the double action capability.  Wouldn't it be carried with the hammer down, or at half cock?  And, if this is the case, who needs a decocker?  

I still feel as though I'm missing something here.  Please feel free to enlighten me, anyone.

Wayne

[crt360]

I think it has to do with the fact that you can cock the 97B and leave it there, only to be uncocked by pulling the trigger.  Eliminating this possibility theoretically adds a little more safety and reduces liability.  It takes the burden off the individual officer presenting the weapon.  Even if the PD allowed 97Bs, but required them to be carried hammer down, some cop at some time is going cock it without thinking.  I had a LEO point a gun at me one time, and I wasn't doing a bleep thing wrong.  If you can make it a little harder for guys like that to accidently shoot innocent people, I'm all for it, even if they don't get to carry a 97B (which I own and like very much).

[Walt-Sherrill]

There are a lot of gun-savvy cops/sheriffs, etc.  But there seem to be many times more who shoot their weapons once every 3-6 months to maintain their LEO certification, and basically don't do much with their weapons in the interim.

Many (perhaps most) cops don't view their weapon as central to their work.  Darn few LEOs are gun enthusiasts.   Most view their guns as a tool, like their flashlights, to be used as needed, but only when needed.

(One of my friends is one of the best competitive shooters I know; he's a deputy sheriff.  My son is a cop and a reasonably good shot.  They both are into guns, but they are exceptions; neither one of their departments makes practicing easy.)

Given that, most police administrators aim for the lowest common denominator, and do what they can to avoid POTENTIAL screwups.  (Our local police and my son's department require the use of DAO pistols, for example.)

[skucera]

I'm not a LEO, but I've watched them on TV, and spoken to dozens that my dad worked with over the years.  

Decockers come in handy not only after a stressful confrontation where a shot may have been fired, but also in routine situations like loading up when going on duty and unloading when getting off duty.  After the very rare incident where a shot has been fired, simplicity of opertation is a real plus... adreniline is pumping and lots of things are going on, and decocking a weapon may be routine, but difficult without a negligent discharge. However, every day pistols are loaded up in the locker room, and many PD's require a test firing into a bullet trap and decocking before holstering the weapon.  (This is USCG routine, and also routine for my little city's PD here in Oregon.)  PD's without a bullet trap just have officers loading up in the locker room and decocking before holstering.  Likewise, in many PD's the weapons are unloaded and decocked before being cleaned and stored at the end of the shift (for those PD's where LEO's don't just take their weapons home with them at the end of the shift).  Also, LEO's need to load up and decock whenever they finish practice at the local pistol range, and that happens quite frequently, depending on the PD's budget and training requirements.

I'm sure there are lots of other reasons.  It also doesn't stop lots of PD's from allowing LEO's to carry cocked and locked, although, it has been awhile since I last saw a 1911 in anyone's holster, come to think of it.

Scott

[Uncle Alvah]

I'm not LE. I'm not military. Essentially, I'm a woodsman. My 97b is a constant companion, in the woods or not. In earlier days, a woodsman was perfectly outfitted with a .22 or other small caliber revolver. That person often spent long hours,days, even weeks in the woods. Todays woodsmen are different. Theres times I'm between woods and town several times a day. Schedules can  be that way. And a suitable woods gun is no longer a suitable civilization gun. So these days, for me, its the 97b I'll be carrying, thanks. I do also, I might mention, carry a very small .22, particulary when trapping.

[woodchip]

Since michigan instituted relaxed ccw laws, the 97B was my choice for carry. I carry it everyday and most of the time I don't notice the weight...guess I've just got used to it. Got a F.I.S.T. holster that was handboned to the 97. Use it for carry and league shoots. while some may not like the weight of the 97, I figure worst come to worse and I can always beat a attacker with it if I run out of ammo

[Fordzilla]

I'm going to be working on an article on the CZ-97 specifically in the role of a duty pistol.  If I can sell it to the rangemaster, I'll be allowed to carry it. Getting a duty holster for it seems to be a hurdle.
   I figure that if the CZ-97 sample I recieve lives up to the expectations painted by the members here, letting the rangemaster shoot some of the tests might sell him on it.  
    I intend to carry cocked and locked, just as I do my 1911s, so a decocker is of no consequence.
   I'll keep you posted guys.

[BRASMAN]

Thats great. I would think the 97 would be a deturant in its self because it is a big beefy pistol and the front of it looks pretty mean. I would hate to be looking at it from that end if I was a bad guy. LOL